All Forum Posts by: Robert Loiselle

The high risk stuff typically isn't too much.  It obviously depends on how many components they would need to do, but if you had a handful of window sills and a handful of door jambs, it likely would only be a couple of thousand dollars.  You qualify for a state tax credit too of up to $1500/unit when you achieve lead safe compliance...helps offset a bit of the cost.  Saves you the time of getting your moderate risk license and the time of actually doing the work.  Just a bit more info.  

Hey @Jared K.

Happy to help.  

If you had some window sill and some door jambs/edges that tested positive during your initial lead paint inspection, then scraping to bare wood is a legit method of deleading...but it needs to be done by a licensed deleader who can do high risk deleading work.  If they're not licensed or working directly under the license of a deleading contractor, then they're not authorized to do the work.  

It's not required that the inspector talk with the deleader, but it's pretty common for them to be there at the final inspection to go through what they did and to walk with the inspector when they check their work.  They also need to provide a deleaders invoice which shows the cost of the job, what work was done, and all their license info.  

If you're going to be doing the low risk deleading work, make sure to do that before the deleader handles the high risk deleading work.  The deleaders are very good at the cleanup and doing yours first makes sure that they handle the full cleanup and are responsible for passing the dust wipes that the inspector will take.  

Hope that helps a bit.  

Hey @Patrik Kisucky.  Glad the amount of work wasn't too bad.  The tough thing to convey to folks who haven't been through the process before is that the amount of work and the total cost of the work that needs to be done on a typical apartment is all that much anymore.  There's still a lot of horror stories floating around still...tough to dispel them.  

Also...don't forget you get the tax credit once you receive compliance.  That's up to $1500/unit and can help offset some of the cost. 

Masslandlords.org just submitted a couple bills to the MA legislature trying to get the amount of the tax credit increased to 15k/unit.  Even if it only goes up a few thousand...that'll really help to offset most of the cost of bringing properties into lead safe compliance and will be a real incentive.  Something to keep an eye on.  

I'm definitely still looking to buy new properties (rentals and flips).  We've moved our rental portfolio to NH but I'd be happy to purchase rentals in MA.  Been trickier to make the numbers work lately, but there are always opportunities out there.  

Cheers

Hey Patrik, 

I'm a licensed lead paint inspector in MA and also a landlord.  You are correct that you have 90 days to bring the property into compliance before the strict liability that the State of MA has kicks in.  

The first step in the whole process is to get the property tested by a licensed inspector.  You can do however many units you want at a time, but it typically makes sense to get the whole property tested in one go.  

One you get the property tested, you will know exactly what lead hazards are present and how they need to be abated.  You can actually have quite a bit of lead paint in properties in MA and it's completely safe, as long as the condition of the paint is maintained.  There's only a small list of surfaces that it cannot be present on.  

The most expensive areas to abate are old leaded wooden windows and lead painted siding that's in poor condition.  This is less and less common these days since most places have been covered in vinyl siding and have vinyl replacement windows.  

If you have vinyl windows and vinyl siding, in my experience, it would likely be cheaper and faster to just get the all the work done at once by a licensed deleading contractor.  They do the work very fast and cleanly (which is crucial).  Yes, you would have to put the tenants up in a hotel for the duration of the work (likely 2-3 days if they don't have another place to stay).  But compared to the cost and headache of trying to get a unit freed up to move people in and out of...it would be a wash at best.  Also, you might be able to get the work done within your 90 day window depending on when that clock started.  

That's just my 2 cents.  Feel free to send me a message and I'd be happy to chat more about it.  Each case of testing/deleading a property can be very different and has a few different things you need to weigh.  

Cheers, 

Rob

Hey @Meaghan OBrien, 

I'm a licensed lead paint inspector in MA and own investment properties up in NH.  I would get the inspection done.  Most houses that I test from the 70's don't have much lead at all, if any.  Its use was being phased out in the early 70's so it's likely there's not much, especially if the property has been renovated.  You might find some lead that needs to be abated on the exterior.  

NH is really tightening their laws in regards to lead paint.  It likely won't cost too much to get the initial test done.  Maybe you get lucky and that's all you need.  Worst case there will be a bit of lead that needs to be abated where you have to pay the money that one time to remedy the issue and then it's behind you.  

Debbie from Alchemy Lead Management is who I've used for inspections before in NH.  She's super helpful

@Lisa Kattenhorn

Here's where the lead paint laws get a bit tough to follow.  Happy to do a call where it's a bit easier to explain sometimes.  

Best case scenario, is to be able to get the report from the lead paint inspector who performed the inspections/re-inspections.  Their name should be listed in the database.  Hopefully they're still active and you should be able to give them a call to get the report.  If you can get a copy of the report and lead certificate, you can do a mostly visual inspection of the property (called a PCAD - post compliance assessment determination).  Any leaded surfaces that have fallen out of compliance need to be addressed.  

Other scenarios are if you can't get the paperwork or varying levels of it.  These situations require some waivers from the state, which can take up to 2-3 months to get due to backlog.  Then you also have to do other forms of PCADs and can definitely achieve compliance, there's just a few more hoops to jump through and paperwork to generate.  

You also don't get the tax credit on a property that already has compliance.  I hate that rule, but it is what it is.  

PM me if you want to chat more about this in detail.  I might even know the inspector that originally did the work.  Hopefully you can get the original paperwork from them. 

Cheers

Hi @Lisa Kattenhorn

Lot of good advice on this thread.  

I'm a licensed lead paint inspector in MA.  Like the folks above said, it's really hard to ballpark pricing for what needs to be deleaded because it really is on a house by house basis.  That said, there area few things you can look out for which can give you some clues.  

1) Replacement windows.  If the property has vinyl replacement windows, that's huge.  That's typically the highest cost item in bringing a property into compliance.  

2) Vinyl siding and aluminum wrapping on ext windows.  Saves you from having to either paint or wrap large portions of the exterior.

3) Varnished trim on the interior.  Varnish can have lead, but it's rare.  

4) Older doors and window trim.  The older door edges and door jambs might need to be scrapped.  Same for older window sills.  

5) General poor paint condition.  You can actually have lead paint on a lot of surfaces in a property, but it needs to be well maintained.  If you see a lot of peeling paint throughout the property, probably best to assume that will need to be addressed in an effort to achieve compliance.  Also...watch for loose paint on exterior wood work like porches or basement window systems.  Very common.  

Also, don't forget when you achieve compliance with the State, you qualify for up to $1500/unit in a state tax credit.  It should be more, but it helps to take a bit of the bite out.  

Sorry...one more thing.  Don't forget to look up the property to see if it has any history in the States database.  

https://eohhs.ehs.state.ma.us/leadsafehomes/default.aspx

Happy to answer other questions you have.  

I should also note...to do ANY deleading activities in MA (including encapsulating surfaces)...the property must first be inspected by a licensed inspector to document all lead hazards.  If it isn't, the property can be flagged for unauthorized deleading and it will make it near impossible for you to get a letter of lead safe compliance from the state.  

@Anthony Dooley I'm a licensed lead paint inspector in MA and "lead remediation" is actually required by law in MA when there's a child under the age of 6 living in the house. 

@Andrew Votsis Encapsulation paint is only permitted to be used on certain surfaces that contain lead paint in a home (A couple examples are window sills or handrails).  You can't use the encapsulants on the siding of a house for example, nor would you want to because the cost of that particular paint is $$$.  In my experience, you don't see the encapsulants used very often for a couple reasons.  There's a lot of work that needs to be done by the deleader to make sure the surface will accept the encapsulant and it all adheres properly.  They also need to check the thickness of the paint when applying.  The time added by these additional steps and documentation doesn't really make sense when they can just scrape those surfaces and be done before the paint would have been dry.  Also, the encapsulant paint is very thick/chunky and looks terrible.  

A lot of surfaces can be covered which tends to be a much better/faster/cheaper solution to encapsulants.  Happy to answer other questions you have. 

- Rob

What state is the property in?  

I'm in Massachusetts which has some pretty strict lead laws and is generally viewed as tenant friendly. I've found the State generated info online geared towards renters is a great resource for landlords. Spells out a lot of things to look for and has a lot on lead paint. You'll also see a lot of lawyer pages that have good information geared towards tenants which is helpful to landlords. 

See if those resources can help you find out if the have the option to request a lead test.