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Chaz, We have never found the deals mentioned at 50-70% LTV, nor have we ever received 2% on rents, however, we like the situation we are in. I know the other experts believe it doesn't work, but it has so far. I imagine if we relied on the income from the rents to survive, it would be different. We have other streams of income, so these are "savings accounts". We "break even" buying at just below market and renting for 1%... certainly different strokes for different folks. We have amassed a good amount of real estate doing that way, and a great amount of net worth.

Good Luck :)

I just want to add my two cents about pulling eqity out on a creative financing deal. I have not, nor would I, do that, without having good financing and could afford to increase the payment to the point that it would be rentable in the local market.

I have a client with excellent credit that did that when the Vegas market was at a high. They have since taken a job out of state and the home sits vacant with a $3,800 payment on a house they could rent for $2,000! They had kept their good 1st, got a lousy second, and used the money on a risky deal. They lost all of that money. Unfortunately, they are now letting it foreclose because they can not afford to do anything else! They took a great situation, buying right and having lots of equity, and they turned it into their nightmare. They bought for $325k, took a $150k 2nd when the house was worth $550k. The house is now worth about $410k, not bad if they hadn't messed with the equity!

My caution to you would be risk only what you can afford to pay for. In your situation, I would think using $20k down on a rental that will positive cash flow FOR SURE would be a safer bet and accomplish a similar result. For that matter, do that 2 or three times and spread the risk. Banking on the market to boom is way too risky, and if the builder knew it was a sure thing, he wouldn't need your money.

Just one opinon :)

thanks for that reply!

Thanks Scott & Ryan... and Scott, that would be great if you could go into more detail. I think the detail would be of help to others besides me too :)

Hi all... We have bought all of our rental propertes with conventional loans and now have a more difficult time getting loans due to the fact that we have so many mortgages in our name. The lender we use has pushed a few through with excetions because of our good credit and good documented history and tax returns. What do we do to get good loans to purchase more property at this point? I have been told to get a commercial loan for a fixed dollar amount and use it to buy multiple properties. Has anyone done that? Also, what kind of loans are available when you go to sources outside of the conventional? We buy and hold and do pretty much 30yr fixed on everything, we will not get ourselves into crazy finance deals, just straight up, fully amortized, with no balloons. Look forward to hearing from you!

I would love to hear answers on this. I assume many "green" investors, or just investors with bad timing, could be in that situation. It would be nice to hear if someone had success with this model.

Really, it was when saw our first Landlord doing it while working a 9-5 in SoCal back in the early 1980's. We thought, WOW, what a concept! We pretty much renovated "our" home for him, he was willing to pay for material as long as we did the work. It was a win win! We had a renovated house to our liking, he had a great tenant, and a beautiful home when we left. We only did that once then bought our own home & did the same.

We knew we wanted to be landlords, but we are "slow and steady" people. When the timing was right for us and we could afford the risk, we took the plunge. Once we got the bug, it has been hard to stop! Win-win is our way of landlording :)

I have to agree with Rehab, all of those things are in place! I would have guessed our average age to be much older than 30's. I don't know of too many cities that have 3 Sun City communities and then some!

I like the "idea" of finding diamonds in our own yards. Does that book, or any other book, have some suggestions on how to find a good position in a "Las Vegas Real Estate" market as an Investor today? I would really love to hear what it might be.

As a Realtor here, I am struggling to find a "positive" for buyers or sellers. We hear a lot of fluff, but I can't find anything to substanciate why an investor would buy or sell today... no one walks away feeling a win-win, just some are hurt less than others. If you can rent a $350k house for $1,300-$1,500 an month, why would you buy a home now?

I know that sounds negative, and I hate to be that person, but even I don't see an immediate, or even near future, solution :)

Don't know what area you live in, or what kind of skills you have, but in most areas Delivery of some sort would be the hours you are looking for, and tips may be good... agian, if you are in Alaska, it may not be a good choice, but it would be in most areas???

In Vegas, there tend to be lots of jobs for good wages if you want to work, regardless of your skills. Update your profile so you can encourage more responses... Imagine if someone here was in your neighborhood could offer you something besides REI advice :)

I have to agree with many that say MikeOH is spot on... He mirrors my thoughts on so many posts that I am blown away. I have pulled back from posting so much because it got to be less constructive and more destructive criticsm I was hearing. I would rather sit on the sidelines and "read the book" instead of jumping in an giving my opinion.

I know what MikeOH does it positively the best way to do it, and certainly allows him to invest in more properties that the average investor. Everyone would agree, if they only knew how, they would! My input there is that we have managed to become what many would view as successful REI's, without using that formula, and we did it despite buying at close to retail and with rents of 1%. Please don't tell me we aren't successful, as we too are entrepreuners and we think we are successful in not working a 9-5 for the past 17 years, having wonderful vacations & lifestyle, raising great kids, and we are still pretty young (43,44). Mind you, we had plenty of cash to invest upfront so we also did it a way others could not... we worked very hard to put cash away when business was good, and a good chunk of it on Real Estate. MikeOH's posts leave a newby to believe they absolutely can not be successful unless they do it his way... I KNOW they can. Of all the millionaire REI's out there, not too many were as "good" at it as Mike is, but they still are Millionaires. MikeOH comes off as the Bill Gates on the forum that knows how to do it, but it is his little secret. There is enough Real Estate to go around, Mike, so share your "how to" knowledge with others, instead of saying "Just do it!" and then your critism will be more constructive. In the world of Guru's: You will get everything you want in this world, if you just help enough other people get what they want!

I encourage all newbys to listen to Brin Tracy's "The Luck Factor" and you might learn that if you find someone that is having the success you want, do what they are doing, spot on, and you too will have their "Luck".

Also, regarding the why people rent and rental tenants... my own belief is that it is a "risk" to buy a home, they are new to an area or don't have a job that can guarantee that they will be around more than a year at a time. Our society is full of risk averse people. That is most likely the reason Grandma & Grandpa rented. I can say that we do not rent to the tenants with absolute crap credit, that have credit card debt up the kazoo, and smokers need to do it outside or lose their deposits. My tenants do care about "their" home. We keep the homes to a high standard and they tend to live up to it. Bad Credit is easy to see on a credit report, and they won't be able to come up with the rents or deposits we charge, or they live in less desireable neighborhoods than we own in, and they rent from landlords with less restrictive guidlines, maybe the newby's that are afraid to be vacant so they rent to the first interested person. Maybe that is why we have little turnover and no evictions on my record... I know it will eventually happen, but so far we are "lucky" :)

TTFN