All Forum Posts by: Sean OToole

@Daniel Evans I primarily say it because I assume your goal is to make a profit. That's easier to do when there is equity. Not impossible to do it when there isn't equity if you can get the bank to discount in a short sale, but that is definitely harder. So I always recommend starting with equity first.

@Ikjot Gill The tool you are already using has "batch skip tracing" built in. As good as any other service out there. It also has the ability to pull lists 100% as good as any you could pull from Listsource, or any other service, and is actually far better when it comes to foreclosures. As such it would be a huge waste of time and money to also buy those services when you already have them. Also, you'll get a far poorer Facebook / Google match rate with that approach, then with the tool you are already using, as it also matches on hashed emails, as well as phones, and addresses. I guarantee, there isn't a better way to do it, then with what you already have.

@Ikjot Gill, no, if you are just starting out, I do not recommend direct mail. What I said was that it can be very effective if you really know your audience and have a compelling, differentiated, message.

Having a compelling differentiated message is actually the key to consistent lead flow for any method. I personally think the best way to get to know your audience, and develop that message, is by door knocking and talking to people in person. I think that is was Brett and Sam were also saying, which is why I said it was the most effective.

Here are my recommendations for you:

1. Schedule a demo with our support team. Sounds like you are already using our service, but it doesn't sound like you really yet know how to use it. They can show you a ton of options including an answer to your Facebook question.

2. Do some door knocking. I know it sucks, but you will learn a lot, a lot faster than you will with cold calling, online ads, ringless voicemail, email, or any other method. Why? Because in person feedback will help you figure out what to say (or not say) to get a deal/listing.

3. Once you have a message that is working in person, then try it by phone. Keep your expectations low, most folks in foreclosure aren't going to answer their phone. Expect to make a lot of calls. But it's faster than door knocking, and can be as effective - IF you already have a good pitch.

4. Once phone is working, then move on to ringless voicemail, online ads, direct mail, etc with that same message. This works to help you scale, but only if you have a great message.

Expect a learning curve with each step. Expect each step to kind of suck for a while and be really hard. Don't say it doesn't work until you've knocked 100 doors, made 200 calls, or had your online ad reach thousands or tens of thousands of potential customers. Only a small percentage will ever respond - even if you have the right phone number for every one of them.

My investor customers have purchased $40B+ in real estate, and my agent customers have likely listed a similar amount (harder to track so I don't know for sure). The folks that succeed with rare exception do some variation of what I outlined above. The one's that don't succeed, bought into a bunch of get rich quick, easy button, b.s., and never really worked hard enough to have a chance.

@Pedro Salcedo regarding number 3 it has nothing to do with what is profitable or not. If the property is "listed" for sale, that means the seller has signed an agreement through which they will pay the commission. And if you buy that house while it is listed, the seller is going to pay the commission no matter what (there are technically some exceptions depending on the type of listing agreement, but they are rare, and aren't a likely opportunity for you to save money). So the point is that there is NO REASON, and really NO WAY to buy a listed property without an agent (at least the sellers agent).

One thing that may help you negotiate a SLIGHTLY better deal on listed properties is to contact the sellers agent directly, rather than using your own agent. Two reasons: 1) the sellers agent will likely work a little harder to make sure you get the house as they will get the full commission, and 2) the seller may have negotiated a smaller fee if their agent also represents the buyer, leaving a little bit more money on the table. For example it is not uncommon for the agreed commission to be 6% (3% to sellers agent, 3% to buyers agent) if each represented separate, and for it to be only 4% if the selling agent represents both parties.

That said, for a maximum savings of 2%, I'd venture you'd be better off with your own agent. You may save more by leveraging their market knowledge and their time to be constantly on the lookout for deals. The seller is paying their fee anyway, might as well get the help.

If you really want a shot at saving money on the purchase price, then you should be looking for off-market properties. Yes foreclosures and tax sales are a possibility, but there are lots of other possibilities as well.

@Brian Sparr thanks for the mention!

@Ikjot Gill, are you trying each of the numbers we provide? We've done a comparison against all the other popular skip tracing services, and I'd be really surprised if you found better numbers elsewhere. We've never gotten a complaint that "most of the numbers are outdated". I suggest you contact our support team as you may just need help with using our service. That said, folks in foreclosure are often difficult to reach by phone as they are often actively avoiding debt collection. Just because you have their number doesn't mean they will answer. As Brett and Sam suggested, door knocking, and leaving a letter if no one is home, is likely the most effective approach to reaching folks in preforeclosure for short sale listings. We also have customers that get great results with direct mail - however - you really need to have one heck of a good mail piece to stand out, as preforeclosures tend to get a lot of mail.

@Ehsan Rishat the county clerk doesn't have "lists of properties with NOD's". They have the recorder index, which you can use to find individual NODs, which you then have to abstract (manually write down the information from the document image), and even then you still have no information about the actual property - not even beds and baths. I don't think anyone who values their time at more than $1/hr has done this in a decade given the great, inexpensive, services that exist in the market.

@Kwadwo Boafo note that May is a list broker, and that is why she is recommending you contact one.

You might consider not working with a list broker, as the lists they sell are out of date the minute you buy them. Same for Listsource. Much better to use a service that keeps your list up to date all the time so you don't waste time with stale data.

As to your question, you can not have 2 people logged in to PropertyRadar at once. When the 2nd person logs on, it will log off the first. The price is per user.

Best,
Sean

@Derek Stilwell she means herself, she sells lists with FSS. That kind of thing is really common here on BP, where vendors suggest something they offer, but don't mention that they offer it since the later breaks BP rules. With that in mind...

Consider looking for a list provider that combines public records and demographics (like listsource) as well as phones and email, so that you don't have to skip trace your listsource results.

Best,

Sean

I've probably purchased and sold a dozen houses with un-permitted additions over the years. All of the sales have been with full disclosure. Not so with the purchases, but that is part of buying trustee sales.

You were quite savvy to note the difference between public records and the listed, or owner claimed, sq ft. That is certainly the best tell tail sign of un-permitted work. One of my check list items before buying at trustee sale is to compare past listings (if any) to public records to look for exactly that.

Regardless he can definitely sell it, and should absolutely disclose it so that he doesn't have to worry about future liability.

As for how it will impact value, it really comes down to the quality of the work, and the value it adds to the property. If it was all done to code there's even the possibility of getting it permitted after the fact. If the work is really shoddy, it may be best to tear it down.

I've had properties with un-permitted work that have sold at or above market, especially if the un-permitted work was unique, added real value to the home, and wouldn't be approved otherwise (un-permitted space converted into a cool loft or wine room for example). And I've had ones that I've sold at deep discounts because the only fix was to tear it down and decided to wholesale it instead.

Hope that helps.

Hi @Dana Nay which states are you doing business in? I'd definitely be interested in hearing more about what you need, and what you think is reasonable on price.

If you are a new wholesaler, I'd strongly recommend not starting with direct mailing to a list. The problem noobs run into is almost never the list, it's instead the message / offer.

The list above are fine starting points, but always best to take them a step further, and segment them by age, equity, area, length of ownership, property type, etc until you have a list of people with fairly similar, and ideally somewhat unique characteristics. The reason for this is that the message / offer you make to someone in preforeclosure who has owned their house for a year and has very little equity, should be VERY different then the message / offer to someone who has owned their house for 20 years and has lots of equity.

And rather than guessing at what the right message / offer should be, or trusting some guru from Utah who has never worked a day in your market about what you should say, you should next go knock on doors and talk to people. Actually not talk, LISTEN. Once you've done that enough to understand what they need, and are able to get a deal done, then graduate to the phone where you can reach more people, but where you also get less feedback than you do in person. Once you can do deals by phone, then graduate to direct mail with the same message.

You may win the lottery and get lucky using some off the shelf letter to an off the shelf list, but you shouldn't count on it.