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All Forum Posts by: Ryan Murphy

Ryan Murphy has started 2 posts and replied 39 times.

Post: Anyone with Experience with LIHTC property?

Ryan MurphyPosted
  • Investor
  • Seattle, WA
  • Posts 39
  • Votes 41

@Brian Plajer - that is usually the case - you should ask to see the LURA (Land Use Restriction Agreement) to verify - it's usually a 30 year agreement (split into two 15 year periods), then it expires.  I'm less sure about the "senior complex" part - that may be a separate layer or added to the LURA, or just in name only - you would want to ask a little more about that to see if there are any additional restrictions.

Also, you will want to be familiar with LIHTC rent limits and utility allowances - contact the Housing Finance Authority (HFA) for the state to get more information.  Hope that helps!

Post: Vendors on flat monthly fees - yay or nay?

Ryan MurphyPosted
  • Investor
  • Seattle, WA
  • Posts 39
  • Votes 41

My partners and I own a 66-unit multi-family complex.  Landscaping / cleaning costs quoted by a vendor at $275 per visit.  The average would be 2 visits per month, but it would end up being 1 visit per month during the winter months and 3 visits per month during the summer months.  One partner wants to set this up as a monthly $550 charge, saying it is "standard practice."  My hesitation is that because this is winter and this is a new vendor, we would be paying the vendor an extra $275 per month for however many months left in winter, and the new vendor would then "owe" us the additional service calls.  What if he turns out to be a bad vendor, or quits, or something else happens?  My experience of human nature is that if he already has the money, he's less likely to be concerned about his performance and if we're happy with him or not, etc.

Another option is to wait until the summer months where the service calls are 3x/month, and then let the vendor opt to take the $550 average per month - that way we have the leverage if he decides to quit early or if we're not happy with the work - if anything, we would owe him money instead of him owing us service.

So one factor is who has the leverage.

The other factor is if there's a benefit to having the monthly costs consistent every month - does this matter to you as an owner / property manager?

Any feedback is much appreciated!

@Yonah Weiss

Yonah, what are the FB groups you asked these questions to?  I'd love to check those threads out.

Thanks!

Ryan

Post: Lifecycle of a CA Multi-Family Development Deal

Ryan MurphyPosted
  • Investor
  • Seattle, WA
  • Posts 39
  • Votes 41

@Scott Choppin - Scott, love your posts, great detail, looking forward to the rest of it! One thing - I couldn't make out the content on your images for pro-forma, cash flow, IRR, etc. - I even downloaded the images and enlarged them, but the content is too fuzzy to make out. Do you think you could either re-post higher resolution (or bigger) images, or could I PM you to get those? I realize you've redacted some info, but seeing the categories and a general idea of how you've put it all together on the spreadsheets would be extremely helpful, at least for me.

Thanks again, and best of luck on your project and business plans!

Post: Fannie Mae Homestyle Mortgage

Ryan MurphyPosted
  • Investor
  • Seattle, WA
  • Posts 39
  • Votes 41

@Lee N. asked me more questions in a direct message, but I think the answers are relevant to anyone looking at this discussion, so I'm posting my answers here:

Lee's questions: Once I get deeper in this process, I may have further questions, especially about picking contractors and how to shorten the closing time. Was yours long and tiresome or worth the time? What is the scope of rehab work that would likely be approved by inspectors? How about those that need permits (external modification, adding rooms, bathrooms, garages, etc.)? Would they be handled by the same inspector or a different one?

My answers:

Hi Lee - our closing process was a nightmare, but that was because it was a HUD property, and HUD was especially difficult to deal with for our property for some reason. Non-responsive, and passing the buck - we had to get the "owner" to turn on our water meter, and the "owner" was HUD, and they insisted that we had to deal with it even though the City of Seattle said we couldn't. Lots of other drama there, too.

I knew a couple contractors that I was able to work with, but contractors is an entirely other potential mess. I'd suggest lining up contractors now, you can't spend much time scheduling contractors to get bids after you've found a property, you'll lose too much time during the closing process. You want to find a few that have experience with remodel loans. I can't recommend the ones I used because of problems we had, so you should keep asking around and check ratings / reviews, etc. Today is harder than before because in our market prices are higher, they're busier, etc.

Closing time as I recall was usually 45 days instead of 30 days. The challenge you have is that you have to try to figure out what repairs are needed and how much they will cost (i.e. get bids) within a very short period of time, PRIOR to being locked into the P&S (usually 10-day period) - just in case the repairs / costs are way more than expected and the property isn't worth the final price. It's not a perfect process. You can generally get extensions if needed, but obviously the owner has to approve.

When you mention inspectors, I think that needs to be clarified - inspectors are city / government, and they have nothing to do with limiting any scope of a project you want to do. Their job is only to make sure you are following legal code based on city, county and/or state building codes. The BANK will determine the total you can loan (including purchase and remodel), and then the contractor would give the bids for the work to be done. An appraiser would then determine if the After Repair Value (ARV) of the remodel work allows the value of the house to fit the bank's LTV requirements for the loan they are giving you before the bank will approve the construction bid and finalize the loan.

Technically, the inspectors aren't part of the process until you have already closed on the property. Once you're ready to begin work, you have to get permits, and then you begin work. That should be done by the contractors anyway. And you kind of want permits - you need the work to be legally permitted for a number of reasons - 1) insurance can deny claims if your property wasn't permitted, 2) inspectors pass permit work because they have determined it meets proper code, so that's actually a GOOD thing to make sure the contractor didn't screw anything up that might give your property problems down the road, and 3) there are records of all permits on every property, so if you don't get a permit and make any substantial change to the property, it isn't hard to find that out, and it's especially problematic when you want to sell the property later on - properties for sale that have modifications that weren't permitted now are risky properties to buy because who knows what might be wrong with it and what additional costs the city might require to get permits, or if they will even allow a permit and force something to be torn down or un-done, etc. The permits substantiate the value of the work done, and hence, the value of the property as it appreciates.

There are different inspectors for different trades. Building, plumbing & electrical inspectors - sometimes mechanical if you're installing new HVAC, maybe others, depending on the remodel. Generally speaking, they are assigned to geographic areas, so you'd get the same ones unless they were re-assigned, on vacation, or some other reason they were unavailable. For instance, we got 3 different plumbing inspectors as we fixed things that were called out because the first got re-assigned, the second then on vacation ... etc.

Now, there are also Bank inspectors - these guys are 3rd party guys, maybe ex-contractors, and they come in only when you (and your contractor) want a draw. Their job is only to inspect the current work and then mark down what percentage of each construction category is finished so the bank can release those funds. In our experience, they were fairly loose about things - they weren't really there to police anything, they just wanted to figure out how much they could tell the bank they can pay out at that time. They don't talk to the city inspectors, they don't try to nit-pick if you're doing the job right, etc., that's not their purpose (unless something significant is BLATANTLY OBVIOUS that isn't right).

Hope this helps!

Post: Fannie Mae Homestyle Mortgage

Ryan MurphyPosted
  • Investor
  • Seattle, WA
  • Posts 39
  • Votes 41

@Lee N. More banks are offering this product now than in 2012, so keep shopping.  We used Sterling (bought out by Umpqua).  I'd check Umpqua, BECU, Homestreet, and a curve ball would be 1st WA Mortgage.  But keep looking and comparing, I don't feel my recent research on these loans is as thorough as I would normally be were I looking into a property now that needs one of these.  If you find anyone better then these guys, please post.

@Wayne Brooks is correct, and I believe this is for all conventional loans (standard and HS renovation) - it doesn't matter what a new appraisal would come in at (higher or lower), the PMI is based solely on the original value that the loan was based on. So if you paid 5% down, your LTV is 95% of THAT appraised value, and you have to wait until your LTV comes down to 78% of THAT appraised value before PMI can be dropped. Doesn't matter what the market does in the meantime. I do not believe you can get a new appraisal to drop PMI even if it comes in at 75% or at any lower LTV, but confirm this with your lender.

I don't think you can request PMI to be dropped at 80% LTV. The 80% LTV rule you are talking about only applies to a purchase where you are putting 20% down to begin with. This is why it can make sense to pay the 20% down and then get a HELOC on TOP of the 1st mortgage, because then you can still get the same total loan amount, but split between two loans, and avoid paying the PMI on the first. HELOCs can tend to have a bit of a higher rate, but the math generally works out that your payments are lower, and there are other advantages to having a HELOC (often they are interest only for 10-15 years, which reduces your monthly debt when calculating debt to income for your next purchase, and you can pay the HELOC down to 0 but still pull all the cash out again at any time ... it's a line of credit). Sometimes you can use a HELOC as part of the original purchase to avoid paying PMI to begin with, but this depends on the bank.

If you look at an amortization schedule, you can easily determine the exact month you can drop PMI, and calculate how much the PMI will cost you. Depending on your rate, it should be somewhere around 9-12 years, I think ... I haven't done the math in a while.

There is an option at the beginning of the loan process to pay a PMI premium that amounts to 2.15% of the total loan (check the rate with your lender). This is an up-front cost you can pay that eliminates PMI payments. When we did our HS renovation loan, I had this calculated as about 4-4.5 years worth of PMI payments.

So, if you know you will be holding onto the property long term (and not refinancing), then it may be worth paying the PMI premium up front to save some money longer-term. It also helps with your debt to income ratio if you are looking to get more loans for more properties, as the monthly PMI expense is no longer part of your monthly debt payment.

In my calculations, paying the PMI premium was a better return than paying points to reduce the rate.

However, I'm pretty sure that you can't retroactively choose to pay the PMI premium - this is a decision you have to make before finalizing the loan. I know this doesn't help you in your current situation, but it's good to know for anything you do in the future.

I'd say your best shot at getting rid of the PMI is to pay down the principal to 78% now (borrow money short term if you have to) and then get a HELOC for the difference (pay back any borrowed money as well - should take 1-2 months to get the HELOC). You should be able to calculate the monthly amounts to compare to what you're paying now, and I'd bet you'd end up ahead every month.

Good luck!

Post: How many of you are using ARM loans for fix and flip projects?

Ryan MurphyPosted
  • Investor
  • Seattle, WA
  • Posts 39
  • Votes 41

@Tony K. - I'm in Seattle and just looking around for ARM rates - do you mind telling me which credit union you got your rates from?

Post: Fannie Mae Homestyle Mortgage

Ryan MurphyPosted
  • Investor
  • Seattle, WA
  • Posts 39
  • Votes 41

@Julie Marquez - the bank will pay the contractor based on draws of what work is completed.  So the contractor does the work first (out of pocket) and then gets paid by the bank.  If you think about it, that's the only secure way a bank can be sure that any money they pay out doesn't just get stolen ... the value is already added to the house before they pay for it, so their loan is still secured to a house that is worth what they've paid out (in total) so far (and at each step of the way).

There are plenty of contractor stories where a contractor just made off with the money they were paid without doing the work, essentially stealing the money ... I wouldn't want to give any contractor that potential, so this is actually a safeguard for the homeowner, but more for the bank.  Anyone can get a contractor's license (at least in WA), even you or me, so being a "contractor" doesn't actually mean very much.

As for change orders, the bank will require 10% contingency funds that is actually part of the total loan.  So that's included in the process.  Anything that might go OVER that amount would have to be funded by the homeowner, usually the bank will require that you GIVE THE BANK the additional funds required for the additional work, which the bank would then disburse back to the contractor as a draw once that work is completed, just like the rest of the funds are disbursed.

Everything is in place to protect the bank (and ultimately the home owner) from a project that goes awry.  One of the dangers of overruns is that a naive homeowner could try to go crazy with every change order and luxury item, etc., and if they run out of funds to cover it, the remodel gets completely stuck unfinished without the necessary funds to finish it.  Then what?  If the project never gets done, then the bank would eventually have to foreclose on the property and try to sell it to someone else in its unfinished state ... so their rules and their processes are in place to ensure this kind of scenario can't happen.  It makes the process a bit bureaucratic, but if you think it all through, it generally makes sense.

Hope this clears up most of those questions!

Post: Remove a tree or wait?

Ryan MurphyPosted
  • Investor
  • Seattle, WA
  • Posts 39
  • Votes 41

Just to follow up, I ended up getting rid of the tree.  Thanks for the feedback!