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All Forum Posts by: Kyle Schreur

Kyle Schreur has started 2 posts and replied 6 times.

Post: How to split utitility costs between landlord and Tenants

Kyle Schreur
Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Grand Rapids MI
  • Posts 6
  • Votes 1
Quote from @Drew Sygit:
Quote from @Drew Sygit:

@Kyle Schreur how are you charging your tenants rent currently?

Guessing you're not using any software or invoices, just depending on the tenants to remember to pay each month.

So, you will need to do something to notify the tenants about what their portion of the utility bills are.

Suggest:

1) You get a PDF copy of each bill
2) Type on each bill the split calculation for ONLY that tenant
3) Save it and email to the tenant.
4) Hopefully you're at least using a spreadsheet to track their rent ledger transactions.
(Google to find one)


Well, let's start with your post - it's so vague, we have no idea if you're referring to a 1-unit or multi-unit property.

Also, you state, "I specifically requested to not mention anything regarding different ways of how to collect utility or rent" - yet your post is full of so much fluff that has nothing to do with your actual question! 

WHAT VALUE DOES THE BELOW ADD?
"I feel like that's a win win for both the landlord and tenant. It kinda creates a much smaller threshold for the tenant to save money if they were to keep an eye on their usage since I'm paying a large chunk of it, while also being able to keep any eye on how much they spend so it gives them that personal incentive to watch their usages. It benefits me for the obvious fact of bookkeeping and giving me predictable fixed costs."

Ask better questions, get better answers:)


 I'll try to make this as simple as I can. Please don't add any opinions about whether it's a good idea or not or how other people typically do things cause that's not my question, and it's a little demeaning to just presume otherwise. Please listen.

If I wanted to contribute a fixed amount of 100 dollars for electricity, what is the process for doing so? Do I keep the electric utility in my name? And bill them back the rest of the amount of electricity they rack up after the paid 100 dollars? Do I have the utility in there name and just contribute to their account? If you don't know the answer. Please don't respond. There really isn't much else to add or remove since it's a unique and very specific question. Not just a general question about setting up utilities. 

 I understand the normal way is to just bake it in rent. Again please just keep things civil and respect the question. Thank you.  

Post: How to split utitility costs between landlord and Tenants

Kyle Schreur
Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Grand Rapids MI
  • Posts 6
  • Votes 1
Quote from @Drew Sygit:

@Kyle Schreur how are you charging your tenants rent currently?

Guessing you're not using any software or invoices, just depending on the tenants to remember to pay each month.

So, you will need to do something to notify the tenants about what their portion of the utility bills are.

Suggest:

1) You get a PDF copy of each bill
2) Type on each bill the split calculation for ONLY that tenant
3) Save it and email to the tenant.
4) Hopefully you're at least using a spreadsheet to track their rent ledger transactions.
(Google to find one)

I really don't think anybody here is understanding my specific question because I have no idea how you got there that I wasn't using any software for rent collection? I gotta say I'm a little disappointed with replies here. If you don't know the answer you don't need to reply. It's that simple. I specifically requested to not mention anything regarding different ways of how to collect utility or rent. And just focus on my unique question of utility separation and any software that can do that or if this is question for utility companies which I will ask them at some time. 

I'm a little put off from my very first forum post. 


Post: How to split utitility costs between landlord and Tenants

Kyle Schreur
Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Grand Rapids MI
  • Posts 6
  • Votes 1
Quote from @Nathan Gesner:
Quote from @Kyle Schreur:

There's more detail in my book, but here's a taste.

HOW TO SHARE UTILITIES 101

You have a property with two or more units and the utility meters are shared. There are a few options.

1. Pay to separately meter the utility. This can be very expensive and is usually the worst choice because you can't justify the cost.

2. Charge the tenants a higher rent rate and include utilities with their rent. This is the simplest method, but it also means your tenants are more likely to abuse the utilities by leaving windows open with the heat or A/C running, leaving lights on, ignoring the toilet that constantly flushes on its own, etc.

3. Pay the bill yourself, then reimburse yourself by charging the tenants based on a formula. This takes a little more work, but it's the fairest and reduces the likelihood of tenants that squander utilities.

If you choose #2 or #3, there are considerations:

Start with an average. Use varies throughout the year. Heating costs go up in winter, as does electricity due to the reduced natural light and more people indoors. Electricity can also spike in the summer with A/C. Contact the utility provider and get a historical average based on the last year of use. It won't be 100% accurate, but it will be close enough. I recommend you do this annually to adjust for utility increases and other variables. If your average heating bill is $150, you may not collect enough in the winter months when the bill reaches $225 but you'll collect extra in the summer when it drops to $65. If you base your tenant charges on the historical average, you should come very close to collecting the entire amount over a one-year period.

Charge a higher rate. If the water bill is $100 a month, increase the price by 20% (or whatever you decide is fair) to compensate you for the time required to split and bill and to cover additional use when tenants squander the utility. If the bill is $100 a month split between four units, increase it to $120 and charge each tenant $30.

How to calculate charges. Don't make it more complicated than it has to be. If you have four 2-bed/1-bath units with the same appliances, split it four ways and call it a day. You can make minor adjustments based on the type of appliances (dishwasher, clothes washer and dryer, air conditioning, etc.) and the size of the rental. If Apartment A is a 2-bed/1-bath with a washer/dryer and Apartment B is a 1-bed/1-bath with no washer/dryer, Apartment A should pay a higher rate. Another option is to split the cost based on the number of occupants in each unit but this also means you'll need to adjust the charges as tenants move in/out, so it requires more work and I wouldn't recommend it. I recommend a simple spreadsheet to check your math and it will make it simple to adjust each year.

End the complaints. Tenants may complain about your method of calculating how much each unit pays. They think it's unfair because they only shower once a week but can hear the upstairs neighbor showering twice daily. You can end this by showing them an actual utility bill. Why? Because a large percentage of the charges are base fees that do not change based on use!

I just looked at a utility bill with a total charge of $184.12 but $116.50 is from base fees! If I divide this bill by four units, each tenant would pay $46.03. If they were separately metered, each tenant would pay the $116.50 base fees and their individual use, which would be 3x higher than what they pay when sharing a meter.

There are many options, but don't make it more complicated than it needs to be. Tenants save money when using a shared meter, so there's plenty of room for error when calculating how to distribute the charges.

Thanks for yout input! Like I've said in my original post I understand all the different methods and reasons for each. My main question now is how can I bill back tenants with keeping the utilities in my name? Is there software that does that? Do I set that up through each utility company? Perhaps I'm making this more complicated than I need? Just need to know the best method to bill back tenants. 

Post: How to split utitility costs between landlord and Tenants

Kyle Schreur
Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Grand Rapids MI
  • Posts 6
  • Votes 1
Quote from @Michael K Gallagher:

@Kyle Schreur you can ultimatley do whatever you'd like, but whatever you do and whatever the arrangment should be put into writing.  

In general I'd not suggest the above regarding "contributing" to utilities.  It is common and customary acrossa almost all rentals except some A class office to pay your share of utilities.

Now you can make whatever arangment you'd like and work it out however you want with your tenant but if you are going to "share costs" I'd suggest keeping the utilities in your name, and then "back billing" the tenants for that share of their usage, but again thats a lot of work for really no gain in my book.

My recommendation would be to simply have the tenants pay all utilities.  If you want to offer a "rebate" of some kind after they stay up to date for certain amount of time, I'm more inclined to go that way, but in general theres no real good reason to put yourself as the owner in the middle of the utilities unless they aren't metered in a way to bill directly.  


 Thanks for the reply! I appreciate your thoughts. Would you know of any software or apps that make it easy for billing back tenants? Any resources you can direct me to on how to set it up that way? 

Post: How to split utitility costs between landlord and Tenants

Kyle Schreur
Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Grand Rapids MI
  • Posts 6
  • Votes 1

Hey so I have been googeling around and doing research but I can't seem to find a good answer or any information. It might come down to how I'm typing up the question and Google keeps finding me results that have a more general answer. But my question is more nuanced. I'm specifically wondering if it's possible to set up utility accounts where I can contribute a flat specified amount for electric gas water etc. For example 100 dollars flat amount. And then the tenants pay the more variable amounts so it takes me out of the equation if they decide to use more energy during certain times. I feel like that's a win win for both the landlord and tenant. It kinda creates a much smaller threshold for the tenant to save money if they were to keep an eye on their usage since I'm paying a large chunk of it, while also being able to keep any eye on how much they spend so it gives them that personal incentive to watch their usages. It benefits me for the obvious fact of bookkeeping and giving me predictable fixed costs. I'm looking for properties to rent out bedrooms and I understand the benefits of just including utilities in the rent, baking it in. I also understand all the reasons why that's the case. So please for the sake of time and efficiency let's leave those answers alone if we can. Would anyone know how to set it up using my idea? Is there any software, websites, or do I have to contact each utility company separately and set it up that way? I've heard of platforms that allow the landlord to bill the tenants for the utilities so it's still in there name. Any information you can share would be appreciated! 

A) is it even possible

B) any resources you can direct me to if it is possible 

C) what software or website is there that sets that up

Thank you!

Post: Introducing myself to Bigger Pockets!

Kyle Schreur
Posted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Grand Rapids MI
  • Posts 6
  • Votes 1

Hello! My Name is Kyle and Im completing my first steps registering with Bigger Pockets! I'm new and heard about Bigger Pockets a few years ago and have been getting more and more into it lately. I listen to the podcast every single day! I've been learning allot over the last few years and thought it was about time I join. I bought my first primary back in 2019 and converted it into a rental last year May 2023. It's been going well. Learning as I go. And I made an appointment with my loan officer this coming wednsday. So wish me luck 🙏 I'm excited to learn a whole lot and hopefully meet allot of people through here! Hope yall have a wondeful day!