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All Forum Posts by: Robert Ellis

Robert Ellis has started 185 posts and replied 2837 times.

Post: Just met w/ a developer - housing affordability may get much worse.

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594
Quote from @Jake Andronico:

Just spoke to a developer in Northern Nevada, and he made a comment that was pretty shocking to hear first hand. 

Apparently, local jurisdictions here are saying they want more affordable housing, but in the same sentence will also say that there will be more regulations, more environmental protections, and more hoops to jump through to develop starter homes. 

This will simply causes prices to be even higher, and continue to constrict demand... 

The Reno MSA already has natural topographical land constraints, and there have been studies about land "running out" here in less than 10 years. 

With people continually migrating from CA, more jobs moving here (Tesla Semitruck factory being built as I type this), I don't know how this gets solved. 

Explore detailed population growth statistics at the Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis

Releasing Federal Land for private sale? 


I know this is also a National issue, especially in land constricted markets. What do you see out there? 


Curious to get everyones take. 


 not in columbus ohio they don't care about the environment. we are building 7 houses at a time and there's nothing in the way all of this year. new deliveries and prices are very strong. maybe blue states but not something we have to worry about in our local market. land is a buyer's market in most areas too. Can you show me a city in America where land is at a shortage? most land has more than 6 months supply which means it's a sellers market. that's the same in our main market in Columbus Ohio and miami florida as well where I relocated to. 

Post: AirDNA top STR markets to invest 2025

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594
Quote from @Travis Timmons:

AirDNA published their annual list, and the markets topping it are: 

1. Peoria, IL

2. Fairbanks, AK

3 Akron, OH

4. Columbus, GA

You can go look up the remaining 21 markets, but you get the idea. The industry is mature and margins have properly compressed. If you want real yield or cashflow, you have to buy in a non-vacation market that is not top of mind for an STR. It's the boring places that probably won't appreciate above the rate of inflation that will provide real month to month income.

I've said this before, but I would contend that we are in a "What can you do that is really hard?" market. You have to make a deal rather than buy a deal, be more appreciation focused, and be more patient. STR feels more like a strategy to break even or eek out a meager return on a great asset than a strategy to cashflow. Or you have to take a value add approach to make it worth the hassle. It kind of feels like the rest of the market - you kind of have to pick a lane between cash flow and appreciation.

Does that make sense?


use STR reports it's more representative of major hotel markets and hotel inventory. find hte right brand. we just did a 150 page report on one development site. Akron ohio isn't the best city in america for short term rentals that's crazy. it's not in the top 50 and i'ts a very struggling ohio market. it's not even top 5 in ohio.

Post: Why BRRRR is not an effective strategy today...

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594
Quote from @Alan Asriants:

Margins in the market today are extremely tight. The best deals I find are usually the result of an agent's lack of familiarity with the area or a very poor listing presentation. Even in those cases, it's difficult to create a significant gap between the purchase price, rehab costs, and ARV (After Repair Value).

Investing in today's market is incredibly challenging, and I've found that the BRRRR strategy is one of the least effective approaches right now.

Let's keep in mind that BRRRR gained popularity before 2020. Back then, the market was more stable, interest rates were below 4.5%, and distressed properties sold at significant discounts.

Today, distressed properties often sell at a premium, and cash-out refinance rates are above 8%.

The best BRRRR deal I can find today involves buying a property with cash, investing in the rehab with cash, pulling out 75% of the ARV and breaking even on rent and mortgage. However, even in these cases, you typically leave a small amount of money in the deal and only break even before accounting for vacancy, repairs, and other expenses. For example, you might leave $10,000–$25,000 in the deal, end up with a $3,000 monthly payment, and only collect $3,000 (or slightly less) in rent.

This applies to my local market and primarily to Class B or higher real estate.

You’re better off finding a solid property that needs only light cosmetic work (e.g., paint, flooring, or perhaps a kitchen or bathroom remodel), buying it at a decent discount, and putting down at least 25%. This approach gives you access to better loan terms and makes the investment more feasible.

In my market, the BRRRR strategy only works if you purchase an absolute steal from the seller—and deals like that are virtually nonexistent. Even if you do find such a deal, getting it to cash flow after repairs and a cash-out refinance is extremely difficult, especially for single-family homes. This is because there's a cap on how much someone is willing to pay to rent a home today.

For example, even if you own a solid property worth over $600,000, the maximum rent you can charge in my area is $4,000 per month. Even at that price point, you may struggle to find a tenant, potentially leaving the property vacant for months.

Here’s an example of a deal I’m currently working on:

  • Purchase Price: $215,000
  • Rehab Costs: ~$250,000
  • ARV: ~$615,000
  • Potential Rent: $3,600/month

Using a $615,000 ARV and 75% LTV on the cash out refinance, with taxes and insurance, my monthly payment would be $4,267 using an 8.5% rate. This also leaves me with $3,750 stuck in the deal (not including financing and closing costs, which could easily add another $20,000).

In total, if I had to include closing costs and financing costs, I’d have about $23,000 (if not more) tied up in the deal and lose close to $700/month before accounting for expenses. While I would have built $150,000 in equity, the cash flow simply doesn’t work.

Now, let's compare this to the market conditions when BRRRR was highly promoted (pre-2020).

  • Interest Rate: 4.75%
  • Monthly Payment: $3,057/month
  • Rent: $3,600/month

In this scenario, I’d be making over $500/month with $23,000 left in the deal, resulting in a gross 26% cash-on-cash return—an excellent deal.

As you can see, rates and prices play a critical role in the viability of the BRRRR strategy. Even with a great deal, it's tough to make it work in today's market.

This is the reality we’re facing now.


 we are starting a new trend ... Build, Rent, Refinance, Repeat and doing it in 3 zips where margins are good. 3 story walk up infill. most markets don't have low priced inventory and new construction sells at premium. look in your local market and see if that strategy works or the economics exist. our main market is Columbus Ohio. don't give up

Post: New Construction suggestions for STR

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594
Quote from @Steven Diaz:

Here are the prelims.  


 I'd make it 1 car and add more heated sq ft higher appraisal. or make it 1.5 and widen downstairs. I'd bring island out a little more. my advice is make sure all rooms are 110 sq ft minimum. some of these look super small. we build a very similar one in our market. I think you could make a shared bath and take out one bath if you wanted to. 

Post: Struggling land investor.. how are you selecting your markets?

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594

you have to learn land entitlement. we identified a site today for hotel development that was an 18000 sq ft lot. New zoning in columbus went from 2 stories to 6 stories. pitched a few investors who do hotel development and they are looking at it. The entitlements would cost 50k to do. we'd make 2 million on the land if we do the deal. stick to the same market and same asset class. we do urban adjacent urban infill for midrise in hotels and extended stays and apartments in Columbus Ohio. what market are you in? forget letters. miami is easy too. 

Post: Expanding to Columbus, Ohio - Looking to Connect!

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594
Quote from @Patrick Drury:

@Charles Masten
If you are just jumping into the Columbus market I recommend areas like Hilltop, Linden, Eastmoor/ Whitehall, and Franklinton. These are areas where you can cash flow in Columbus because the rent-to-price ratio is favorable. Out of these areas, Franklinton and Linden are seeing some of the most developments. With things like the ONE Linden plan in Linden, which is a 50M plan to improve the neighborhood. Of that 50M, 25M was allocated for the construction of a new recreational faculty that has since been completed. Franklinton has been seeing lots of developments like the completion of Gravity Phase 1 and phases 2 and 3 on the way. As well as coffee shops like Bottoms Up Coffee are moving in and small microbreweries like brew dog and Land Grant.


 I wouldn't touch Franklinton with a 10' pole on the existing inventory side. gravity 2 is being auctioned and sold by the developer the area didn't support office developer lost millions:

https://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2024/12/19/gravity...

linden I agree on if you can get a good deal. super fast appreciation. small homes, close to downtown, you can look at year over year and it's going up fast but also fast to change. any urban adjacent neighborhood is going to be good. 

I also wouldn't touch hilltop with a 10' pole. struggled. old homes, over budget renovations, lots of issues. realtors push people here since it's the only place cheap houses close to downtown can be good but homes are 1900-1920. I use to tear down dozens of homes here and in Franklinton that almost blew over. not a lot in linden since they are built after 1945 and without all the major issues. 

Eastmoor and whitehall are good too because of newer home ages after 1940 where you don't have knob and tube wiring and some of the other issues. don't be afraid to look at new construction or ground up new builds closer to downtown. rentals are overpriced in these areas but build costs are low and it can be a good strategy 

Post: Expanding to Columbus, Ohio - Looking to Connect!

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594
Quote from @Charles Masten:

Good afternoon BiggerPockets family,

I hope everyone’s 2025 is off to a fantastic start! Reflecting on the past year, I’m incredibly thankful for the opportunities I’ve had and excited for the journey ahead. 

In 2024, I focused on the Charlotte, NC market, completing 21 deals in my first year of taking consistent action. These included cash buys for flips, seller financing, and subject-to deals. For those just starting out: keep taking consistent action and small steps. Momentum builds over time, and I promise things will start falling into place.

This year, I’m expanding into Columbus, Ohio! My wife and I plan to purchase a few properties ourselves, but with the lead generation strategies I’ll be implementing, I expect to come across more deals than we can personally handle.

That’s where you come in! I’m looking to connect with other investors and buyers in the Columbus area. Whether you’re looking for creative financing opportunities or cash deals, I’d love to bring you potential deals that align with your goals. I’m actively working on agent outreach and direct-to-seller approaches and would love to collaborate or learn more about your investing criteria.

This community has been such a tremendous resource for me, and I’m eager to give back by helping others find great opportunities in Columbus. Let’s connect, share insights, and grow together!

Feel free to reply here or DM me—I’d love to learn more about your investing strategies and see how we can help each other succeed.

Wishing you all a successful and prosperous 2025!


 build to rent developer here would love to connect everything we do is ground up construction and land entitlement 

Post: BRRRR in Huntsville

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594

just google Huntsville and overbuilt and you'll get your answer. 

Post: Out-of-State - Ohio Section 8 Housing

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594
Quote from @Danielle Benzaken:

I'm looking to get involved in Section 8 housing out-of-state - in OH. For those who are running successful Section 8 businesses out-of-state, did you start in just 1 state or if the opportunity made sense would you purchase the property regardless of the state?

Self-proclaimed Section 8 guru's online claim to do the latter and then find Property Managers after they purchase the property in whatever state, but I don't know how real that is.


 I bought and sold old houses for 10 years. I'm from Toledo and know most of the turnkey guys. just make sure to buy later than 1950. don't get the knob and tube and plaster and lathe and cast iron sewer lines. understand that most markets that do turn key or section 8 are going to never appreciate like Cleveland or Toledo or tertiary markets like Akron or Cleveland. I'm not an expert in these markets nor turn key but ohio is a great state to invest. our strategy has always been buying below market or building below market 

Post: Looking to build some new spec homes

Robert Ellis
Agent
#1 Land & New Construction Contributor
Posted
  • Developer
  • Columbus, OH
  • Posts 3,228
  • Votes 1,594
Quote from @Atif Khan:

Hi, new here. i just finished building my first spec homes out in granbury tx and was looking to buy a few more lots around dfw metroplex. I was wondering if there were any builders who have any good strategies on where to buy land when you're looking for spec homes. How to track potential growth in an area to see if a lot is viable for purchase and building spec homes on etc.  basically if anyone has any tips when it comes to researching plots of land in order to make the right purchase i would greatly appreciate it


 get with a realtor. we underwrite land at no more than 10% of after built value. in our market we build under the average new build value which is about 515k. we like to be around 420-450k and smaller footprint about 1500 sq ft with attached garages. we build close to urban core where everyone wants to live and net migrations match up. but suburban is fine. if you give more context I can help but in most markets land is a buyers market. most people aren't looking at it or buying it.