Skip to content
×
Try PRO Free Today!
BiggerPockets Pro offers you a comprehensive suite of tools and resources
Market and Deal Finder Tools
Deal Analysis Calculators
Property Management Software
Exclusive discounts to Home Depot, RentRedi, and more
$0
7 days free
$828/yr or $69/mo when billed monthly.
$390/yr or $32.5/mo when billed annually.
7 days free. Cancel anytime.
Already a Pro Member? Sign in here
Pick markets, find deals, analyze and manage properties. Try BiggerPockets PRO.
x
All Forum Categories
All Forum Categories
Followed Discussions
Followed Categories
Followed People
Followed Locations
Market News & Data
General Info
Real Estate Strategies
Landlording & Rental Properties
Real Estate Professionals
Financial, Tax, & Legal
Real Estate Classifieds
Reviews & Feedback

All Forum Posts by: Mark B.

Mark B. has started 1 posts and replied 7 times.

Post: Is college worth it ?

Mark B.Posted
  • Posts 7
  • Votes 5

@Nathan Smith

Read all of the chapters here starting from the foreword: https://www.navalmanack.com/al...

it’s relatively short so you can do it in an hour or two. It’s the best, most relevant, and actionable advice I’ve come across. This is wisdom from a very successful Silicon Valley tech founder and angel investor, who came from nothing. That is important because as a young adult you should be listening to people who have their fingers on the pulse of the tech sector. They know the most about where the nature of our economy and future is going. 

I’m graduating this semester and I’ll be doing so with a lot cash and no debt. Here is what I would do if I were 18 again, most of which I did but at a later age:

1) Go to a local community college, continue living with parents. Live cheaply.

2) Apply for financial Aid and scholarships.

3) Transfer into a good computer  science program at a state school (in your state). If you can continue living with family, do so. 

4) Get into the highest paying internships and co-ops you can find all along the way. Stash that cash, CS students get paid absurd amounts in big tech internships.

5) Graduate with little to no debt, with the best technical skill a person can have today.

6) Work for 2-4 years at a tier 1 or 2 tech company. With diligence, you can have $200-500k saved. Get into a remote working role and the world is your oyster. Go to a market with a great profile for property investment. Since you have a W2 job with crazy income, banks will love to offer you loans for property acquisition.

And at this point, you’ll be wiser and see more options and opportunity than you knew about before.

Here’s another thread on the power of code’s leverage: https://www.thefastlaneforum.c...

That person saved $200,000 in one year and leveraged that into $20-30k of monthly combined cash flow in the 2nd year. This is business related, not real estate because you should learn about ALL the options that are out there. 

Originally posted by @McKinley Crowley:

@Mark B. Spend your time making a super strong lead list and then create a multiple touch point marketing strategy (DM, RVM, Text, Email ect). As I am writing this is see that I am repeating a lot of what Elliott had to say but start small and then scale what is working. No need to get in over your head unnecessarily. Give me a call if you want to chat more. 

Cheers,

 Thanks! So that makes two recommendations for starting small, super targeted, and leveraging all marketing avenues. 

Originally posted by @Account Closed:

@Mark B. go highly targeted like you're saying, and target leads that you don't believe are being competed for heavily. That may mean going for a different market, and/or alternative asset type. You don't want to compete right now, especially when you're so small. You want to be different.

Get that list of the magic 500 leads. Send a HIGH quality, unique mail piece with a personal, well thought out custom message. Also, call these leads, try ringless voicemail, and send them text messages . all on alternate cadences. Direct mail will be your highest rate of conversion, but the other approaches taken consequently will rapidly build familiarity with you and your brand & get your leads to start calling you sooner rather than later. People have to know and respect you to call you and give you their business. 

Messaging deserves one more mention here. You need a STRONG message that is meaningful to your prospective sellers- delivered consistently, through multiple marketing vehicles, frequently and consistently.

Thank you Elliott for this response!  

Funny you mention leveraging these other phone based marketing strategies too. I had the intent on supplementing my direct marketing by sending video text messages to prospects. The idea being to go as far as I can with building trust and differentiating myself from other sellers. A lot of business sources I've consumed recommend doing things "that don't scale" as a competitive advantage over the big players in a niche. And I'm in a super competitive market so I'll commit to testing these recommendations!

Originally posted by @Account Closed:

@Account Closed I wouldn't bother investing in real estate. Reinvest in your business. You have the good fortune of being self employed, and if your business model is viable and capable of scaling that 10k reinvesting in marketing, sales, or other growth initiatives will yield you way more than it would investing in RE, unless you start a real estate investing business of some sorts with it.

If you're hell bent on investing in RE, I would say don't do it until you've got more cash. 20k puts 20% down on a cheap duplex out of state. Nice, but still not my preferred route as a business owner. 

When my business was really small (it's still small), 10k invested in intelligent targeted marketing made me almost 500k in less than 6 months. 

These perspectives are interesting. About the return with a business vs real estate investing. I remember on the BP podcast with Noah Kagan, he had similar views. Mentioned that he could yield way more by reinvesting in his businesses over real estate investing, so he couldn't justify focusing his time with RE.

Trying again for a post or two! Not gonna give up here!

I know statistically I'm one of thousands of faceless wannabe wholesalers that come and go over the years. I've been studying hard the last 8 weeks and have let go a well paying en.gineering job (I have the confidence that I can get another if need be). I've listened to over 200 BP episodes since 2015, and countless other business and marketing podcasts. Countless business and marketing articles. Several books. Several meetups. 

I'm very serious with real estate investing and treating it as a business with the intent to scale :)

Originally posted by @Tom Makinen:

@Angelique F.  Per the IRS, it is the intend.  It seems like your accountant already treated it like an investment property as you took depreciation instead of expensing everything.  Since you didn't hear back from the IRS, I am guessing they didn't give you dealer status for this house.  Remember IRS is not 100% cash basis on real estates.  Also less deduction you take now, less you pay when you get the depreciation recapture.  Accounting doesn't lie...

Example 1, dealer status

Year 1 Purchase Price 10K

Year 1 Reno 35K

Year 1 Sold Price 50K

Year 1 Taxable Income 5K as ordinary income (let's call that 25%)

Example 2, investment property

Year 1 Purchase Price 10K

Year 1 Reno 35K

Year 1-5 Rent Income 3K/year

Year 1-5 Depreciation 1636/year

Year 1-5 Taxable Income basis of  1364 as passive income (your tax rate, call it 25%)  (This is for the rental income)

Year 5 Sold Unit 50K

Year 5 Additional tax event for capital gains as you made money on it.  Since your house is only worth (45000-8180=36820).  You would be subject to add back in the $8180 as depreciation recapture to get you back to 45K where your cost basis was.  At the end of the day, you would pay capital gains on $5000 (<20% in tax rate) and $8180 at your tax rate (25%).

Before you complain, look at that math above.  You are essentially paying the same except depreciation allows you to keep more cash up front.  All the taxes you are paying at Year 1-5 is for your rental income, not the actual house.  I know it sucks as you put down 45K up front to do the project, but it makes no difference from an accounting perspective.  

In 5 years, you would pay 25% of the following amount (1364+1364+1364+1364+1364+8180) + capital gains (<20%) of 5K.  

Why is it good to avoid dealer status for flips.  Look at the example above.  If you got labeled a dealer and IRS won't let you depreciate the property.

Y1 - Buy property + reno 10+35 

Y1-Y5 Rental income 3k per year

Y1-Y5 Passive income tax on the 3K @ 25%

Y-5 You sell the property and got a gain of $5K.  Since you got tagged as a dealer, you have to pay ordinary income at 25% for the 5K.  In the 5 years, you would pay 25% of (3+3+3+3+3+5=20K)

Not having the dealer status allows you to pay less taxes on year 1-5 and then less on the 5K in capital gains you received since it is taxed at a smaller percentage than your tax bracket.  

 This post is incredible, thank you! Super helpful to see nitty gritty info like this on a complicated subject.

Hi BP, I'm new (have been a BP listener since 2015 though) and I'm fully committing to RE now, through wholesaling. Still in school but finishing part time to be able to give more focus to RE. The goal is to hopefully gain real traction in this as a business before graduating so I can stick with it full time.

I have enough savings to do some heavy direct mail campaigns, but of course the fear of my inexperience leading to losing it all without a done deal is holding me off the trigger. 

What would you advise?  

A part of me is saying if I'm too scared to take the full leap on a 9-touch direct mail campaign with a couple big lists, then I don't have what it takes to make the risks necessary to succeed in real estate or business. 

The other part is saying don't be stupid, respect what's at stake here and try to go about it smarter. ie: leverage my free time more by curating the lists down a lot and hyper targeting the homeowners likely to be the most motivated. That I can viably direct mail a small list like absentee owners with code violations over and over and squeeze a couple deals out of it, without spending $10k or more. Supplement with time intensive marketing strategies like bandit signs to affordably increase deal flow, too. Then scale up the direct mail as I get more experience and funds. 

This ^ seems like the sensible approach to me but I lack the data to know if massive volume (thousands of addresses) is mandatory to statistically close deals through direct mail. Can deals be done with 200-500 addresses if they are highly targeted?

What say you BP members?