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All Forum Posts by: Derrek H.

Derrek H. has started 2 posts and replied 15 times.

Originally posted by @David M.:

@Derrek H.

As a layman, i sort of see how this could work. First, you need to realize that a single member LLC is considered a "disregarded entity" by the Federal IRS. That is, for tax purposes they don't recognize so all the tax filing is done on your personal return. The K-1 statement you are referring to is for partnerships.

I am GUESSING because of the disregarded entity status and the MFJ, from the Fed's point of view, the property never changed hands. When it was part of the LLC, it would show up on SchE. When its owned by the wife, its still shows up on their SchE. They basically found a way for to borrow a bunch of money from the bank, which is basically getting a loan whether you call it a refinance or not (who really cares?).

In some ways, the more I think about it, the more "stupid" this is... Its just a refinance, but with a property transfer... So its a sale.. The bottom line is somebody purchases a property undervalue (i.e. buy low), touches it up, then refinances it to get all the equity out since they bought it low. Lets face it, you wouldn't / shouldn't be able to generate "extra" equity because it wouldn't appraise. So, all he did was take Title in a LLC, then move it out to his wife's personal name to get the residential loan.

Its everything we keep writing about in BP. The LLC is too costly for single family home investing. In my mind, the LLC is pretty much pointless.

I skipped over your calcs.  Save the Tylenol..  Does my viewpoint make sense?

@David M - Your viewpoint makes sense. Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the tax filing part!

(I would have replied earlier, and I selected "Notify me when a reply is posted", but I never got an email, so I didn't realize anyone had replied until I happened to visit the site today.)

Btw, as others in this thread had mentioned, the real estate investor who did this did it this way to do the BRRRR strategy, but get the money out in shorter than the typical 6-month seasoning period many banks require to get cash out of a new purchase. He said he got the cashout in 2-3 months instead of the usual 6 months.

FYI, the video is by Chandler David Smith on Youtube. (He's a real estate investor and creates videos on real estate investing on Youtube. Here is the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjkgZNq9aCw). 

Also, as others in this thread have pointed out, apparently some banks don't have the 6 month seasoning period. So that would be much easier.  @David M - thanks again!

Hey BP Community,

I saw a video on Youtube by a BRRRR investor who said he was able to get money out of his BRRRR in just TWO MONTHS with his strategy. The LLC he controls bought a property for $140k and put $15k of work into it. Total cost was $155k. Then he rents it out for $2k/mo. Then his LLC sells it to his wife for $250k. (I assume his wife is not part of the LLC. He made it sound like his LLC and his wife were separate parties for the transaction.) The wife makes a 25% down payment of $62.5k and gets a bank loan for the rest. (They disclosed exactly what they were doing to the bank, so the bank was aware and ok with it.) Also, the $250k price was chosen so that the property would generate cash flow for the wife based on $2k rent/mo. The LLC pays $9k for closing costs, so the net sale is $241k. $241k sale price - $155k investment = $86k profit to the LLC. The wife has paid out $62.5k as the down payment. So net, as a family unit, economically the investor says they are $86k - $62.5k = $23.5k ahead. The investor also says that the LLC legally avoids paying taxes on the $86k because he and his wife are Married Filing Jointly (MFJ), and thus seen as one entity for tax purposes. He also said b/c they were filing MFJ, the government viewed this as a "refinance".

First, is he referring to some obscure tax law that says real estate transactions done this way qualify or are considered as "refinances"?

Second, how is the $86k totally tax free as claimed? 

Let's assume the investor has a single-member LLC and is able to issue a K-1 to himself. Would the $86k on the K-1 then go on the investor's Schedule E, page 2, line 28(k) as "nonpassive income from Sched K-1"? If so, would this income then flow to Sched E, page 2, line 41, and there be combined with any net losses the wife might report on Sched E, page 1, line 26? (Line 26 flows to Sched E, page 2, line 41.)

But still, how can all the $86k be shielded from taxation? If the wife reports expense of $7200 for mortgage interest ($187.5k @ 4.25% has about $7200 interest in year 1), $5000 on property taxes (250k x 2%), and about $4400 in depreciation (depreciating only the building, which we will say is 50% of the $250k for 27.5 yrs), the total is only $16,600. $86k - $16.6k leaves $69.4k to be taxed, right? Even after the standard deduction of $24.4k is subtracted, that leaves $69.4k - $24.4k = $45k that will still be taxed, right?

His strategy sounded legitimate, he said he checked it with his CPA and lawyer, he disclosed what he was doing to the lender, and he was clear to disclose that his LLC (not himself) bought the house and sold it to his wife. So his tax strategy _sounds_ ok. I'm just wondering exactly how he did it so that me and the Bigger Pockets community might benefit too!

Thanks!

Post: purchase during pandemic?

Derrek H.Posted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 15
  • Votes 2

@Jordan Pothier - Thanks for the update! Sounds like you were wise to not go through with that purchase and did well by finding another property. Congratulations! Btw, I am a little envious that you can buy a house for 110k and fix it up. Living in the San Francisco Bay Area, you can't find a condo for less than $400k, LOL. Best of luck with the BRRRR!

Post: purchase during pandemic?

Derrek H.Posted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 15
  • Votes 2

@Jordan Pothier  I just read this thread. I'm curious - what happened?  We you were able to re-negotiate the purchase price and get other concessions to save some cash for repairs?  How did it go? =)

Post: How I built a portfolio of 35 rentals and $10k+ monthly cash flow

Derrek H.Posted
  • Investor
  • San Francisco, CA
  • Posts 15
  • Votes 2

@Anton Ivanov - Thanks so much for sharing your story! It is really inspiring and motivating to me. I’m similar to you in that I’m very analytical and live in expensive CA (Sacramento). I’ve also concluded that buying outside of CA is better for investing.

That said, my current concern is how to manage the property remotely. You said you had 1) criteria for picking property managers and 2) a system for keeping them accountable. Would you mind sharing/elaborating on your criteria and system?

Also, I’m reluctant to buy property where there is snow, since I think that wear and tear might be greater and appreciation might be less in those areas. But since you bought in Kansas City, where there is snow, this does not seem like it has been a concern for you. Are my weather-related concerns not really a problem in your experience? Did weather (as far as it affects wear and tear costs and appreciation rates) not really enter into your investment analysis for choosing an area to invest in?

Thank you in advance for any wisdom you can share! 

Derrek H, Sacramento, CA