All Forum Posts by: Joanne Tsai

USLI definately does more than 10 properties. I thought they were one of the largest umbrella companies but you’ll certainly find them with any Google search.

I did have to leave them last year because they had a $1million max liability if any rentals have a pool. So I had to switch to Hudson who I hadn’t heard of but also does more than 10 properties. I’m using them with a $5million limit.

Ps. Some umbrella companies have switched their base insurance requirement from $300/300 to $500/500k.

@Bill B.

thanks! I am def checking it out.

1 Vote

Quote from @Ryan B.:

Just look for a commercial umbrella. It will do the same thing. I have a personal umbrella and a commercial umbrella from State Farm.

oh cool, let me check that out. thanks!

0 Votes

Quote from @Owen Rosen:

Quote from @Joanne Tsai:

Hello BP fellow,

Recently my husband and I were told by our insurance agent that since we just reached our 10 properties, we will no longer be eligible for purchasing a conventional umbrella insurance shall we decide to buy another rental property. This sounds a little weird to me, but after calling a few other insurance companies, it seems the threshold of 10 is fairly common.

We currently own the rentals under our own names (instead of LLC), and we've heard from enough podcasters to skip LLCs and get a big umbrella insurance. I just want to check with the group, are you finding the same challenge with getting an umbrella insurance with increase amount of properties. What do you do to get around it? which insurance company? is there a solution to this?

Thanks!

Joanne

There are insurance companies that will insure more than 10 properties on a personal umbrella but it can be tricky based on the companies providing the underlying insurance, the makeup of the portfolio, the state you're in, etc. It's also likely to be more expensive than what you have now but that's all relative.

@Owen Rosen thanks! is it possible to share the insurance companies which would be willing to provide such policy? we haven't got any luck with our own search. thanks!

0 Votes

Hello BP fellow,

Thanks!

Joanne

4 Votes

Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:

Quote from @Theresa Harris:

What about a metal fence? Not chain link, but galvanized metal. A few of my neighbours have them and they look quite nice. Cost may be higher, but you don't have to paint/stain them, so maintenance costs are a lot lower.

Or a rusted metal fence? Those are becoming popular. The panels are shiny when you put them up and quickly acquire a nice patina. All you need are 4'x4's every 8 ft and (2) 3'x6' panels turned sideways. Quick, cheap and easy. I've done a few of these.....they look good for modern properties as well as rustic style....

https://www.cor-ten-steel.co.n...

@Theresa Harris

Hey Bruce,

I have tried to explore your suggestion here, and several vendors I called said they don't know where to get material.

Would you be kind enough to share your suppliers?

Thanks!

Joanne

0 Votes

Arlington, Texas

Thanks for all the good suggestions, the house does not have a HOA and it's really up to us what we want to put up (though does require a permit). It's in a B neighborhood for working class but a pretty neighborhood in general. Right now we have three graduate students in it as it's close to a sizable university.

1 Vote

Arlington, Texas

Quote from @Theresa Harris:

Hi Theresa,

do you mean steel panels that will still provide the privacy, or the bars that one can see-through? Thanks!

0 Votes

Arlington, Texas

Thanks everyone for your input.

Here where we live, most people have either vinyl or wood, and we have vinyl ourselves, and just the look itself is so much better than aged wood fence, and we don't have to treat/seal and all that good stuff. Just wondering why it's not popular in TX. The cost of the wood fence is a little higher than we expected, but the maintenance is a bigger headache.

on a separate note, I thought lumber price has come down drastically, when would that reflect the price at Home Depot? we had put up a wood fence for another property in 2020 in a supposedly more expensive state, and the price was so much lower.....

0 Votes

Arlington, Texas

Hi All,

Thanks any inputs in advance.

this property is in DFW area. and we have a rental that has a pretty worn down wood fence. We are thinking of replacing it, and quite a sticker shock if you may..... we got several quotes, but everyone is quoting another wood fence, and many companies told us they don't do vinyl. is wood the preferred material in DFW? I find it ugly and it takes a lot of maintenance. Is fence really ROI positive for a rental? has anyone done a ROI on this? and also would a chain link fence work?

Thanks!

Joanne

0 Votes

Arlington, Texas

Quote from @Joe Villeneuve:

Quote from @Marek Kucharski:

My wife and I have three houses that we rent out. This journey started about 10 years ago. We have 15-year mortgages on these. The houses are worth about $800K (TX). We are very happy with how these houses appreciated; we put very little money down and were rewarded handsomely. Of course, this was no bed of roses: we put a lot of work into these - roof leaks, flooded floors, painting, clogged toilets, annoying tenants - you name it.

Today, we are contemplating selling one house and putting the profits into SP500. What makes us contemplate this is some back testing. For example:
- The first house was purchased in 2013 for $145K. That house is now worth $280K.
- If I was to invest $145K in SP500 in 2013, I would have about $500K

I know that the past is not the prologue, but I also know that historically housing trails the SP500. That said, in 2013, we were fresh out of grad school and did not have $145K to invest in the market. So, buying a house with 5% down was the only option. Today, we could sell one house or more and invest a larger sum for the long haul.

We have tenants moving out in the spring and we are considering selling. The house in question happens to be a house we lived in recently and we could sell it and not pay taxes on the sale. Do you think we should pull the trigger and put the money into the market? Thank you for your advice.

Relevant details:

- Household income about $250K, which means that we cannot deduct rental losses

- All houses have 15-year mortgages , which means that they do not cash flow well. We are either in the red or breaking even depending on luck in a given your. Tenants are paying off our mortgage.

- We could also sell, invest the money, and buy another rental (re-leverage)

You're initial assumptions are way off (math), and just gets worse from there.

Assumption #1 = "If I was to invest $145K in SP500 in 2013, I would have about $500K"
Fact #1 = If you invested $145k in RE in 2013, it would be worth $725k in 2013.

Assumption #2 - "All houses have 15-year mortgages , which means that they do not cash flow well"
Fact #2 - The poor cash flow was more likely due to the 15 years mortgage than anything else. Why would you do a 15 year mortgage when you could have gone with a 30 year mortgage, with a lower monthly payment? You said yourself, "...Tenants are paying off our mortgage".

yes, the first question I have reading your post is why would you do 15 year mortgage and not focus on cash flow? Some "expert" even advocates "refi till you die", the strategy is to have the smallest % of money down and still make it cash flow.

1 Vote

Houston, Texas

All Forum Posts by: Joanne Tsai

Joanne Tsai has started 19 posts and replied 135 times.

Post: can no longer purchase umbrella insurance after 10 properties?

Post: can no longer purchase umbrella insurance after 10 properties?

Post: can no longer purchase umbrella insurance after 10 properties?

Post: can no longer purchase umbrella insurance after 10 properties?

Post: Fence necessary in a rental?

Post: Fence necessary in a rental?

Post: Fence necessary in a rental?

Post: Fence necessary in a rental?

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