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All Forum Posts by: Christine Watson

Christine Watson has started 3 posts and replied 7 times.

Post: How to Estimate the Insurance

Christine WatsonPosted
  • Dallas, GA
  • Posts 11
  • Votes 2

Good Day,

I need to estimate how much the insurance will be before I purchase the property.  My area of interest is in Jacksonville, FL.  I am an out of state investor and the property will be vacant until sold.  If you have any experience with this, please let me know how much your investor insurance is for Florida on a vacant house.  

Post: Need Investor Insurance in Jacksonville, FL

Christine WatsonPosted
  • Dallas, GA
  • Posts 11
  • Votes 2

Good Day,

I am investing and Jacksonville, Fl.  I need insurance to protect my property.  Please let me know of any brokers and agents that can help me.  Many thanks.  

Quote from @David M.:

@Christine Watson

Its common for investors to purchase with a brand new LLC. You would normally write the purchase contract with the buyer to be "Christine Watson or an entity to be formed" so you can form the entity after you have your offer accepted. You would be personally guaranteeing the loan, but the loan would still be in the LLC's name. Talk to commercial lenders and you will find that you can do it...

However, the matter of piercing the corporate veil is a complicated on.  Of course, consult some qualified professionals..  But, its a "facts and circumstances" thing that isn't easly answered, as many "little" actions can add up to piercing the corporate veil.  Furthermore, as we have found on BP, very few to nearly none of the investors have been sued so there really hasn't been "test" of their actions...

For example, MANY investors quit claim deed the Title. however, in my layman's opinion that I keep mentioning which nobody seems to want to refute is how does this quit claim deeding, especially if you make a habit of it. Remember, you can't use the LLC as an alter-ego. It is a legal entity, just like another person. So you need to consider it like a stranger -- would you quit claim deed your property to a stranger? Would you expect that stranger to rent it out for you and make your payments? At the very least you'd have to generate more paper to make it more legal, just like the recommendation to have periodic meeting minutes, etc. when having your own LLC. Not havnig them won't "break you," but it could help...

Also, with the mortgage in your name but Title in the LLC, which bank account will you draft the payments?? People pretty always respond "from the LLC's of course!" However, if you are keeping your personal and business accounting separate and not co-mingling your funds, why is the LLC paying your personal mortgage? Why is the LLC claiming the interest deduction on your tax return (probably on SchE of your return, instead of having to itemize if it was a personal mortgage).

This is why many of us on BP recommend not using a LLC for residential long term holds. Rarely if ever are landlords sued.. As I mentioned, there aren't really any examples in BP. While certainly the LLC can be useful for the limited liability protection, but it will cost you. Meanwhile, most people don't want to pay for the cost, normally the big one is the financing. There have been posts on BP where investors started down the road of the LLC, got all fouled up, and regretting it posting that if they had to do it all over again they wouldn't have used the LLC at all.

David, This is definitely something I need to put more thought into.  Are there any Real Estate Attorney's in the BP network.  I would like to hear their opinion.  Many thanks. 
Quote from @Jeremy H.:
Quote from @Christine Watson:
Quote from @Jeremy H.:
Quote from @Christine Watson:

Hello David,

Thank you for this.  This helped me see points that I was not aware of before.  

I want to purchase personally because my LLC does not have any income. I am purchasing a four plex. Once the 4 plex is rehabbed, the income from the four plex will go to the LLC.

Messing up the veil - I am assuming that I need an attorney to do the quit claim deed in order for the veil not to be broken.  Is this correct?  

Loan - I would not be able to refi a property that is in an LLC with a conventional loan. Is this correct?

Firstly - why do you want to put the property in an LLC? 

You can just purchase under your name - this gets you the best terms for your loan. Then talk to the title company and tell them you want to put it in an LLC. They'll record it and the deed will have the LLC. As far as the "veil" just keep your personal vs business bank accounts separate. This will limit your liability.

You likely won't be able to close under an LLC unless you go with a commercial type loan. AKA lenders will not let you close with a conventional loan under your LLC - needs to be your personal name. Just swap it over after 
Thank you, Jeremy!

I thought this way was a go, until David brought up some concerns that I had not considered.  
This seems to be the easiest way, however my main concern is the piercing of the veil.  If I do not have that protection, I have no use for the LLC.  

No - there's no concerns involving having your title company swap it over to an LLC after you close (regarding the veil)

Concern is - and all mortgage lender contracts will have is - is the "due on sale clause" - technically the lender can call your note due upon transfer of the property (since the property has been transferred to an LLC). I personally, nor has anyone I have ever spoken to had their note called due. That is the only concern. If you pay your note, I don't believe you'll ever have an issue

Ok.  Thank you!
Quote from @Jeremy H.:
Quote from @Christine Watson:

Hello David,

Thank you for this.  This helped me see points that I was not aware of before.  

I want to purchase personally because my LLC does not have any income. I am purchasing a four plex. Once the 4 plex is rehabbed, the income from the four plex will go to the LLC.

Messing up the veil - I am assuming that I need an attorney to do the quit claim deed in order for the veil not to be broken.  Is this correct?  

Loan - I would not be able to refi a property that is in an LLC with a conventional loan. Is this correct?

Firstly - why do you want to put the property in an LLC? 

You can just purchase under your name - this gets you the best terms for your loan. Then talk to the title company and tell them you want to put it in an LLC. They'll record it and the deed will have the LLC. As far as the "veil" just keep your personal vs business bank accounts separate. This will limit your liability.

You likely won't be able to close under an LLC unless you go with a commercial type loan. AKA lenders will not let you close with a conventional loan under your LLC - needs to be your personal name. Just swap it over after 
Thank you, Jeremy!

I thought this way was a go, until David brought up some concerns that I had not considered.  
This seems to be the easiest way, however my main concern is the piercing of the veil.  If I do not have that protection, I have no use for the LLC.  

Hello David,

Thank you for this.  This helped me see points that I was not aware of before.  

I want to purchase personally because my LLC does not have any income. I am purchasing a four plex. Once the 4 plex is rehabbed, the income from the four plex will go to the LLC.

Messing up the veil - I am assuming that I need an attorney to do the quit claim deed in order for the veil not to be broken.  Is this correct?  

Loan - I would not be able to refi a property that is in an LLC with a conventional loan. Is this correct?

Hello BP,

I would like to finance a BRRR project with HML. Will I be able to put the property into an LLC, when I refinance? Exactly, how can I put the property into an LLC. Many thanks.