All Forum Posts by: Trevis Kelley

I just want to reply to everyone here.  First of all, thank all of you for all the advice.  What an amazing group of people here!  I have been reading both Dave Ramsey and Mr. Money Mustache.  We moved to reduce our expenses, drive a 10+-year-old fuel-efficient vehicle, and don't have expensive cable or cell phone bills.  We grow and can a decent amount of our food and eating out is nearly non-existant (on rare special occasions).  My wife takes lunch to work.  I didn't realize how much other people buy a $5 coffee every day, but we make ours at home.  We have done a lot lately to turn our situation around.

Most of our debt is in student loans, credit cards, and medical bills.  A good chunk of it is from our own stupidity, though some of it is because of circumstance.  We made a choice to control what we can control and make it work for us as best as possible.  The student loans and medical bills don't seem to want to work with us much and we are basically stuck at about 9% average interest on those.  We have managed to get the credit cards down to 3%.  Because the majority of our debt is in the medical and student loans (about $85,000), we are paying a ridiculous amount in interest on those.  We are also paying extra on those, but still over 5 years away from paying it all off.  We are still tweaking budgets, finding more ways to be more efficient, but I feel like the expenses side is pretty well handled.

So, we need to work on the income side.  After reading through a lot of creative and ridiculously good suggestions (barndominium stood out - wife's not comfortable with it though), I am down to three things:

1.  Cold calling for investors/agents.  This was a part of being a RE agent that I actually enjoyed.  Sure, every once in a while you had to talk to someone who was completely mean, but most of the time people were generally nice and I got to hear all sorts of stories that were interesting.  Moving people from trusting me to getting them to buy a home was difficult for me short-term but I kept in touch with them and they would turn it around.  I would love to learn from some investors how they make that turn more quickly.

2.  Wholesaling.  This can be unpopular in certain circles, I guess.  However, I can't find much that could generate cash as quickly.  Still researching legal ramifications for my state.  Won't do it if Missouri law says not to - and will strictly follow any laws that I need to if I do pursue it.

3.  Spreadsheet work.  This was mentioned here.  I didn't know people were getting paid solely to make/upkeep spreadsheets.  Not exactly sure where to start with something like that, but if there are investors that would like spreadsheets, I am happy to make them.  Currently looking to Google to tell me more about that, and will reach out to some investors I know to see if that would be in demand.

Thank you to everyone here for all your advice.  I went from trying to figure out what next step I am able to take to having to choose from a plethora of next steps.  It's been a good transition and flurry of activity learning as much as I can about each option mentioned.  I now have hope that I will be able to start working in RE right away and then really start investing again in a couple of years.

 This is absolutely something I would be interested in.  I know that's one of the suckier parts for people, but I like asking questions and listening.  It was also one of the few parts of being an agent that I didn't mind so much.  I would want some metrics to hit for amount of calls made per day, amount of people talked to, how many lead to deals, etc.  I would also want to know what would qualify as a deal that would be interesting, etc.

I have a decent grasp on how sales funnels work, but could always learn more on how to best move people through them.  The things I could learn doing that sort of job would be just as valuable as any sort of money I would make (though I would need some of that too).

I would be interested in talking with anyone here about that.  I'm also going to jump on talking with some RE agents and some investors in my area to see if any of them need that kind of service.

Thanks again for the suggestions!  This community has always been awesome!

I am trying to see the solutions here, as I don't like to focus on problems.  My wife cannot take on extra clients in our home unless we spend a lot to build out the space to do that or she wants to put her license at risk.  She is also already putting in 40-45 hours per week at her job, about 15 hours taking care of farm stuff, and then another 10 or so on general around the house work I cannot do.  She's about stretched to her limit at the moment.  This is partly why we need to find a way to replace her job income.

As for money not being that hard to get, I used to be in that boat.  Since becoming disabled though, it's been a lot harder to see the solutions.  It used to be I could just get a side job lifting heavy things if I needed extra cash.  Now, it's not so much - unless someone has ways they can point me in.  I'm trying to find something that would be work from home that isn't writing (I have been told that my writing sucks) or call center (as they want a perfectly silent environment and I don't have one).

My wife's mindset is that we have already taken thousands of dollars, stuck it somewhere for a long time, and didn't see much of a return (as opposed to just getting a nice, safe ETF or index fund).  She is aware that I learned a lot of valuable lessons on that journey, but she is not ready to just jump into doing that again.  She wants to see a proof of concept and then she will be much more interested in going back in.  I can understand her perspective there.  If I can find a way to make a few thousand dollars in a RE deal, she's all for taking that money to make more in RE.

I may go poke around some other places to see if I can find a way to generate some income in other ways so that I can build a more solid foundation.  I just need to find something that I can actually do that will get me there.

This is what I feared I would hear.  Do you have much experience with wholesaling?  Is that a technique that is not used much anymore?  I need to accelerate my ability to pay down debt so I can get into something sooner.  Maybe I need to find something else to make money and then circle back.

Teresa,

Thanks for the reply!

My daughter now lives halfway across the country from us with her fiance.  I have the budget put together, and we are down to bare minimum for stuff.  We live in a house on some acreage (paying $520/mo on a 20 year mortgage), raising chickens and planting veggies for our food.  We spend $250/mo feeding our family of 3.  Looking at everything, I have no idea how we could minimize much more.  We have been trying to do as much as we can from the Mr. Money Moustache blog.

As far as earning more, my wife works full time and then comes home to do some of the farming stuff I can't do.  So a second job for her is probably out.  As for me, I have been unsuccessful at trying to return to work, mostly due to having a week or so of not physically able to get out of bed.  I return, and not too much later I don't have a job.  No reason given, though I know why it happens.  Don't blame them, as the last 10 years has confirmed that I can no longer do a conventional job.

My son is involved, he's seen our budget and how we are doing things.  It's a good start and I think once he starts working he'll be able to save a good bit.  I'd love to be able to show him what to do with it and I think RE is a decent place to go with it.  I just want to have done it successfully myself first.  We are 10 years away from having enough of the debt paid off to be able to get our credit in line and could be another couple of years before the score comes back.  I was hoping to have RE help us accelerate that some so that I can teach him when the time comes.

I guess I'm just looking for other ways to get a jumpstart.  I'm attending a few different meetups in my area, I'll see if some investors need some wholesale or something done.  Maybe I'll check for a hard money lender to do a flip or two.  I'm still going to continue reading and learning.  I haven't heard much about people in my position getting into RE, but there must be a way to do it.

Warning - this may be a long post - I will try to section it off.  I have an on/off relationship with RE as I've always been drawn to it and always screwed it up - and then listened to those in my life who told me that it was not for me and I should just quit.  I'm tired of being a quitter and something needs to change in my life - now.  I've made a promise to myself that this is the time to get this RE thing right and create wealth that changes my family tree and I intend to keep it no matter how many times I screw it up going forward.  I've finally got the mindset, but I have destroyed my credit, have no savings, decent income, but it's all being eaten up by debt payment.  I'm 37, spent my whole life working and I've got $100,000 in debt and a negative net worth to show for it.  RE represents a way out.

It all starts, however, with the first move. I have been looking at wholesaling until I have enough to fund my first deal. I would eventually like to get into doing BRRRR, but without being able to get the conventional refinance loans (due to bad credit), that would be out. Just trying to work out the best method to get this started.

Some Background:

I am a disabled Veteran.  I have physical issues that prevent me from doing most traditional work.  I have a wife that will be supportive once she sees the first check (until then she doesn't want me spending more than a couple hundred on anything related to this).  I have been a property manager (which I hated), worked for a buy and hold investor for a bit helping find properties and shadowing (which I loved), and just recently did a stint as a real estate agent (which I loved talking to people who weren't agents, but hated the politics in the office).  I have also bought and sold 5 properties, mostly breaking even over my small investing career.  I eventually learned that deal analysis and buying is where the money really is.

I have a wife and a 10-year-old son who lives with us and a 22-year-old daughter who is struggling a lot in her life.  Having a disabled dad who couldn't always be there for her (left the Air Force 10 years ago) didn't help, I'm sure.  I need to help her out financially, but cannot yet.  I also want to show my son a path to wealth-building that will allow him to live the kind of life he wants to live.  As he is 10, I don't think I have a whole lot of time left to really get that through to him.

Wife is a hair stylist and makes about $24,000/yr.  She would like to move to having her own salon or paying for her own chair, but we cannot afford that yet.  I bring in about $36,000/yr from disability and other sources.  I have a lot of free time to work on this.

Why Real Estate:

I love people and hearing their stories.  I am usually a listener and try to understand where someone else is coming from.  I am the type that will try to solve other people's problems, tending to think about solutions for not only a specific situation, but for the group of people that may fall into that type of scenario.

I also love numbers and spreadsheets.  If left alone, I could spend all day tweaking a spreadsheet.  I have had to learn over the years how to ensure that I focus on the 20% that gets 80% of the business.  However, I am great with numbers and can usually sense when the numbers are off even if I haven't completely worked out the math.

Lastly, being a military man through and through, I fell in love with systems.  I would much rather have a system with metrics that I know how to hit than blindly walking into something and just taking a guess.  It is my way to cut through the chaos that normally exists otherwise.  Over the past decade, I have had to work on being flexible while also adhering to a system.  It's still a work in progress, but I have gotten better.

How I would like to invest:

I recently saw the BP podcast with Joe Asamoah and loved his idea of buying a 3br, turning it into a 5br, fixing it up nice, and then going with Section 8 tenants. I would love to help poor people get great housing. My market here in Missouri is a little less good for that sort of thing, but I thought it was interesting and would really like to find that sort of solution around here. I am definitely hooked on the idea of BRRRR investing for building wealth and cashflow.

What I am looking for now:

I don't know how exactly to get from where I am now to doing BRRRR investing. Would wholesaling right now be a good way to increase my income? I've never done it before. Is there some other investment vehicles that would build me some income that I could do now? Are there any other suggestions / other stuff I might be missing? I am ready to do whatever I physically can to begin this. Do I need to knock on doors? Can do. Call people? No problem. Go to meetup groups? Already started. Any advice is very much appreciated!

That's part of the problem. The loan is a VA loan, but it is neither a fannie or freddie owned loan. Ocwen services it, and they determined that I can afford it (of course, they counted the income from the rental and excluded maintenance costs). I am unsure who finally owns it, only that I originated it with USAA (who has also been unhelpful - pushing it off to Ocwen).

Again, I would rather avoid the short sale or foreclosure situation.  I am in school right now and would like to purchase another home down the road.  I am not going to be able to do that if my credit is ruined.  Just trying to find other options that would be less expensive right now and release my current obligation to this property.

I have been trying to figure out how to get rid of my underwater home for a while.  I recently became disabled, and moved away from a mortgage I could no longer afford.  I have luckily found a renter to help make the payment (still about $150 short per month).  I can afford this amount just fine, it's everything else that bothers me.  A little info:

Home has a current mortgage of $98,000 with a monthly payment (PITI) of $875 (been going up lately due to insurance and tax rate hikes). Home is worth $85,000 or so.

Home is in a neighborhood that has only been decreasing in value.  When this home was purchased (early 2007), neighborhood was nice and on the rise.  When the crash happened, this neighborhood was hit hard with foreclosures and short sales.  It is now a poorer neighborhood and will probably get poorer with time.

I am tired of pouring money into this place, as maintenance seems to be fairly high (partly due to neighborhood, partly to my own stupidity - bought something I shouldn't have because "it looked pretty").  Taxes and insurance keep going up, even with my challenging taxes and shopping around for insurance.  Property is in another state as well, so I have a property manager to help me deal with the day-to-day.  Yet another expense.  I don't particularly like not being able to actually see the condition of the property either.

My thought was to try to sell it at the current mortgage price and have the buyer loan out the $13000 or so still owed.  Or try to get a bank loan.  I would have to keep the payment amount at $200/mo or less for this to even make sense.  Is this even possible?  Are there alternatives?  I have talked to the bank about a short sale, and they don't want to do one, even though I threatened to walk away.  I would rather come up with a solution that allows me to uphold my end of the contract anyway, but one that doesn't cost me this much.  Every year, I watch my owed amount go down at the same rate as my house value.

Please help!

@Aaron Montague 

That's what I am doing.  I am actually entertaining another property.  I have the new deal posted here.  It is better than the last one, I think.  Just need some advice to help navigate some of the issues, and I think it will be a winner.

Thank you all for the help!

@Mike D'Arrigo @Bram Spiero @Account Closed 

Any advice on this deal?  The area is on the map linked here.  Anyone have info on this area?  Thank you everyone!