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All Forum Posts by: Robert M.

Robert M. has started 12 posts and replied 38 times.

Post: How to use a HELOC to start investment journey

Robert M.Posted
  • Posts 43
  • Votes 141
Quote from @Oscar Vazquez:

Hello, I'm looking to get started in real estate investing. I currently own a property that is valued at 850K and my current loan on my mortgage is 272k. I'm considering getting a home equity line of credit (HELOC) of 250k-320k to begin my real estate investment journey. What is the best method you would advise me to use this HELOC to get started? TIA

You’re fortunate to have a lot of equity in your home, and there may be some great opportunities ahead for you. Given the amount of money you’re considering putting into play and the fact that your personal home would be at risk, I will add some strong cautions about the heloc in addition to offering some suggestions for how to use it.  Perhaps this information will help future readers if you already know and are prepared for these risks.

Helocs are almost always at variable rates, and interest rates are likely to go pretty high in this economic environment.  So, if it’s possible to leverage your heloc for shorter-term projects (brrrr strategy, for instance) rather than for a longer-term investment, that could be wise.  Of course, some of the short-term strategies (like brrrr or fix and flip) are risky right now too since housing prices may become unpredictable soon. You’ll want to look at the risks on both sides of that equation, and the best advice I can possibly give is to be sure you have plenty of meat on the bone for whatever deal you find so that there’s always an exit strategy.

Beware that if a heloc gets to 10%+ (which looks more possible than it once did), your monthly payment on a fully-extended interest-only loan at the max borrowing amount you described above would be $2667.  If you have the means to cover that payment for an extended time, then you may also be positioned well to buy properties if the housing market corrects (which appears to be very possible in the next year, even if not certain). 

If you’re not in a position to cover those payments (either through other income or with heloc proceeds themselves, set aside for reserves), then I would definitely not use your heloc for anything long-term.


In all cases, but particularly if you’re going to rely upon the heloc as a source of reserves, beware that helocs can be frozen and sometimes called due immediately if the bank so chooses in an economic downturn (note that this may impact your cash reserve position if you plan to depend upon the heloc for reserves). Read your closing docs carefully and ask good questions.  Sometimes, they also require periodic re-verification of your ability to pay, which is when they may be most likely to be called or frozen.

If interest rates get as high as they did in the early 80’s (which seems a less ridiculous possibility now than it did 6 months ago), you can expect to nearly double the monthly payment above.  

Finally, if you're planning to leverage properties you buy, your heloc (at the adjusted rate) will factor into your DTI for borrowing on new properties. A HE loan would be a good option for a fixed rate, but it's sure to be at a higher monthly payment than a current heloc (but perhaps a good bit less than a future payment on a variable rate).

I’m actually not suggesting that you shouldn’t use a Heloc in this environment (I use one!)—only that the type of investment and risk should be very carefully measured (and especially if you lack significant cash reserves to weather a storm).

Again, you have quite an opportunity to do something with that amount of cash; I’d just start slowly and educate yourself at every step of the way.  Assuming you understand and have a game plan for the risks, then go for it!

There are some social media groups that  investors from all over the nation follow.  I’ve watched properties posted there create a feeding frenzy because it’s a targeted audience. There are others, but I belong to Airbnb homes for sale—79k members.  Just be sure you know your market well enough to set your price on your own.  You could be penny wise and a pound foolish if you save an agent’s commission only to price the property too low and lose substantially more.

Quote from @Thomas Pigeon:

Does anyone on this thread have any recommendations for cleaners? I’ve reached out to magic, but they seem priced pretty high compared to the cleaning fees I am seeing other hosts charging. 

Thanks!

I don’t have a recommendation, but I do happen to know that a lot of hosts in the area don’t set their cleaning fees as high as what they pay their cleaners.  They pay extra out of the nightly rate, charging a lower cleaning fee so that guests don’t feel entitled to leave the place a mess.  FWIW.

Check with Berkshire Hathaway too.  Proper, Foremost, and BH are some of the main go tos.  FWIW!

I have the opportunity to purchase two short-term rental properties that will perform very well.  I’ve been looking for this exact property prototype for almost a year, so I hate to pass them by.  That said, I am also currently building a property that I’ll need to refinance in the next few months (it’s in a construction loan with a balloon payment), and I can’t risk messing up the qualification on the refinance. 

Thus far in my investing journey, I've used only conventional lending. Buying these two properties now means I will need to rely upon DSCR or private options for the refinance on my property that's under construction. My risk tolerance is usually pretty decent, but given the stakes (of being unable to find alternative financing), I can't seem to mentally let go of conventional lending options.

The risks I anticipate are: 1) Credit score will drop with a lot of activity in a short time (though I don’t know how much), 2) The properties are pretty rural, so appraisals could be low or lenders may offer lower LTVs because of the rural classification, and 3) Sudden market shifts could make lenders skittish about vacation rentals, making it more difficult to secure non-conventional lending.

My questions are: 1) How confident can I be that I will be able to secure a DSCR loan? 2) Under what circumstances will a DSCR loan NOT be made (and is the rural nature of the property a concern)? 3) Aside from local banks (which I've checked), where else should I look for lending options on short-term rentals?

Thanks in advance!

Most lenders will add back depreciation, taxes, and mortgage interest.

We learned a ton from other hosts and investors before we launched, and now that we are well down the short-term rental road, there is no doubt that certain bits of advice were more valuable than others. We’ve certainly made minor mistakes, but I’m grateful to say that we benefited greatly from the wisdom of those who went before us.  So, while some of this may not fit the “lessons learned by messing up” box, what I CAN do is pay it forward by summarizing the most helpful advice and lessons “confirmed” that have led to our success.  

So, for what it’s worth…

1) Location, location, location.  What is nearby that attracts visitors?  Is it seasonal or year-round?  Does it attract families or parties?

2) Do your own research.  Airdna and Mashvisor are great, but they’re not perfect.  Better to watch similar properties for a while on Airbnb and VRBO, AND ask a realtor about returns, AND do the research on sites like Airdna and Mashvisor.  The combination of data will yield the best analysis.

3) Gather as much data as possible for an informed buying decision, but make the leap—thorough analysis, but not analysis paralysis.

4) When setting up a property, consider things that will get people to book AND little surprises that will make them happy once they’re there.  Touches like good linens, a plush mattress topper, labels and instructions for where to find or how to use things, or great coffee go a long way towards a 5-star review.


5) Speaking of reviews, educate guests on the review system.  Our check-in email tells guests that many platforms consider anything less than a 5-star review to be an unsatisfied guest.  As such, we tell them appreciate the opportunity to correct a situation during the stay rather than finding out about it afterwards.  Nearly all guests give us that opportunity if there’s a problem that surfaces during their stay, and our average rating on Airbnb is 4.97.


6) Stay at your property before it goes active and periodically once it’s up and running.  You may not realize the can opener broke or that the lamp light bulb is blown unless you spend some time there.

7) Don’t get too emotionally attached to the property.  If you do, you may over-invest in things that don’t add value (wasting money on things that don’t give you a return is never a good idea), overreact to damages or things getting ruined (budget for those things to happen, buy duplicates, and then don’t give damages and ruined items another thought!), worry all the time, or be too protective of who you allow to stay (though screening is good, a fully occupied and highly profitable property may be worth very small risks—for each person to determine based upon risk tolerance, but we have very few bad guests). 

8) Stating the obvious, but find ways to increase revenue.  Definitely use an external pricing tool like Pricelabs, consider allowing pets with a fee (an extra $5-8k per year just might make the cost of that new rug more palatable—and it’s unlikely you’ll need one since most pet owners take care of the place), and consider one-night stays if the guests are properly screened.

9) Others will disagree and perhaps location has a part to play in areas that are and are not desirable for partying, but to elaborate on the last item above: one-night stays (between other guests) add about $10k NET to my annual bottom line.  Don’t do single nights for locals, but DO consider them for the family of 4 that’s coming to town for a quick getaway or event.

10) Differentiate your property from the rest.  It may be through nicer furnishings, adding a hot tub or pool table, or accepting pets.  All of the above items can help create a niche, which particularly helps you stay booked during the off season.

11) Go for durability in choosing furniture and linens, and replace/service things sooner/more often than you would in your own home.  A broken appliance could cost you more in frustrated guests, rental concessions, and property downtime than replacing it a bit more frequently.

12) Automate everything—bookings, confirmations, check-in emails with door codes, check-out reminders, etc.  Everything!  If you’re spending more than 20-30 minutes a WEEK managing a single STVR, then something in the process needs to be changed.  Pricelabs, Hospitable, and a channel manager like Ownerrez or Lodgify are essentials.

13) Fear of a bad review can cause you to expect too little from your guests and to take on too much stress when something goes wrong.  Provide a great (even if sometimes imperfect) experience, and most guests will leave a great review. 


14) By the same token, don’t be difficult with your guests!  We’re in the hospitality/service industry. If you don’t like that, then don’t buy a STVR!  I’m often stunned at how hosts respond to problems/issues posted by another host seeking advice on social media (thankfully, Bigger Pockets hosts seem to have more class!).  You’re going to have an occasional needy guest, difficult request, or unexpected cancellation that falls outside of your policies.  Do your best to be flexible and serve your guests well.

15) Find an outstanding property cleaner/care-taker and treat him/her well!  This person is the key to your success, having few headaches, attracting repeat visitors, and ensuring that guests have an overall great experience.  Your cleaners may not put things in the same places you would, and there may be an occasional miss.  Let these things go!  If they’re committed, dependable, keep things clean and stocked well, and willing to do everything you need, then it is golden!

16) Be good neighbors.  Many HOAs and local governments no longer allow STVRs.  Buy somewhere that has already fought those battles (i.e. where you already know the rules of the game—not where the rules are yet to be created) and then meet the people around your property.  Give them your contact information in case neighbors have problems with your guests, and assure them that you’re there to serve them as well as your guests.

Hey, @Josh Buchanan, not to barge in, but I figured I’d add what I know in case Sean has only worked with Front Royal (I’m more familiar with the county than the town).


I’m not investing in Warren County, but I studied it extensively. You DO need approval for a STVR even if it’s outside of town limits. You can reach out to Matt Wendling with Warren County to discuss specific properties (can’t post contact info on BP, but Google his name + Warren County). I found he was glad to share his thoughts on the likelihood of approval, probably based on past hearings with neighbors in the area. (Heads up: He may ask for the address, so you may want to describe cross streets or the neighborhood you are considering up front in order to avoid being the one who outs that the seller doesn’t have a permit.)

Last I checked, a county hearing is required and the STVR structure cannot be within 100 feet of any neighboring structure (using the GIS to get rough measurements may help you avoid an unnecessary call to Matt; if it’s closer than 100 feet, it will not qualify). There are also some health department boxes to check. The approval stays with the property once granted. (So, if new neighboring structures are built closer than 100 feet at a later date, you should still be able to sell the property as a licensed STVR.)

For what it’s worth!