Investing in Turnkey? You need to know these 3 things!

Investing in Turnkey? You need to know these 3 things!

Specialist · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 670 posts · 352 votes

I spend many hours a week consulting with potential turnkey investors. I am happy to spend this time, but I can't reach everyone. So let's keep this as short and sweet as possible. 

If your looking to invest in real estate and looking at turnkey investing as a viable option, you need to be aware of a few potential pitfalls. Turnkey real estate can get a negative stigma, due mostly to shady and poor operators who take advantage of new investors. If you're one of these operators, send me a direct message so I can begin the process of shutting your business down. With that said, turnkey rental properties can be a good investment for passive investors. If you have time to pursue flips, house hack, etc. you can do better. No doubt about it. However, if you're a passive investor that wants to own property and collect monthly cash flow with no time commitment, then turnkey can work. I can get into the reasons to pursue turnkey, but this post is meant for those who are actively committed to this investment model. 

For those aspiring Turnkey Investors out there... here's the first 3 potential pitfalls. 

1. Track Record. Find a turnkey provider that has a long (several years) track record. Anyone can spin the numbers on a year of business to make it look solid. 

2. C- and D class properties. Do not buy this asset class. These are properties in the war zones. They were purchased for $5-8K by the providers, rehabbed and are being sold to you at $30K. Imagine the areas these houses are located in, imagine the types of tenants these homes will attract. The numbers look great on paper, but stay in them long enough and they'll eat into your cash flow in no time.

3. In-house property management. Find a provider that has in-house property management or property management very closely vertically integrated into their business. Why? Accountability. A provider that does not own their own property management can pass the house on to a third party property manager after they sell to you and their hands are washed. Poor rehabs, not their problem anymore. Unqualified tenants. Again, not their problem after they move on from it. This is key!

That's a weight off my chest! 

Happy to provide more details if needed, but I wanted to make sure new investors knew what they were getting into and off to the right start.

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Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
9y

Those 3 are good. From my research, I might also add a couple more. 

Check the numbers presented on rentfaxpro. Remember the actual national average for PM is 14% with lease up fees etc. Vacancy rates are known to the 10th of percent, so if you see a flat 5% presented I can assure you that is not the actual and might be 13.5% in reality. 

Get someone or 3rd party to double check that hood if you can not visit personally. I would say near 50% of these might be in declining hoods. I know some of these marketers would not even get out of their car if they were in person. Good luck!

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  • Investor · Herriman, UT · Member since 2017 · 79 posts · 60 votes
    9y

    @Jeff Wallenius thank you! I was just researching this today and your post has clarified many things for me!  I appreciate your input!!

    Coco

  • Specialist · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 670 posts · 352 votes
    9y

    @Coco Zuniga your very welcome. There's obviously more to dig into but this hopefully will get investors off to a good start. I'm always free to assist as well.

  • Real Estate Investor · Encinitas, CA · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    9y
    Jeff Wallenius 4. Buying a property sight unseen... 😬
  • Investor · Cypress, TX · Member since 2016 · 170 posts · 139 votes
    9y

    @Jeff Wallenius  You pretty much nailed it. Agree, Agree, Agree 

  • Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 97 posts · 55 votes
    9y
    Great post. I am talking a trip down this road now, and hadn't considered the effect of #3 yet. That's a great insight. Thank you for sharing.
  • Equity Raiser and Turnkey Provider · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Jeff Wallenius:

    I spend many hours a week consulting with potential turnkey investors. I am happy to spend this time, but I can't reach everyone. So let's keep this as short and sweet as possible. 

    If your looking to invest in real estate and looking at turnkey investing as a viable option, you need to be aware of a few potential pitfalls. Turnkey real estate can get a negative stigma, due mostly to shady and poor operators who take advantage of new investors. If you're one of these operators, send me a direct message so I can begin the process of shutting your business down. With that said, turnkey rental properties can be a good investment for passive investors. If you have time to pursue flips, house hack, etc. you can do better. No doubt about it. However, if you're a passive investor that wants to own property and collect monthly cash flow with no time commitment, then turnkey can work. I can get into the reasons to pursue turnkey, but this post is meant for those who are actively committed to this investment model. 

    For those aspiring Turnkey Investors out there... here's the first 3 potential pitfalls. 

    1. Track Record. Find a turnkey provider that has a long (several years) track record. Anyone can spin the numbers on a year of business to make it look solid. 

    2. C- and D class properties. Do not buy this asset class. These are properties in the war zones. They were purchased for $5-8K by the providers, rehabbed and are being sold to you at $30K. Imagine the areas these houses are located in, imagine the types of tenants these homes will attract. The numbers look great on paper, but stay in them long enough and they'll eat into your cash flow in no time.

    3. In-house property management. Find a provider that has in-house property management or property management very closely vertically integrated into their business. Why? Accountability. A provider that does not own their own property management can pass the house on to a third party property manager after they sell to you and their hands are washed. Poor rehabs, not their problem anymore. Unqualified tenants. Again, not their problem after they move on from it. This is key!

    That's a weight off my chest! 

    Happy to provide more details if needed, but I wanted to make sure new investors knew what they were getting into and off to the right start.

    This is exactly what I always say. You need to find a provider that does everything under one roof. They should; own the property, renovate the property, AND manage the property. None of this third party business. People throw the word "turnkey" around not really understanding the model.

  • Specialist · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 670 posts · 352 votes
    9y

    @Andrew Johnson yes, this is why you must have trustworthy and proven teams that you choose to work with. Every investor should fly out and see the market and the specific properties. Unfortunately that isn't always feasible. Great point though!

  • Real Estate Investor · Encinitas, CA · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    9y
    Jeff Wallenius Whew, you have way more faith that I do! :) If I couldn't afford a plane ticket or the time to see a property personally there's no way I'd buy. I'd be hoping (taking a very educated guess) that I was buying a revenue generating asset but I'm *guaranteed* to be acquiring debt. There's not a chance I'm incurring a $100K debt without laying my own two eyes on the asset. Or maybe I'm becoming the old and bitter guy who lacks faith in people :)
  • Daniel P.Pro Member
    Investor · Winchester, VA · Member since 2017 · 104 posts · 70 votes
    9y

    Nice read! I have considered doing turnkey but opted not to since I like to be kind of hands on. Instead I have learned to be patient to find a deal that I think is worthwhile. 

  • Specialist · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 670 posts · 352 votes
    9y

    @Andrew Johnson I'm right there with you. For me I jump the flight every time, and actually will be making the Midwest tour on Monday. I do know many investors that don't make the trip prior to purchasing, and that was more of what I was referencing. For those investors, they need an ally and a strong team they can trust. It's sad in today's society that we have to verify everything one says. 

    Old bitter guy, that's funny, and I can definitely relate!

  • Real Estate Investor · Encinitas, CA · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    9y
    Jeff Wallenius You make a great point about trust. I trust my PM isn't scamming me when they say a hot water heater broke. I trust that my PM gives me good guidance about the appropriate rent level. I trust my PM when she says that upgrading the countertops will yield no rent increase. And that's all after watching way too many episodes of American Greed. I even trust her to tell me what NOT to buy. I just don't trust her to tell me what to buy! Or maybe I can't just wrap my head around buying something site unseen from someone who will earn a commission/profit. I think I've just visited one too many properties where after 2 minutes driving around a neighborhood I pass on a deal that looks good on paper. Or I walk through a unit that looks great in pictures but even my eyes can see signs of water damage in person. Yup, I'm becoming the old, bitter, curmudgeon of BiggerPockets...
  • Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    Those 3 are good. From my research, I might also add a couple more. 

    Check the numbers presented on rentfaxpro. Remember the actual national average for PM is 14% with lease up fees etc. Vacancy rates are known to the 10th of percent, so if you see a flat 5% presented I can assure you that is not the actual and might be 13.5% in reality. 

    Get someone or 3rd party to double check that hood if you can not visit personally. I would say near 50% of these might be in declining hoods. I know some of these marketers would not even get out of their car if they were in person. Good luck!

  • Clayton MobleyPro Member
    Birmingham, AL · Member since 2014 · 875 posts · 947 votes
    9y

    As usual, I'm 100% in agreement with @Jeff Wallenius. I always recommend people fly out to view the property, and just as important, meet the people who will be responsible for your investment. For those for whom that is simply not possible, however, a quick drive around Google Earth using the address of a property you're considering can answer more questions than you'd think. I saw a marketer advertising a property in Birmingham as an A+ property, in an area I know from experience is C+/B. Plunk the address into Google Earth and the first thing you see is overgrown lawns and pickups with mismatched doors, peeling paint and sagging gutters. As an out of state investor, it's hard to know the markets you invest in even if you do visit, so I recommend taking a virtual stroll around the neighborhood as a quick and easy way to weed out the time wasters. 

    Nothin beats seeing it with your own eyes, but you can easily get the next best thing through the unknowable magic of the internet ;)

  • Investor/RE Broker · Eugene, OR · Member since 2014 · 3k+ posts · 968 votes
    9y

    I agree  @Jeff Wallenius , but along with other's additions I would add " responsive communication."  How and how quickly a provider responds to investor/owner inquires, and how transparent they are in their operations, will tell you a lot about their systems, including property management and how they respond to tenants. 

  • Real Estate Coach · Venice Beach, CA · Member since 2012 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    9y

    Hey Jeff! How have we not met before? (or have we?). It's not often I find someone who will tell it like it is with turnkeys, and I love your 3 tips. From one turnkey advisor to another- I approve! :)

  • Flipper/Rehabber · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2015 · 204 posts · 89 votes
    9y

    @Jeff Wallenius thanks for the post, I learned something from that.

  • Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2016 · 6 posts · 0 votes
    9y

    Informative and spirited post, I like it!  Great place to start!  

    Now about good potential opportunities in the Charlotte, NC area.  Any pointers on local providers there - that meet Jeff's base criteria? 

  • Investor · Doha, Qatar · Member since 2016 · 11 posts · 6 votes
    9y

    Thank you totally agree. This is a challenge for overseas investors

  • Specialist · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 670 posts · 352 votes
    9y

    @Hosnah Agban let me know if you need assistance, I would be happy to help.

  • Specialist · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 670 posts · 352 votes
    9y

    @Fauzia Jomes I don't have an operator in that are, let me know if you come across one as we're always looking for great partnerships.

  • Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2016 · 6 posts · 0 votes
    9y

    Sounds good @Wes Wallenius

  • Investor · Loudoun, VA · Member since 2017 · 12 posts · 1 vote
    9y

    So, I'm a day old to this wonderful BP forum and doing a lot of reading. I'd been eyeing some properties (through turnkey prop managers) in CLT. Problem is whenever I see these properties on Zillow, Google Earth, etc, I hesitate investing into them. Only coz it generally goes against my own rule of investing into locations where schools, etc isn't good. While the Cap rate does look pretty decent (around 9-12%) or there might be appreciation, other factors scare me. 

    How do you overcome that? Or how I do learn to overcome that :) Would love some guidance on this...

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