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All Forum Posts by: Kyle Vogeler

Kyle Vogeler has started 5 posts and replied 11 times.

Post: In need of a Realtor

Kyle VogelerPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Emmaus, PA
  • Posts 12
  • Votes 8

Fellow Real Estate Investors,

I am looking for an experienced realtor to list and sell a rental property I own in Huntington, WV. The property consists of 6-units and is fully occupied. Please DM me if you or someone you know is interested.

Thanks!

Post: Wanted: Realtor Specializing in Multi-Families

Kyle VogelerPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Emmaus, PA
  • Posts 12
  • Votes 8

Fellow Real Estate Investors,

I am looking for an experienced realtor to list and sell a rental property I have in Huntington, WV. The property consists of 6-units and is fully occupied. Please DM me if you are or know someone who is a realtor certified in the Huntington area.


Thanks!

Hi, my partners and I are looking to buy a small to mid-sized multi-family property, but my one partner is also in the process of purchasing a car for $25K. To give you a background, he has no mortgage/rent payments, and with this car loan, his total monthly loan payments will be ~$600 versus an income (with commission) of ~$150K+. Our question is, how will this car loan affect our ability to apply for a mortgage? What about mortgages for multiple properties if we decide to buy more than one? Will there be a significant impact or should he be okay to purchase? Thanks!

Post: First Major Deal Update

Kyle VogelerPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Emmaus, PA
  • Posts 12
  • Votes 8
Quote from @Matthew Morrow:

@Kyle Vogeler nice job man! This is awesome. Was this an on-market deal? 
We've had several in similar fashion where they finance some, pay all closing costs, and a case of Yuengling is not joke. That holds a special value in many hearts...lol


 Yes, it was on market. They had other similar offers but accepted ours. Then, after inspection, we managed to work in the seller financing and closing costs!

Post: First Major Deal Update

Kyle VogelerPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Emmaus, PA
  • Posts 12
  • Votes 8

Hi All, 

I just wanted to share an update on the property we currently have under contract. We recently had the property inspected, and the report came back with some things we could use to our advantage, so we hit the re-negotiation table.

Our initial offer was:

Purchase price: $2,150,000 - (conventional financing)

But, after meeting with the seller on Sunday, here are the new terms:

- Purchase Price: $2,150,000

- Seller Financing for 30% of PP

- Seller pays ALL closing costs

- We provide seller with a case of beer and have a celebratory drink after closing


We were extremely lucky to find terms with the seller that mutually benefited us all, and we all left the meeting feeling zealous. The seller financing and elimination of closing costs on our end allow us to have ample cash during our "construction period" to pay for all debt expenses and every day mishaps. When finished, our loan balances should be somewhere between $4.5-$6Mil, and our ARV should land somewhere between $10-$16Mil (depending on final building plans).

We have a lot of work ahead of us, but my partners and I are inching closer to our goal of financial freedom!

Post: Got our first major commercial property under contract!

Kyle VogelerPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Emmaus, PA
  • Posts 12
  • Votes 8
Quote from @Ronald Rohde:
Quote from @Don Konipol:
Quote from @Michael K.:

@Kyle Vogeler how much of your own money are you putting into the deal? and into which loan(s)? Wasn't entirely clear from your description. Also, how many apartments are planned in the final construction? 

Yup hit the nail on the head.  Sponsor with no experience and no capital in the deal.  And wants to offer no equity, just 13% interest for someone putting in what should be equity not debt.  Even IF they get funded, lawsuits are sure to follow. 

 Well, with no hard money on the PSA, its just a free roll of the dice for Purchaser. This is why I advise my Sellers to never sign these PSAs...a shot in the dark...


 I agree, there is definitely a lot of risk on the sellers end that we may back out of the deal if we don't get the funds needed for the down payment. Luckily, we are over 80% funded and have 60 days until closing. I would hate to get the reputation as a buyer who frequently backs out of deals, so as long as the inspection comes back clean(ish) then we fully expect to close.  

Post: Got our first major commercial property under contract!

Kyle VogelerPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Emmaus, PA
  • Posts 12
  • Votes 8
Quote from @Don Konipol:
Quote from @Michael K.:

@Kyle Vogeler how much of your own money are you putting into the deal? and into which loan(s)? Wasn't entirely clear from your description. Also, how many apartments are planned in the final construction? 

Yup hit the nail on the head.  Sponsor with no experience and no capital in the deal.  And wants to offer no equity, just 13% interest for someone putting in what should be equity not debt.  Even IF they get funded, lawsuits are sure to follow. 

 We will wind up with $50K-$100K in the deal and although we have no experience with self storage, we have teamed up with a mentor who will get us up to speed and has a proven track record. Aside from that, we do have experience in project management, and have give large contingencies in chance of issues so we reduce the chance of lawsuits. Investor relations is one of our main priorities, so we are ALWAYS up front with anyone who lends us money, letting them know timelines, risks, and how we plan to mitigate those risks. I do appreciate your comment though, I will make sure to work diligently to avoid getting sued :) 

Post: Got our first major commercial property under contract!

Kyle VogelerPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Emmaus, PA
  • Posts 12
  • Votes 8
Quote from @Henry Clark:

@Kyle Vogeler

Congratulations to you and your team.  Couple thoughts or approaches on funding and cash burn. Developing is always about learning and hurdles, I would have recommended starting smaller, but at least you're starting.

If possible, I would subdivide the two types of projects.  

1.  If zoning or conditional use for the Storage wasn't already part of your "Subject to" purchase, this might take up to 6 months to get approved.  Or not approved in a residential area, unless this is mixed use zoning.   This will eat up a lot of interest and "time".  If you segregate the two projects, the Apartment project can move forward at its own speed.

2.  Segregate so you can have two different General contractors.  There are specialized Storage contractors, plus if you're going local, one contractor might not have the horsepower to get both projects done.  Speed is of the essence.

3.  Segregate so you can have a simpler proposal for different investors.  Makes the project less complicated.

4.  Can't tell on loans, but you want the construction loan to cover construction and also a Rent up Phase for both/either the apartments or Storage.  Say around 5.5% today.  On the storage ask for construction period, then either 18 months rent up phase or 60% "Occupancy" rent up.  You don't want to be paying 13% interest.  Realize the 13% may be to entice lenders, to take no equity position, but it still adds to the total project cost.  Also, the Banker would prefer to cover both the Construction period and final financing.  You don't want to be caught between temporary lenders and your final Lender.  When you hit the 36 month period, your not guaranteed to get re-financed; I would rather be with the same lender in this economy from the start of the project.

5.  Does your deal work if in 2 years, the interest rate is 9%?  Run the numbers.

6.  Or are you looking to flip at the end of your 36 month lump sum construction loan?  Again, I would subdivide the property.  Will be easier to flip these separately.  Also, your time frame I would add an extra year.  Talk with your accountant.  Less than a year then 37% highest personal income tax rate, or if you hold a year 20% capital gain.  At 350 storage units, you will knock out about 80% of all of the potential buyers, with the Apartment complex tied to it.

7.  Back on the loan.  Lien Positions.  Not sure how you will structure but will the private money lenders have to take a second position behind the Financial lender?

8.  Check with your longterm finance lender.  Your comment $5.5mm cost versus $7.9 to $12mm.  Will they give you credit for the "APPRAISED" appreciated value as your portion for the collateral or will they require you to kick in say 25% cash for the $5.5mm.  Appraisers will look at: a.  Comps, b.  Cost, c.  Revenue stream.  In an uncertain economy the Appraiser may be hard press to appraise above Cost basis.  Also their cost approaches use 15 year old cost data, which is not reflective of todays costs.

9.  Contract costs.  Do you have locked in bids for the $5.5mm?  Our storage unit building quotes are only good for 1 month, with a delivery date within 4 to 6 months.  They won't quote any further out, like over a 36 month period. Same for our Concrete contractors.  Make sure you have wiggle room in your $5.5mm estimate.

10.  Self storage you normally do in phases, unless this is multi story.  If drive up, you might do in multi phases.  This will help with your cash needs and reduce your exposure.

Keep chugging.  Great project.  Like any development more hurdles equal greater profit potential.

This was extremely helpful and informative! We have already thought about most of these points, but you definitely gave us a few things to think about. Thank you!

Post: Got our first major commercial property under contract!

Kyle VogelerPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Emmaus, PA
  • Posts 12
  • Votes 8
Quote from @Michael K.:

@Kyle Vogeler how much of your own money are you putting into the deal? and into which loan(s)? Wasn't entirely clear from your description. Also, how many apartments are planned in the final construction? 


 We will likely end up using $50K-$100K of our own money for down payment/closing costs on conventional loan for property. We will also be getting a separate construction loan for the storage units and apartment renovation. When all said and done, we will have 375+ storage units and 10 apartments.

Post: Got our first major commercial property under contract!

Kyle VogelerPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Emmaus, PA
  • Posts 12
  • Votes 8

The asset is currently 29 units split between 2 buildings. The front building is a mixture of garages and apartments and will be converted to only apartments during construction, the building located in the rear of the property is completely garages and will be torn down for the more profitable (and nicer looking) self storage buildings.

We have never managed self storage previously, but my advisors company is going to aid us with software install, filling units, and management (and we are compensating them a % of revenue). It would be unwise for us to try to take on this project without a veterans help :)

Construction Loan is not finalized yet as we are doing to separate loans, which is what our mortgage broker recommended. The first loan will be for the property and the second for construction - loan for the property is 80% LTV, so we will need ~$520K for the down payment and closing. Construction loan should cover most or all of the construction costs, but we will need ~$300K of cash on hand to cover cash burn during construction months. Looking to get private loans for ~$800-$900K to cover closing costs, down payments, and cash burn - we have a few close acquaintances who are in the process of signing LOI's, but we are still working towards raising all the cash needed.

Advisor is not getting any equity in the deal, as we did not offer it. They will be compensated for their help with property management however. 

I believe I answered all your questions, but let me know if you have more or if I missed anything!