All Forum Posts by: James Z.

Thanks @Jordan Thibodeau , this was helpful.

I was aiming more to work for a company, not be an individual property manager (aside from my own investments). In my area, the pay scale is a lot nicer than PM in other areas. I don't consider 60-80k to be "very little pay,"  though I understand many people here might.

Either way, it seems the consensus thus far is that PM work sucks. That isn't very daunting, considering my current job has long hours, is extremely tedious and detail oriented, and pays much much less. I'm still curious to hear opinions on whether I am improving my cash flow significantly by managing my own properties, and whether anyone finds themselves able to juggle investing in real estate and managing their properties simultaneously.

My thinking was that getting this job might be a meta-investment in a sense, an investment on my planned investments.

I do not yet own any property, and I have no experience other than theoretical knowledge from books. Without going too deeply into my situation, I'll just say that being a commercial property manager (which in my area comes with a salary of 60-80k) would be an unfathomably large increase in income for me. I'm worried that on my current meager income getting a traditional mortgage for a cheaper property may be difficult (even with my decent credit). My thinking was that property management would give me more capitol to invest with, and help me to make smart decisions in investing. I would not want to do it forever, but I thought it might be a smart springboard to help me move toward my goal of full-time investing.

While I would love to be a broker and make more money for my time, I have not the slightest idea of how to get started in that field, nor do I have any connections in it like I do in property management. But I'm all ears.

I'm currently considering changing career paths into property management. Not only would it increase my salary, even starting out, but I think it could provide for a critical eye in REI, to really evaluate what needs to happen to a property, what it's worth, and in general augment my ability to be a buy and hold investor.

I am curious just how much property management itself would help my cashflow. I'm assuming that when I have a few (1-5) properties, my skills acquired on the job (and supposed connections i would acquire, like handymen and contractors) would make being the PMan for them entirely doable. But would the savings I make by being my own PM be significant? 

Beyond that, about when would most of you estimate that being my own PMan would have diminishing returns? By that I mean: how many properties can a PM reasonably be expected to juggle simultaneously, if they are not in one building? While I understand that my efficacy on the job is a determining factor, and that everyone is different, I would really appreciate a rough idea of this. Is it unheard of for one person to juggle thirty properties at once? Would managing thirty properties at once essentially be a full-time job, as I imagine it might? Would juggling those thirty properties and also continuing to build my little REI empire be too much work for most?

In general, I am interesting in hearing about the merits (and problems) of being a property manager for your own investments. Thanks!

Hi everyone - I won't bore everyone with details here (I already did that in another post) but I am in the process of overhauling my life/career, and the prospect of REI has become my prime motivation and goal since.

While I am adamant that I have the proper mindset for this kind of business, I also have the sense to know that my succeeding to the point of being able to quit my day job is at minimum "several" years off. In the meantime I would like to make a career change, and preferably move toward something that will augment my career in REI.

To this end, the path I am considering most thoroughly is Property Management. After speaking to the one PM I know, and researching it a bit, it seems like something that can be broken into with less time/money than some other professions, such as becoming a Real Estate Agent (in certain states, at least). It also seems to be a skill set that would be invaluable in owning properties, especially for someone like me that intends to be a Buy and Hold type investor.

I'm hoping that someone that is currently managing their own properties has input on this -- I'm curious to hear how helpful property management skills are in owning real estate of your own. I understand many of the basics of it, but in practice I have little concept of how time-consuming it is. For example...what number of properties can one person reasonably expect to be able to manage alone? 

I suppose my hypothetical concern is this: say am hired by a PM group, and learn the business. Over the next five years I invest in several properties with the intention of managing them in my spare time. How big a bite is too big? Will I feel maxed out with five properties? Twenty-five? Fifty (though maybe by fifty properties I could quit the day-work)? Obviously there are lots of circumstantial factors, but can someone give me a ballpark estimate of what one reasonably talented PM can do by himself? 

Equally important: I have little concept of what a good property manager costs to hire....would I be saving myself much money at all by becoming my own, as opposed to hiring one once I have properties?

Really I am interested in any advice anyone has to give on the topic of being your own property manager, and the merits thereof, as well as any experiences people have had trying to enter the world of property management. It may be a bit off topic, but if anyone has knowledge of the salaries in that field, that's welcome too. I am always skeptical of the figures I hear, and somewhat doubt that people can start making 60k/year in their first few years in that field. 

I am also open to hearing about other professions that could augment an REI lifestyle. I just chose property management because it seemed most suited to my personality and seems to require less steps than some other careers.

Many thanks in advance, these boards have been invaluable in developing my starting plans.

Thanks everyone for the advice! 

I'll definitely be looking into that REI group @Tom Fields , and will probably see you there eventually.

@Paul Cox  Thanks, I was unaware there was a BP group in this area. I'll certainly be going to that....feel free to get in touch with me when you are in the area. I am still green as an investor, but I know DC's different neighborhoods pretty well and may be of some assistance in learning the landscape.

The big word in DC right now is "gentrification." In a sweeping generalization of the past few decades, the "left" half of DC's map has for a long time been considered wealthy, safe and profitable. Many parts of town on the "right side of the map", east of Rock Creek Park, or east of downtown, have not. 

Then within the past 10 or 15 years, a few key areas have absolutely exploded with development, bringing in fancy shops and restaurants, nightlife, and housing. I imagine if someone could invest quickly once they realize this is happening in an area, the appreciation would be worth it. Anyone that bought some property in Columbia Heights, the H street corridor, or the U street corridor right before this happened is probably pretty happy right now. 

But I feel like these epicenters of gentrification are not terribly large, and you have to really jump in at the perfect time. I moved into the northern end of Columbia Heights over a year ago. About 8 years ago, there were multiple murders directly in front of my doorstep. Now the area feels very safe, and very hip hipster bars are popping up along 14th street, heading north from Columbia Heights proper. The same 300k one-bedroom I mentioned above probably would have sold for half that ten years ago, but now that the initial explosion happened about a ten minute walk south, I imagine it will take at least a decade before the slow crawl of fanciness from Columbia Heights proper really shows any appreciation to the guy who bought it 2 years ago.

I suppose what I'm trying to say is that if you are buying solely for appreciation in DC, it's a possibility, but not in the same way that it might be in California, as Anthony said he had heard it was. The only area that I know of that is about to have one of these renaissances is the Georgia Ave corridor, and even then it's hard to tell how much of one it'll have.

The more I talk about this the more I want to turn my eyes to nearby Virginia and Maryland. I only have the resources to at max get two or three smaller properties when I really start this - and it sounds like if I throw those resources at DC I will get little cash flow and be in arrested development until that area hopefully explodes.

Thanks everyone for the replies.

It sounds like the 2% rule is truly inapplicable around these parts! Glad to hear I'm not just doing some terrible miscalculation somewhere.

@Account Closed  I have primarily been looking in 16th Street Heights, Columbia Heights, and Petworth. Some along the Georgia ave corridor, seeing how things are changing around there. I chose these areas partially because I am local and can get about in those areas to see things in person the easiest, and partially because their price range seemed to match what I was looking for. 

@Scott Stevens  I am starting to look in the surrounding areas, especially Northern Virginia. I have kept a particular eye on the expansion of the Silver Line near Tysons and Reston, but have tried to not focus too much on that since I figure I best figure out investing before I figure out speculating! 

Which leads to me to my next question, which is somewhat related to what @Andrew Syrios said about rent/cost ratios...if I intend on being a buy and hold type investor, what benefit would investing in the city present over the less-expensive outlying parts? If the prices are more reasonable and I can get better cashflow by investing in Virginia or Maryland, is there any perk that might bring my attention back to the city? @Brie Schmidt brings up that there is quick turn around for getting tenants, and the possibility for appreciation...but can those things or other city perks really balance it out?

Hi all - I am new to the world of real estate investing. I have read a few books, and so have a decent "theoretical" knowledge base, but there is one key factor that has been largely overlooked in my studies: BIG CITIES!

I read the forums and look at examples in books, and lots of the buy and hold investors are giving examples and stories of the 2000 sqft single family homes they bought for 50, or 100, or 150k a piece. I live in Washington DC, and from what little experience I received from my mentor before he died, it seems impossible to find 1 bedroom units that aren't falling apart or in an extremely high-crime neighborhood for less than 200k. To give a general sense of what I have seen here, in middle-of-the-road neighborhoods a decent 650sqft 1 br/bath condo is running around 300k.

I do understand that in general, anywhere, higher prices come with the potential for even greater reward. But I try to apply something like "the 2%" rule (monthly rent = 2% of purchase price) to the situations I have seen and my knowledge just falls apart. For example, in this case where he bought the unit appraised at about 300k (actually bought for about 280k, because of some tricky building complications that ended up not being a big deal) 1 br mentioned above, the rent would theoretically be ~$6,000/month. But he felt lucky to get $1,900/month.

So I am beginning to get the sense that there is a disconnect between the theoretical knowledge I have gained from books and real-world deals in cities. Are there complications that frequently come about in a big city that aren't usually a problem in somewhere more suburban or rural? Are there different sets of numbers that I should be running? Is it treacherous for a first time investor to start in a big city? I suppose any information about investing in expensive markets and cities would be appreciated.

Apologies for the rambling and disjointed questions....it's just dawning on me that investing in the city might have major differences from elsewhere that I do not understand yet.

Many thanks!

Hi all - I am trying to acquire (or witness) some real world experience investing in Washington DC. Unfortunately, the man who turned my eyes to this business and was beginning to guide me recently passed away, and I am at a loss for where to turn next.

I am interested in finding a good REI group in the greater Washington DC area; one that requires little or no cost to attend the first few meetings/get-togethers.

And even more than this, I am seeking a benevolent knowledge-giver who is willing to impart their precious experiences to me; in exchange I will do whatever I can to be half as useful to them as learning from them would be to me. Whether that means scouting properties, doing investing "chores" such as research, or whatever else I can. I'm a rather tenacious and hard-working individual that just wants to apply myself to his business.

Ultimately, I just want to be inundated in the culture and have a good base of APPLIED knowledge (which cannot necessarily be gained from reading all these books) before I put my money where my mouth is.

Thank you for your time!