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All Forum Posts by: Terra Padgett

Terra Padgett has started 9 posts and replied 65 times.

Post: Seeking Input on My First Real Estate Investment Strategy for Passive Income

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83

If you're trying to be passive and do SFH, then a turnkey provider in a market you select would likely be a better option. It's imperative to find the right team if investing from afar. So your boots on the ground contractors, property managers, realtors, etc. No matter which route you take, you'll certainly learn things along the way which will help in your next deal and decision.

Post: A Great Property Manager is Sooo Important

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83

Landlording certainly has its challenges. A great Property Manager can make all the difference. 5 years in, I’m still unimpressed with any of them that I’ve come across. I see why a lot of people elect to self-manage because finding a reliable, capable, professional PM who keeps their incentives aligned with their investors is a rarity in this space. Do you agree or disagree? How have your 3rd party managers performed for you on a scale of 1-10?

Post: How Much Time Do you Typically Spend on your Property when you HAVE a Property Manage

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83

Landlording or Direct Property Ownership (PM in place or not) is NOT all that passive. With a PM, it can become semi-passive, but your duties are more managing the manager to ensure they are keeping your best interest at the forefront. The spectrum of PM and their level of "good" is so broad. You really just have to interview a few and trust someone. Give them a year and re-evaluate their performance. It's your property so it's discretionary to what YOU think is a good job or not. From my experience, the heavier interaction with a PM comes about when their is a larger maintenance issue or tenant didn't pay rent. Regardless of a PM or Self-Managing, Rental Properties are not a truly passive investment. I prefer to invest my dollars in private equity placements, notes, funds, etc by way of investment clubs. When you group invest, you still get the same benefits as direct ownership (cash flow, appreciation, tax benefits, etc) with a lot less Landlording Headaches. Our club, Power Pool Fund, has been a game changer for our passive investing goals. Check it out...

Post: Landlording is Not All That Passive

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83
Quote from @Kristi K.:
Quote from @Terra Padgett:

You always hear about rental properties as passive income. Well I totally disagree. Even with PM in place, there are still many active activities when it comes to direct property ownership. Yes, it does take several tasks off your plate, but it is NOT “truly” passive. When it comes to your rentals, do you agree or disagree?

Ok, it's not "truly" passive. I got 19 text messages in 2023 for 17 rental properties within 15 miles of our house. I had to drive to 3 of them to meet the tree guys but the other 16 were "call the plumber" or "call the AC guy" and one "call the electrician". We saved $28,000 in PM fees by doing this and I spent less than 2 days total managing it all, plus a day this week to prepare the paperwork for the CPA. If it was "truly" passive I wouldn't have gotten a single text and I wouldn't have had to prepare for the CPA. Would I rather trust my money with a fund that promises me 8% maybe, no way......

 Thanks for sharing your experiences. If you're only seeing or looking at 8% returns from someone's fund, then we need to connect to open your pool of opportunities. lol. Personally, I've found the $250-$400 (or whatever) per month in rental property cash flow not enough for the task at hand. You're just creating another job for yourself. Of course every market and deal may vary, so I'm just throwing out some average numbers, but the juice isn't worth the squeeze for so-called passive income. And don't let an eviction, vacancy, property damage, capex or anything of the sort hit; cash flow wiped out for the year and then some possibly.  

Post: Landlording is Not All That Passive

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83
Quote from @Gustavo Delgado:

There is nothing passive about being a landlord. Nothing.. Sometimes I think about selling my properties and putting those funds into REIT like realty income (O) and collect a monthly dividen.


Yep! There are A LOT of ways to invest your money into real estate without being a direct owner of rental properties. You discover which investment best fits your desires and run with it. We've divested several properties and re-deployed that capital into private equity placements and promissory notes via our REI club, Power Pool Fund. It's by far been a much more pleasant experience than Landlording. The properties we still have give me angst every month. lol...

Post: Landlording is Not All That Passive

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83
Quote from @Steve Vaughan:
Quote from @Terra Padgett:

The biggest advantage I found to RE investing is control.  Control the acquisition,  reposition, operation, leversge and disposition, 

Lose control? No way.   Investing as a club into a fund is lack of control squared, bloated with fees.  No say, no liquidity, no way.  

I'd rather invest in a public REIT. At least that would offer liquidity and cost efficiency.


If that's your jig, then have at it. If you want to be an Operator & work work work with All the control, then be my guest. That just becomes your day job (and nights and weekends too...lol) But if you're trying to earn Passive returns in real estate, especially with assets that have higher potential ROIs, then handing over control to those with experience in the field is just wiser IMO. The intent is not to invest with any and every "GP" on the block, but so is not renting a SFH to any tenant that applies. Yes, your funds are illiquid for a time, but real estate is the long game anyways. A public REIT tracks waaaay too closely with the stock market and provides very minimal diversification from the market.

Thanks for your thoughts

Post: Landlording is Not All That Passive

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83
Quote from @Steve Vaughan:

As the blunt but knowledgeable @Thomas S used to say, "There's no such thing as a retired landlord!"

I self-managed all for 17 years, then 1031 consolidated half and left the seller's PM in place. 

I could not believe the stupidity of their repair decisions and high costs. The 10% PM fee talked about all the time is complete bs even before including fill or renewal fees. Then it's 16% minimum. 

I fired them from doing several tasks (like laundry room collection- $75 to collect $30 x3) dealing with garbage disposals or maintaining the 70s style 4ft flourescent lights in kitchens. 

I was getting $150 balast repair bills and they were driving to stores for cover replacements at $40/hr.  (Instead of upgrading to the $25 LED fixtures I had in storage) 

They summoned licensed pros for every small one-off thing, including swapping light fixtures, wall heaters and changing toilet flappers. 

So continue doing it myself to not go Bk or sell?  I tapped out in '22. The market was good and I was sick of being the only one who could manage expenses effectively,   I do not regret reducing my RE 90%. 


 I can totally relate to your Ownership pain points. Been there myself. We even sold off several of our properties as well. #TiredLandlord. But understanding how RE is still one of the tried and true investment vehicles, we just decided to do it a different way. We began investing those dollars with our investment club in commercial syndications, promissory notes, funds, etc. We still maintain the profit centers that SFRs have (cash flow, appreciation, taxes, etc), but we now take our manual labor out of the equation. There are pros & cons with both and it truly boils down to what each individuals goals & passions are, but I've found that investing in the syndication model and group investing with a club is by far much more my speed for passive income. 

Post: Landlording is Not All That Passive

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83
Quote from @Denis Ponder:

I think it really depends on what people mean when they say passive.  I would agree that landlording is not a completely hands off, set it and forget it type of activity.  However, I don't know if that is what everyone means when they say passive.

I try to evaluate it from a time vs money relationship.  My current W2 is active, that's my baseline.  Anything that can earn me money with a disproportionate (lower) time investment is more passive than my W2.  From there, it's about finding ways to increase that income and decrease the time investment.  My life and my earnings are getting more and more passive.  It's more of a continuum and journey.

People pay me to stay at my places and I don't have a daily list of tasks/activities I have to show up and complete for that to happen.  If most of the "work" can be done from my couch on a phone, that's pretty passive to me.

I get that some people choose to do much of the work themselves (PM, handyman, etc), and that will make it less passive.  But, to me, it's still far more passive than a 40+ hr/wk W2.


 You bring up a good point Denis. "Passive" may mean different things to different people. Passive could be how Fidelity or Mass Mutual manages our company 401k investments (basically No involvement). Or Passive could be how I may manage my personal brokerage portfolio (I have to review & make trades.) Passive could be checking in a couple times a year on your rental properties. I think I would say a general definition for me would be spending no more than 1 day a year or 24 total  hours a year "working" on that investment for it to generate me a return. Not a concrete number, but in general. 

Post: Best strategy for high W2 income earner?

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83

I'd suggest you look into investing in real estate with an Investment Club. There are stock clubs, but I'm referring to Real Estate Investment Clubs. These clubs are usually made up of a group of individuals that want to grow their capital passively. They meet to discuss various educational topics, network, & review deals to potentially invest in. They pool their capital together to invest as one single entity in projects. They could be equity or debt positions; new builds, value-adds, funds, rentals, promissory notes, etc. I lead one called Power Pool Fund. You'll learn a ton and really start creating passive income streams to complement any active income things you like to do. 

Post: Landlording is Not All That Passive

Terra Padgett
Professional Services
Posted
  • Investor
  • Houston, Tx
  • Posts 66
  • Votes 83
Quote from @Evan Polaski:

@Terra Padgett, passive is really in the eye of the beholder, unless you are talking IRS definition; then, it is defined as passive.

As you will see here, some people simply want the "freedom" of not being bound to their corporate job and a desk.  But when anyone gets to the scale of owning enough rentals to actually make a living, I think they learn that they simply traded one job for another, often harder, job.

As far as syndications go, they are only somewhat more passive than owning rentals, and I think it really depends on your mentality and attitude toward them. Just like all real estate, they are not a silver bullet to grow your wealth. You are clearly giving up a lot of control to a group that will ultimately make decisions that may not align with yours. Unfortunately, syndications are a lot like Airbnbs: they are all called the same thing, but the experience you have will vary widely. And most of the return is going to be driven by market conditions, regardless of how good or bad an operator is. But the same can be said about buying a SFR.

Things no single person/company can control: rents, interest rates, supply and demand. You/the company can make bets and predictions that may turn out alright in the end, but they could go the other way on you too. And as we are seeing, the cost of a miss in a syndication is just a lot bigger than the cost of a miss in a SFR. So given a syndication is needed because the GP, presumably, cannot fill out the capital stack for a $20mm-$100mm deal on their own, when that miss happens, it often needs to be born by the LPs, either by selling for a loss, or capital call. A single family, if the buyer uses all their money to acquire, will result in the same thing, but only the buyer has to bear that burden.


 That is why I invest in syndications with an investment club. One is able to spread their risk across many deals and not have all of their investment capital tied up into one single deal. Loss of capital may occur in both scenarios, but you limit your liability &/or losses as an LP. You'll also have a greater learning curve being a Landlord and fingers crossed those learning lessons don't wipe you out. Thanks for sharing your thoughts