All Forum Posts by: Nadine O.

Great question, Nadine! I've been thinking myself on where to buy first. I've been living in Richmond, Virginia for 5 years now and have a lot of friends in the area. A lot of Virginia kids go to Virginia Commonwealth University, like my friends did, and end up staying here. Richmond is a quirky town with TONS of character and a lot of opportunity. Value adds for years to come with seasoned investors with comps to get ARV's easily (and follow the formulas).

I'm looking to get into get into the Petersburg market (just below Richmond) to cash flow on single-family, or multi-family properties that go for as low as 50k On Market. It's a city that is rent heavy that is begging for some attention. I would love to be a part of the improvements there.

I'll use the cash flow and my business as a Real Estate Agent to move into the markets that the college, VCU surrounds, and house hack a duplex, or maybe even a quad! Richmond is a hidden gem with good places to cash flow and suburbs that appreciate nicely. It's really a place where you can get it all as a house hacker, investor, and Richmond is a nice place to raise a family too. Good luck on your journey! Can't wait to see where you end up. I'd love to hear what you ultimately decide

Buy where the market is cheaper than California.  Look at the southern states, look for a couple multi-family units. Position it where it brings in enough to have a property manager locally, and let it run!  

Quote from @Nadine O.:

Quote from @Travis Biziorek:

Quote from @Nadine O.:

Hi BP Family! Where would you recommend living in USA to start house hacking and building a rental property business? The intent is to relocate from a high cost of living area like the Bay Area in California (although we love it here) to another, lower cost of living city where we can start by purchasing a multi-family to house hack (we are newbies, but have read a lot) and eventually build a portfolio of rental properties to retire off of. Would love to hear your thoughts - thank you!

Nadine, five years ago my wife, oldest son (not quite 1 at the time), pup, and I sold our Walnut Creek townhome and intended to move to Ann Arbor, MI. We wanted to get into real estate, eventually, but that's not why we moved. We wanted a lower cost of living so my wife could stay home full-time and focus on being a mom.

The housing market in Ann Arbor was too crazy for us and we started getting that Bay Area vibe with things going $60k-$80k over ask. We figured we'd just up our budget, which we could afford to do, but then realized we were falling right back into what we were trying to escape. So we began looking elsewhere.

We decided on Metro Detroit, specifically Troy, MI. The schools were a big draw for my wife. We liked being near a large airport, big city for culture, etc. And the housing wasn't like it was in Ann Arbor. We bought our 3,100 sq ft home for $460k, did a bunch of renovations on it and then decided we'd get into real estate investing.

Everyone told us not to buy in Detroit proper. 

"STAY IN THE SUBURBS", they said.

The thing is, the masses are almost always wrong. I started investigating Detroit. In 2018 we drove some nearby neighborhoods not quite in Detroit proper. I specifically remember our son in the back seat as we headed down to Allen Park and Redford. Ultimately, in 2018 we decided we needed more capital before pulling the trigger. We really didn't but we didn't know any better. I wish we'd gotten started then.

But about a year later in 2019 we got a HELOC on our primary (appraised for $550k) and took out a loan against my 401(k). We bought our first rental property in Detroit in April 2019 for $40k. The tenant was paying $750/mo but not REALLY paying. We got two months out of them before we had to evict. Then we put $15k into cosmetics and rented it for $950. Today the home is worth $120k and rented for $1,200/mo. PITA is about $250/mo :-)

We now have 10 doors in Detroit proper (NOT the suburbs) and they have been extremely good to us. Most of these houses we were able to BRRRR. The ones that didn't quite make it have already paid out their capital. We could refinance everything today and pull out about $200k in equity. And I intend to soon but we can't do that quite yet...

This week we are putting our primary residence on the market and heading back to California. SLO to be exact.

My wife never thought we'd be able to afford to move back. I had friends tell us we'd never be able to afford to move back. But we are.

It's been a journey and it hasn't been easy. But know it can be done and the place you move doesn't have to be your forever home. You can leave with a mission to build some serious wealth and then move back. Don't let people tell you any different.

Let me know if I can be helpful and good luck!

Travis - thank you so much for your story and great job on your success! I have looked into Detroit, MI and that is one area on my radar (in addition to Grand Rapids, MI).

I feel the same way, I love California and if we were to relocate - just like your journey -  we don't have to be there forever. We could relocate, reduce our biggest expense,  be more hands on with our investments in a lower cost area which could possibly help us scale faster (maybe or maybe not, which is why I am seeking out help from those who have succeeded in this) - then, if we aren't 100% happy we can come back. 

I agree with you - normally you don't want to follow the masses. Appreciate your time to share your journey and best of luck to you - welcome back to CA!

Cross country moves are expensive, moving across the country 2x could be down payment on another rental.

If you put in the effort you can get a cheap rental in bay area from long time landlord. Combine that with out of state rental(s) it'll reduce your actual living expenses quite a bit. Then you can focus on finding a primary here in CA at good price that'd you make money on or big chunk of equity.

Unless you know what your doing from a construction point you don't "have to" be local or hands on to your rentals. But it's extremely valuable to have a local level of knowledge and network.

And some numbers....
its about 12k right now for just a moving truck to KC, that's not even counting fuel and 2 hotels as it's a 24hrs of driving.

All said and done, that's about 15k to get me to KC doing it by myself. Add in the security deposit, first/last month rent, and random crap I'd need to get settled in temp spot in KC I'd be damn close to a down payment on investment.  It'd also take me quite a bit to make up probably 20k by time it's all said and done just to make the move.

@Nadine O.florida South FLORIDA..I m here already..hit me up..I am also buying I Colombia..eventually will move to Mexico

@Nadine O. So after all this input, where are you leaning towards moving? Just curious....

Quote from @Michael Lyons:

I don't have a specific location, but I'd suggest looking at cities and towns within an hour driving radius of large metropolitans (I think DC is a great one to base off). As hybrid work becomes more of the norm, more people are going to be willing to take the hour drive once or twice a week, for a reduction in living expenses (especially families who want more space !). There's opportunity to find better yields in these smaller markets, but now you have more downside protection in theory, as more individuals will be willing to expand their search radius to these smaller towns that are within a reasonable driving distance of a large metro.

 Hey Michael, 

Have you seen a migration of people coming from NYC to D.C. We see a lot of action from the New York crowd moving down to Richmond. I'm originally from Northern Virginia. Other agents and I have seen a movement because of the reason you stated. They work from home and are willing to make the hour and a half drive once a week. I think D.C. and Richmond, VA are both great markets

Hey Nadine, Let's connect! There are so many options concerning your future plans. We are here to help each other.

I understand your point of view that's really an awesome idea to work on. Keep taking steps!

Quote from @Nadine O.:

Quote from @Joe Hammel:

@Nadine O.

Metro Detroit

(my rental portfolio is here)

Purchase: $80k-$130k

Rent: $1200-$1500

ROI: Double Digit

Cash flow: couple hundred/month

Appreciation: Double digit (for past 10 years, will gladly send data)

Location: C, B- (suburbs and certain markets)

We have over a dozen Fortune 500 companies just in Metro Detroit with huge Healthcare and Auto industries.

The bad reputation comes from OOS investors wanting $20k D market properties.

Investors can retire (FIRE) in a few years with these.

We love them.

 Joe - thank you, I appreciate that. Metro Detroit is another great option and I am looking for a lower barrier of entry to start so I can scale from there so that is good to know. I will reach out to you for more information, thank you. 

 Ann Arbor is a very nice (and not cheap) college town and at most an hour to most of the Detroit metro area. If you want to be "boots on the ground", it would make for a great home base. 

If I had to move to the midwest from the west coast, that would be my first choice!

@Nadine O.

I actually moved to Casper, WY to get a duplex because location is everything and it is 5 minutes walk from/to the hospital :)

Hi @Nadine O. I too left the Bay Area, Some what! I split my time between Sonoma County and Shasta County. however I started House Hacking using the BRRRR method in 2020 in Shasta County. Admittedly, I have not traveled much in my life and wasn't comfortable investing outside of California just yet, so I went further Northern California. I chose this area because the cost of entry is far lower than the bay area, however the growth over the last few years has been great. I watched as business such as Trader Joes, Chick Fil A, Whole Foods, etc. started setting up shop here. Knowing they obviously have done extensive research and development prior to opening up here gave me a sense of comfort knowing they too see the potential. The Work force is strong, the rental demand is even stronger. Yes it's Hot, Yes there are areas that are not great, however the location is not only good for LTR but for short term rentals as well considering the destinations areas near by such as Shasta Lake, Whiskey Town Lake, Mt. Lassen, Mt. Shasta etc. I'm on second investment deal here since May 2020 and very happy with what I've been able to accomplish here as I begin to build my Real Estate Empire.