Skip to content
×
PRO
Pro Members Get Full Access!
Get off the sidelines and take action in real estate investing with BiggerPockets Pro. Our comprehensive suite of tools and resources minimize mistakes, support informed decisions, and propel you to success.
Advanced networking features
Market and Deal Finder tools
Property analysis calculators
Landlord Command Center
$0
TODAY
$69.00/month when billed monthly.
$32.50/month when billed annually.
7 day free trial. Cancel anytime
Already a Pro Member? Sign in here
Pick markets, find deals, analyze and manage properties. Try BiggerPockets PRO.
x
All Forum Categories
All Forum Categories
Followed Discussions
Followed Categories
Followed People
Followed Locations
Market News & Data
General Info
Real Estate Strategies
Landlording & Rental Properties
Real Estate Professionals
Financial, Tax, & Legal
Real Estate Classifieds
Reviews & Feedback

All Forum Posts by: Chunyan Song

Chunyan Song has started 1 posts and replied 12 times.

Post: Buying Multifamily in San Francisco?

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2

Familiarize yourself with the rental ordinance in SF first. Rent control, very strict eviction and buyout rules. If you take a wrong move it can decrease the value of the property. 

Good deals on multi family are very rare in Sf. It’s hard to find one that’s even cash flow positive, forget about the cap rates you see in BP discussions in other areas. Unless you put 50% down or something but then if you have that cash there are so many better ways to invest 

Post: Should I legalize my in-law unit in SF?

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2

Your architect is right SFH fetches higher value than with an in law unit. If it's a classic duplex, you can condo convert in certain situations. But in-law can't

Post: Anyone with an ADU (Accessory Dwelling Unit) build experience?

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2

Be mindful with Airbnb as well. SF short term rental rules treat it as a separate unit, so you must rent for > 30 days for each reservation. 

Post: Anyone with an ADU (Accessory Dwelling Unit) build experience?

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2

If condo conversion is your ultimate goal, you might run into trouble with ADU, as opposed to a regular cookie cutter duplex. Consult an attorney specialized in SF condo conversion

Post: THE Thread on the Final GOP Tax Bill - Q&A

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2

About “debt acquisition” requirement on the home equity loan interest deduction, does it have to be a purchase? 

what if I take home equity loan from my primary residence to renovate/expand a rental home I already own? Or using it to build a rental home on a land I already own?  Is the interest deductible? 

Post: Can I do 1031 after subdivision?

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2
Thank you so much Dave! We are planning to rent it out for a bit after construction to establish intent. Hope it works out!

Post: Can I do 1031 after subdivision?

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2
PS: at the time of subdivision, I would have owned the house for 2 years and it’s rented out the whole time.

Post: Can I do 1031 after subdivision?

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2
My partner and I own a rental SFH in Seattle area. We are going to do subdivision and split the lot into 2. I can do 1031 exchange at this point right? We are also entertaining the idea of tearing down the existing house, and building two houses on the split lots. If I tear down, build and sell, can I still do 1031 exchange when selling?

Post: THE Thread on the Final GOP Tax Bill - Q&A

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2
Originally posted by @Joe Splitrock:
Originally posted by @Chunyan Song:
Originally posted by @Joe Splitrock:
Originally posted by @Brandon Hall:

So my team and I have literally been sitting around all day to dream up new strategies for our clients (who are all real estate investors).

Here's one that we've come up with.

For new acquisitions, if the rental will likely generate passive losses, allocate more basis to land and take less depreciation. 

The new pass-through deduction is a freebie. But the deduction is only available if you have net taxable income after all expenses, including depreciation and amortization. 

So when you buy the next property, allocate more basis to land. This will reduce your depreciation expense. But if you have a smart tax advisor, you can likely net out the lost depreciation expense with this new freebie deduction. 

The tax benefit is realized on the sell-side. When you liquidate a rental, you pay depreciation recapture taxes on the depreciation you've taken over the life of the rental. 

So if you report less depreciation over the hold period, you pay less recapture taxes in the end. But best of all, it didn't hurt you during the hold period because you utilized this new freebie deduction each year to bring your taxable income down to $0.

Note: this is not a relevant strategy if you purchase property that is likely to produce high amounts of net income after depreciation every year (NNN, Commerical, Large Apartments, Short-Term Rentals).

Second Note: more planning will be required for folks that want to utilize cost segregation. You don't want to crush it on the cost seg side and not be able to utilize this freebie deduction because you no longer have net income to report. 

This is an interesting strategy, but I see two issues:

1.  I understand the IRS gives latitude on how you allocate value between land and structure. For example my county taxes split land and structure. I use the land value and subtract that from the purchase price to get basis. It is logical, defendable and consistent on all my properties. My concern would be if I suddenly started claiming half the purchase price as land value, it would be inconsistent with previous purchases and inconsistent with the county assessment. It seems an investor could be playing a dangerous game here.

2. Between depreciation, expenses and interest, I have a net loss on my rental properties. I am not sure I could adjust the land value enough to make a significant profit. I ran some numbers and although I could force some profit, 20% credit would not be much money. It is better for me to take higher depreciation. I agree it would help when I go to sell, but assuming I perpetually exchange the properties, it doesn't matter.

My situation may be different than others. I have become accustomed to loading my properties with enough expense to claim a loss against my W2 income. I could see this strategy being more effective for people who pay cash for their properties. If I subtract my mortgage interest, the properties start getting more profitable.

Thanks for all your insight, especially the strategies on how to use the new rules to your clients advantage. 

 Hi Joe, you said "I have become accustomed to loading my properties with enough expense to claim a loss against my W2 income". Do you mean you have w-2 income from another job? If so, how do you claim a loss against it with real estate activities? I have high income from my full time w-2 job, and my CPA said there is not much tax planning I can do as long as I am earning w-2 income... 

 Between depreciation, capex and mortgage interest, my properties overall have a small loss. My W2 income is my day job. You can claim rental loss against your W2 income if you are active in your rentals and if you don’t exceed the salary limits. Or if you qualify as a real estate professional. My guess is your W2 salary is too high. 

We do intentionally make capex investments to keep the quality of our properties high and to enjoy the tax benefit. That way in the future our properties will not have deferred maintenance. 

 I see. Thanks for explaining! 

Post: THE Thread on the Final GOP Tax Bill - Q&A

Chunyan SongPosted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 13
  • Votes 2
Originally posted by @Joe Splitrock:
Originally posted by @Brandon Hall:

So my team and I have literally been sitting around all day to dream up new strategies for our clients (who are all real estate investors).

Here's one that we've come up with.

For new acquisitions, if the rental will likely generate passive losses, allocate more basis to land and take less depreciation. 

The new pass-through deduction is a freebie. But the deduction is only available if you have net taxable income after all expenses, including depreciation and amortization. 

So when you buy the next property, allocate more basis to land. This will reduce your depreciation expense. But if you have a smart tax advisor, you can likely net out the lost depreciation expense with this new freebie deduction. 

The tax benefit is realized on the sell-side. When you liquidate a rental, you pay depreciation recapture taxes on the depreciation you've taken over the life of the rental. 

So if you report less depreciation over the hold period, you pay less recapture taxes in the end. But best of all, it didn't hurt you during the hold period because you utilized this new freebie deduction each year to bring your taxable income down to $0.

Note: this is not a relevant strategy if you purchase property that is likely to produce high amounts of net income after depreciation every year (NNN, Commerical, Large Apartments, Short-Term Rentals).

Second Note: more planning will be required for folks that want to utilize cost segregation. You don't want to crush it on the cost seg side and not be able to utilize this freebie deduction because you no longer have net income to report. 

This is an interesting strategy, but I see two issues:

1.  I understand the IRS gives latitude on how you allocate value between land and structure. For example my county taxes split land and structure. I use the land value and subtract that from the purchase price to get basis. It is logical, defendable and consistent on all my properties. My concern would be if I suddenly started claiming half the purchase price as land value, it would be inconsistent with previous purchases and inconsistent with the county assessment. It seems an investor could be playing a dangerous game here.

2. Between depreciation, expenses and interest, I have a net loss on my rental properties. I am not sure I could adjust the land value enough to make a significant profit. I ran some numbers and although I could force some profit, 20% credit would not be much money. It is better for me to take higher depreciation. I agree it would help when I go to sell, but assuming I perpetually exchange the properties, it doesn't matter.

My situation may be different than others. I have become accustomed to loading my properties with enough expense to claim a loss against my W2 income. I could see this strategy being more effective for people who pay cash for their properties. If I subtract my mortgage interest, the properties start getting more profitable.

Thanks for all your insight, especially the strategies on how to use the new rules to your clients advantage. 

 Hi Joe, you said "I have become accustomed to loading my properties with enough expense to claim a loss against my W2 income". Do you mean you have w-2 income from another job? If so, how do you claim a loss against it with real estate activities? I have high income from my full time w-2 job, and my CPA said there is not much tax planning I can do as long as I am earning w-2 income...