All Forum Posts by: Ryan Vienneau

Funny you mention the water, I used to be a sales rep for Culligan for years and can tell you just about everything that's in the water by street name in most of the capital region!  The muni water supplies in Amsterdam, Clifton Park, Schenectady and the surrounding suburbs of Schenectady are all horrendously hard, which can be fixed with a water softener, which is an expense and something to maintain but nothing major, but as Michael mentioned if a house has never had one, the pipes could be shot already.  Same goes for chlorine, some supplies are highly chlorinated which eats rubber seals, but that can be fixed with a carbon filter.  Again, an expense and a pain, but nothing major.  I can't tell you how many times I would get calls from landlords looking for help because their water was so bad the tenants were complaining, but most landlords don't want the upfront expense of treating the water and instead pay WAY more later when the pipes, toilets, appliances, etc. are destroyed.

Troy is known for having very good water, and Saratoga's ok.  Wells around here are another story, I'd say 3/4 of the well water in the capital region has either sulfur, clay, methane, or a combination of those 3 which are very costly and difficult to treat, and also there are lots of areas that have wells 1500' deep and still can't get 1 gal per minute supply.  

Hi Kara,

Without getting into a ton of the details of the property itself and expenses, based on a couple rudimentary rules-of-thumb it sounds worth investigating further:

1. The 2% Rule - Your rents are 2.5% the sell price, which is good, you've probably seen on here that 2% is a good minimum to shoot for.  

2. Cap Rate - If you assume (which you shouldn't, you should find out for sure...) that expenses will run at 50% of your rents, that leaves you $9k NOI/year ($750/mo x 2 units x 12mos x 50%). $9k/$60k = 15% Cap rate, which most investors would be pretty proud of.

HOWEVER, there are several other numbers and metrics you'll want to know before jumping in, particularly cash-flow and cash-on-cash return which requires you to factor in your financing method and costs.  Beyond that, obviously you'll want to more deeply dig into the expenses, taxes, condition, etc, but based purely on the ration of rents to purchase price, it sounds like a deal worth looking further into.  

And by the way, knowing Amsterdam, TRIPLE CHECK the tax numbers with the city, don't rely on the seller or the agent's numbers, Amsterdam taxes are notoriously high and can kill your profitably in a hurry if you're not careful.  Good luck!

Hi Adam,

Welcome aboard!  I'm also in the Albany area and new to the forum, see you around.

@Tim Griffiths

Schenectady is a weird investment twilight zone not for the faint of heart, I live 10 mins from there and am constantly tempted by the decent instant cash flow you can get from the super cheap multi family's there, but @Steve B. is 100% correct in that you'll probably never sell it for a profit, if at all.  

Earlier this summer I nearly bought 2 separate 2 family properties near the casino, they were each priced around $50k, well maintained, fully rented at $650/unit, AND the owner was willing to do 100% seller financing.  Probably anyone on BP would consider those financials a no-brainer, but the guy STILL couldn't manage to sell those properties with those terms and took them off the market a couple months ago.  Regardless of the cash flow you can get in Schenectady, I just can't stomach the lack of liquidity, it feels like putting money into a 401k that you just have to assume is inaccessible for the next 20+ years.  

In Oswego, I'd opt for college areas that are insulated from the layoff, or you're within striking distance of Syracuse and the surrounding suburbs, I'm always all for sticking near home and what you know.  

I know Averill Park fairly well, I went to RPI, my wife grew up in Troy and my mother-in-law lives in Albia (off Pawling), and my full time job is in Castleton.  

Rensselaer county also has notoriously high taxes, nowhere near as bad as Schenectady but above average.  It's also developed a reputation along with Wynantskill and Sand Lake for having a well-publicized heroine problem, not sure if its affected the market much but beware if you're planning on landlording.  

Overall, that rural area southeast of Troy is good for buyers/renters looking to live in the country but still be within striking distance of Troy or Albany, but I'd probably pick N. Greenbush as the suburb of choice in Rensselaer county, Averill Park would probably be my 2nd pick though.  

Hi Austin, I live about 10 mins from where the casino is being built (Ballston Lake) and have been wondering the same.  Overall, Schenectady is always tempting because purchase prices are so low, but the taxes are so ridiculous it's hard to get anything to appreciate there.  I was very close this summer to buying 2 duplexes one block over from the casino that were $50k each, fully rented, but the taxes were like $6k. The only way I see Schenectady being worthwhile is if the casino brings taxes down, then landlord profits and home values will rise overnight, but there's a lot of debate as to whether or not that will happen, and Schenectady has somewhat of a reputation for being corrupt, so I don't want to speculate there personally, but it could be a gamble that pays off.

Thanks for the kind words everyone!  This website is awesome, it's so cool to get that many replies so quickly from people familiar with the area.  The Global Foundries thing has been good and bad, several developers WAY overbuilt rentals on spec so there's a lot of high end inventory in Saratoga and Malta at the moment, but they're so ludicrously overpriced I don't see them being able to hold prices forever.  

My brother in law just moved out of the new complex by Kohl's in Wilton, he was renting a 600 sq ft, 1 br 1 ba apartment in there for $1400/mo, and that did not include a garage space.  He hated it, he could hear people talking through the walls on both sides of him, and he lived on the 2nd floor but still got woken up every morning when the basement garage doors would open and close.   It was also impossible to fit a couch through the door because the hallway turned 90 degrees as soon as you walked through the door, whoever designed that in a brand new building should be fired.  Also, anyone who understands construction could see the apartments are cheaply built, but Saratoga renters are suckers for granite and stainless and that's all you need to charge insane rents up there it seems.  Overall, Saratoga is a little pretentious for my taste, I prefer a more blue collar tenant that doesn't call me for a light bulb change.

Colonie is very desirable and deals can be had, as are Delmar, Guilderland, and that area south of Albany.  Troy has had quite the downtown Rennaisance, several friends are investing there, but within 2 blocks of the desirable areas are still major drug activity and shootings, so I'm not quite sold.  You can buy 4plex converted mansions in Schenectady county for $80k, as long as you don't mind paying $12k/yr taxes (I do mind!).  

Overall, the suburbs just south and north of Albany are the investor sweet spots I think.

Hi All!  I'm an investor living in the greater Albany NY area (Ballston Lake, near Saratoga).  I bought my first house when I was 21, a distressed 2-family that I lived in while repairing and had renters paying 2/3 of the mortgage.  I sold the property after 4 years at a surprising profit, bought a single family home as our primary residence (also distressed) and intended on purchasing more rentals/flips immediately, but that happened to be around 2008 when all the lenders vanished overnight so that got put on hold.  Then came marriage, baby, new job, and various other typical excuses that prevented me from making the jump back into real estate, but now I'm back and making the plunge!  

Thanks to all for the great posts on here, I've been a reader and student of BP for years.

I'm a long time reader but first time poster to BP, I can usually find answers to any question by searching the forums but I can't find an answer to this one:

So, I managed to convince a few family and friends to invest in me to do my first flip, and my pitch to them was similar to hard money terms, 10% interest-only for up to 12 months paid monthly.  How do I write up these docs so that they are legal, binding, and irs compliant?  My intent is not to protect me as much as it is to protect my investors, and in so doing they will see my venture is professional and accountable and will be encouraged to refer additional investors.  Are there templates or examples of the necessary paperwork out there?  Do I need to have them drawn up by a lawyer (ugh)?  Is there software that can do it?  I got the investors to say "yes" which I'm pretty sure is usually the hard part, now I need to know how to make it happen on paper.

Any suggestions?  Thanks!!!