All Forum Posts by: Daniel Keating

a little of each--mostly a share---it's just like watching a train wreck in slow motion. When he purchased the units I advised that small mitsubishi AC units were relatively inexpensive and would attract tenants more than evap. He raised the rent on the middle unit--they moved and he had a lengthy vacancy in a soft rental market. the rental loss would have paid for 2 ac units to be installed.
Now he is looking at $1100 for mold remediation and about $750 for the roof if not more--plus the additional drywall of the hallway and inside of a bedroom closet plus the original ceiling job in the livingroom.
Oh..and more fun..the angry tenant called in code enforcement. He now has electrical outlets to replace--more old water damage to repair under the sinks, carpet seams to redo (trip hazard), a water heater was replaced a while back--no permit was pulled... and other assorted repairs with a 30 day deadline on those.... shaking head...

Hello Folks,
I look after property for a friend of mine who's absentee. I am not a professional property manager in the strict sense that I do not have limited power of attorney--I do not collect the rents and disperse funds and I have no maintenance fund at my disposal. Over a year ago a tenant wanted a ceiling fan in her livingroom. We discovered that the sheet-rock/ceiling board was "cheesy" in that it was crumbly and felt like it was a tad moist/had been wet at some time previously (not soaking wet/active leak). We were unable to attach a fan as any wobble of it moving was causing the wallboard to open up more.
I stopped at that point and notified him that this was not a "spackle job" and that we should defer to tradesmen.
I warned him that we don't know what's up behind there.
The guys put in a bid of $800 to take the affected area of the ceiling down and build back/plaster/paint. We have the bid in writing.
My friend weasled out that he didn't have the money to do it and was brushing it off as a cosmetic repair. I have emails where I have asked periodically that he try to find the money to fix it.
Fast forward to modern times and I discovered on the roof that one of the evap cooler feed lines has a slow seepage from some compression fitting dribbling on the roof. He ok'd the fix. That saturday I had a guy out to asses parts needed etc. The next night at 10pm the tenant calls & we have a sudden leak of water from the evaporative cooler float that stuck and this same tenant has water coming out the ducting.
They open up the ceiling and we have black mold--rotting plywood behind roofing material and behind the affected ceiling fan area.
He's trying to play the "I didn't know" game and had to remind him that he has a bid, in writing, for a repair of near $1000 bucks so "something" had to be going on to be a repair of that gravity over a year ago.
This guy is a lawsuit looking to happen and I don't see the insurance covering any of it....

Hi Harry,
Thanks for your input--yes, he is in a bind financially but he's also trying to justify in his mind that I should not be paid in some areas. For example, I have one tenant that I found who is handy and has replaced toilet flappers and leaky washers etc himself. The only times I've had to really intercede was to make a extra set of keys when he lost his and also to meet a AC contractor. In my friends mind since that unit has been trouble free I don't deserve any pay.
I pointed out to him that other units have not been and I have had to make multiple calls to them with no additional pay..so to be paid for every unit is fair.
Imagine if you had contracted to PM a 40 unit apt building for a rate of $3000 a year and only 20 required attention other than lease-ups. Does $1500 a year sound fair?
I tried to point out the recently I had to go to one vacant unit 3 times in the last month for initial cleanup of abandoned junk , to meet the carpet cleaner and then for wipe-down and detail cleaning/mopping/refigerator/stove/patio etc. The one day I was there 6 hours cleaning and waiting for a prospective tenent. I put a nominal value on my time at $15 an hour (this is what I make as a software tech support agent). That one day should have paid me $90 plus mileage --not even considering the other times I went there AND his other triplex. He took exception with that and IMMEDIATELY threw up "We've been friends..." without even considering the value of my time etc.

I feel for his situation but my truck was not free, no one gives me free gas and I've been reluctant to front out expenses for materials etc and fear that I'll get a sob story that he can't pay me for my expenses--let alone what we agreed upon for my wages.

Sounds pretty similar to my situation Vicki--the original deal was that I was going to look after the properties "until they moved down here"...which did not happen.
Early on a unit was vacant and a co-worker of mine wanted the place but wanted it painted before moving in (yes it needed it). I was in the process of closing on our then new house and had zero time to paint a 900sq ft condo interior. I sought bids and got the place professionally painted for $1400 which was lowest of the 3 bids (1800 and 2100 respectively). Perhaps I could have gotten a functional alcoholic with a roller to do it for $900 but what if they trip on a paint bucket and douse the carpet or tile? No economy there.
My friends thought they were being ripped off--like they expected ME to paint the unit single handed for the little percentage I get. And then work free for the rest of the year..?
Later that same year another unit was vacant and they came down to help me paint to save them $$. I was lapping my friend and honestly, I think he was going to have a heart-attack--he was actually getting winded from painting. We had fans & windows open--no issues there. He just was not used to working in the relative heat of a Tucson August.
I looked at him and asked if he still thought he had gotten ripped off on his previous paint job....considering this one was nearly killing him.
His wife saw that I was doing the lion's share of the job and was actually feeling a little guilty at that moment.

Justin--that pretty much hits the nail on the head...I expect to be treated no better than a stranger as far as pay goes and because he is a friend I would do more--thats just me.
In the last couple of years I have worked for LESS than what a stranger would get and I have been on roofs messing with evap coolers, painting interiors of units, hanging doors/security doors (one solid core door on a laundry room was approx 80lbs and I wrestled that single handed). I have cleaned out eviction units, filed court papers, been threatened by tenants, cleaned ductwork, replaced faucets and power outlets, ceiling fans , woken up at 1am dealing with drunk tenants on the phone etc etc etc.
When I confronted him last night he made the statement that "one unit has had no trouble/I've had to spend no time there" which is true --but other units have consumed MORE time so it evens out--as long as I am paid. A property manager that can keep stable tenants that don't cause repairs to be needed should be paid just as well.

Also..I've been covering the costs of materials out of pocket and while I have been getting reimbursed timely for that it's my understanding that most management firms require a maintenance fund be setup for these incidental expenses.

I'm not a property manager in a strict sense of the word--maybe not even by legal definition.
1. I have no power of attorney agreement to represent my friend in court
2. I do not collect the rents and dispurse funds.
3. I do not have an expense fund to do repairs.
I'm basically the local contact person--I do screen tenants, show the unit and maintain the keys and locks. I do light repairs unless it's major. My friend phones in a credit card if the tradesman is needed.
The tenants call me first if there is an issue with a unit.
I'll get bids on a job if it's major.

Thank you everyone for your replies..so everyone sort of understands the relationship:
I'm 50 years of age and my friend is a few years older--we have known each other since I was 14--he was the best man at my wedding and in past times we were room-mates---a lot of history.
I cautioned him about being a landlord and stated that he ideally would need a certain number of properties--in case of a lengthy vacancy, eviction, damaged unit. Plus the income from a given property would be used to help pay the expenses/taxes of the others. I also cautioned him on having no debt service--pay cash for his own home and not overspend on it--leaving him more cushion. He did not heed my advice... I also did NOT plan on doing this as a pro for extended period of time--he was supposed to move down here where he could take over the duties and save what he was paying me. As a friend, I would have, of course been there to help if it was a 2-man job or if he needed my pickup truck to haul a refrigerator etc. He's been using his remote distance as a reason to not even want to come down & help.
As some of you know Tucson is a spread-out area. His properties are a 50 mile round trip for me with a 1.5 hour drive time back & forth to get across town---he wasn't even considering that when he would ask me to post a 5 day notice on a tenants door. I actually had to tell him he needs to drive to his local post office (a few blocks for him) and pay $3.25 for a certified mail service as this would be more cost effective. He was of the attitude that I'm paying you something and now I'm paying extra. I had to point out that ANY property manager (unless they lived on-site) would do this the same way. We went round and round that the tenant can refuse to sign for it etc.. I finally had to spell it out that in court you need to prove that you attempted to serve them. He then tried to email the notice to the tenant with read receipt!! Like that's admissable in court...
The guy doesn't want to spend any money and is just being a bit stupid about it.

He stated recently that they did look at getting another property manager and the guy wanted $65 a month for the one unit that's currently vacant (which is 10% of that rent) but would rather give me the money--OK $65 a month over a years time is $780 a year to manage one unit. Not $1000 for managing 5...

Hi Tom,
Thanks for your reply. Yes, in retrospect I should have been adamant about collecting the rents and removing my percentage right off the top.
Correct me if I'm wrong but most management firms do exactly that and also require a maintenance fund be setup (like a $300 stipend) to cover a major appliance failure so the manager doesn't incur it out of pocket.
Also--they don't paint/make repairs out of that percentage fee. I think he's going to be in for an eye-opener.

Hi Folks, I live in Tucson and have 2 rental properties I own and manage. A friend of mine owns 5 rentals in town and he lives in Payson--about a 3 hour drive so I look over his properties.
Originally the plan was that I would look after them until he moved here (we are both originally from Calif) but his wife did not want to live in the desert--so here I am looking after them still.
I cautioned him that to make a living at this he would need at least 8 properties , and preferably pay cash for his home--he only has the 5 and paid waaay too much for his Payson home.
For the last 10 months I have not seen a dime--he had full occupancy until recently. He recently told me he'd be sending me a check for 1000 bucks--umm thats like $16 per month per unit. We agreed on 10%. Plus I have been doing repairs (hanging security screens, replacing doors, light plumbing, paint etc) as well as being on call and arranging tradesmen for stuff I can't fix.
We've been friends for a long time but this is putting a strain on things as you can imagine--how would some of you approach this?