All Forum Posts by: Robert Taylor

Hi Darren, I just sent you a IM about it. I'm pretty sure I found the listing you're referring to and yes, it is in a hot area! Assuming I have the correct listing, there are some fairly decent recent sale comps to compare it to, which isn't always the case with a rather unique setup like that one. That's an area where you shouldn't have too much trouble finding decent tenants too. Let me know if I can help, thanks!

Sorry for the delay, but it ended up being a weird set of coincidences and other things that got me totally confused and looking back now, it was no different than what I've seen countless other times on title reports. I've been having a guy who used to be part owner of a local title company do my searches for years, he's a friend of a former partner of one of my brothers and does them cheap. Once I've completed all of my research, I'll email him my final choices and usually in less than an hour, he'll email back the results. For whatever reason, he used completely different "lingo" in summing up the results this time, first time ever that happened and what would've been something like "its good to bid on" every other time, this time turned into what I took to mean that these two judgements wouldn't be extinguished and when I asked him, he said that if the judgement holders weren't properly notified, they could come after the buyer, which I guess i always the case, but if they're named in the foreclosure case, then they should've been notified. I could go into all the details and totally explain it, but that would be typing a lot to explain what was really just a big misunderstanding! 

So, because of that misunderstanding on the one house and because the other house was really surrounded by totally overgrown trees and bushes, I just skipped the auction! I get the results on tuesdays and both of them sold to 3rd party buyers for just over opening bid!

Actually, a couple more thoughts here:

-The city of Milwaukee has "landlord classes" and I think they're free and i've heard they cover a lot of this type of info.

-There's an attorney here in Milwaukee who has an excellent blog, mostly about landlord/tenant and real estate law which he practices right here, so its based on what's going on HERE! I'll have to look through my notes, but I can PM you the link.

Hi Karen,

I'll second what Bill S said above about tenant screening, it is of the utmost importance! In fact, I sent you a message earlier today, replying to your colleague request in which I mentioned a few things along those lines that I consider as the "building blocks" to being a landlord that makes a profit with a minimum of tenant issues:

-renting units that are clean, safe and offer some amenities that might be even a bit above what people normally expect for whatever price range it is in. I don't mean going overboard, but especially if you're rehabbing the place first, if its even just slightly better than the rest, you'll have multiple tenants interested in the place, assuming that . . . 

-charge a rent amount that's fair for the location and condition of the unit, but not too high that potential tenants won't even bother applying. So, do some good research on what other landlords are charging for what type of units in that area

-assuming you do the first two, in an urban or suburban area, you should have multiple applicants, assuming that you also get the word out that you have a vacancy or one coming up (don't forget about referrals from current good tenants, too) and then comes the most important part-truly screening your tenants. Here in WI, we have CCAP, the circuit court website that lists the info on EVERY circuit court case in WI going back at least 10 years or more, although some of the older cases in Milwaukee County will say that it is a "converted case" and not give much info, but then you can google the statute # and get a good idea of what that case was about, at least in "legalese". Another thing I've learned is when checking past landlord references, do some checking on this "former landlord" as well, it only should take a matter of minutes, but you want to make sure you're really talking to their former landlord and not their brother in law POSING as their former landlord! (who of course, will give a perfect reference!) 

As far as the law goes, I'd say WI is in the middle as far as landlord/tenant law goes, although its been getting better for the landlords lately. Some states are ridiculous as far as what tenants can get away with, especially ones who know how to game the system. That's when getting a bad tenant can honestly cause major harm to a small scale landlord. WI isn't like that and within the last year, the state legislature did tighten up several loopholes in the old laws as well. 

I try hard to keep my politics or anyone else's politics out of my BP comments because it usually gets people nowhere when discussing real estate matters, who cares about politics. It is worth pointing out though that at least here in WI, the state's Republicans backed all the landlord friendly laws and law changes and the Democrats opposed them and have supported much more tenant friendly rules. WI's current Rep governor signed the bill, which I doubt would've happened with a Dem governor. The states that I've heard of where tenants can get away with murder are all generally "blue" states and the landlord friendly states are generally "red" states. Obviously, who you vote for in any election comes down to much more than their stance on landlord/tenant laws, but if you're going to be risking your finances and financial future on renting to tenants, it is something worth keeping in mind and I'll leave it at that!

The blog you linked to is written by Tim Ballering who is a major landlord in the Milwaukee area and one of the founders of the Apartment Association of SE WI. I'm a member of that group and for small time landlords it is $99 a year and among other benefits, you get a 2% rebate on anything bought at Home Depot AND 20% off of any paint from HD. I used to get 10% off and recently switched back to HD's Behr paint after being wooed away by SW to try their paint and I prefer the Behr paint, so I've paid for my membership many times over.

Hi Rob,

There could be a bunch of different things going on there. Here's a few things you can do quickly, without spending any money: 

-If this house is by you in Elkhorn, you can look it up on the Walworth Cty website. They have all of the ownership info on there, like a lot of cities, counties, etc now do. 

-Then, based on who the listed owner is, you can go to WI CCAP website and enter that name and see if a foreclosure suit has been started on that property. If it is a common name or if that person is no stranger to the court system, due to numerous criminal and civil cases, look through the cases under the "Caption" column for one that has a bank name or some financial company's name vs your owner's name. So if the house is owned by Ralph Fishbones, it would say something like "Wells Fargo Financial vs Ralph Fishbones" or "Ralph Fishbones, et al". Click on that case and it takes you to the case info screen and under "class code description" it will say "Foreclosure of Mortgage". If its not a common name, check the address for the defendant and it if it matches that house, then that place is being foreclosed on. If its a common name, then things get more complicated, you have to make sure its the right person, etc.  Sometimes you can match things up with a middle name, birth date, etc although I don't think CCAP lists birth dates on civil cases. If it gets too complicated, you can just go to one of the websites with info on houses being foreclosed on-foreclosure.com actually sponsors this forum, so maybe check them out!

-If there is a foreclosure suit in progress on the house, you might have some options if you're really interested in the place. In WI, it GENERALLY it takes a year or so to foreclose, but that can vary widely based on a lot of different factors with the bank, the borrower or other things too. Sometimes, the (soon to be former) owner will stay right up until the very end or even past it and have to be evicted by the sheriff, other times they've been gone for months or longer before its ever sold at the auction. 

-Once you find out what's going on there, who the owner is, if there is a foreclosure suit in progress, etc you should check back on here for some more advice on what your next move might be if you really want the place. If it is vacant and you can find out who the owners are, assuming there's a mortgage on it, you might be able to get a short sale price from the bank and buy it that way. There are other people on BP who really know the ins and outs of how to do that. If its already well through the foreclosure process, it will get scheduled for an auction date, its either 6 or 8 weeks, I forget which, that they (the bank or really the law firm handling the case) have to start placing public notices of the auction date. I'm not sure where the Walworth Co ads are placed. So, then you can bid on it at the auction, but there are lots of pitfalls in buying at auction so you have to learn all about those before you go and bid. Again, members here on BP can help with that, I've bought probably 15 or more houses at auction here in Milwaukee and Waukesha Co.

-Or, it might be an absentee owner, or it may have passed to a relative if someone died or who knows what and if there's no mortgage, you might be able to buy it by contacting that person. Again, it all starts with finding out who the owner is from the Walworth Co website.

Good Luck!

Oh yes, I should've mentioned that these are NOT gov't liens of any sort, they're just from other private parties. Thanks!

Thanks for the rapid response Steve! I've covered so many of the ins and outs of auction buying, but its been a while since this issue came up and I don't remember it being a problem but with over $9k in judgements, I definitely want to be sure! 

So, you're saying that at least where you are, the judgement would have had to have a date before the date that the mortgage was recorded, thus when they first bought the house and got that mortgage or if they ever did a refi, the date of the refi (or when it was actually recorded to be exact) and assuming the judgement holders were notified of the foreclosure suit (which I assume they were as they were named in the foreclosure suit as defendants) that they would then be extinguished. Thanks!

I'm not a newbie to buying at the local sheriff's auctions here in Milwaukee, I've bought probably 15 houses at our sheriff's auction and I know the ropes pretty well but its been a while since I've dealt with this particular issue and need some advice. 

We have an auction tomorrow (Monday June 23rd) and there's one I like and I checked it out in person today and it looks to be in good shape outside. As usual, I wasn't able to get inside, the house has apparently been vacant for a few months at least. Some of the other local buyers seem to not mind breaking in to these places to check the inside, but that's something I won't do. I like the fact that I have a clean criminal record and want to keep it that way!

I have a guy who runs title searches for me and this one came back with two pretty substantial judgements from PRIOR to the lis pendens filing date, which was in May 2013. First judgement is for $5279 from Dec 2010 and second judgement is for $3840 from June 2012. I looked up the online record for the foreclosure case and the plaintiff did name both parties with the judgements as defendants in the foreclosure case.

So, I'm wondering what happens if I buy the house at auction tomorrow? Am I then on the hook for those judgements and if I am, what might come out of that? Would I have to pay the full judgement amounts before being able to get the title or transfer the title to someone else if I rehabbed it and sold it or if I just wholesaled it to someone looking to flip it? If I am on the hook for those judgements then, could I pay them off for a fraction of the judgement? I'm assuming that if they'd be able to come after me if I bought the house at the auction that they'd assume I had deeper pockets because I'd obviously be paying cash for the auction price and then go after me for the full amount. 

This is not a very expensive house, so adding $9k or so in judgements to the opening bid amount for this house PLUS the $3k in back taxes owed on it would push it into the "not worth buying" category!

Any advice is much appreciated, I'm happy to answer any questions or clarify anything AND TIME IS OF THE ESSENCE!!!! The auction in tomorrow morning! Thanks!!!!

I have to second what Marcus said, first about the contractor you know from church. I know its certainly reassuring to know someone from another avenue of your life, especially one like through church where you can assume all sorts things that you'll likely agree on or whatever else might make you comfortable with him/her but at the same time, the worst stories I've ever heard where someone ends up getting ripped off very badly, not just say being overcharged a bit due to some padded hours or whatever else, but like really badly ripped off is when a crook gains the victim's trust through a separate path and rides it all the way!

@Ernie V.  Hello! Welcome to BP, I'll tell you what you'll hear from everyone, you've come to the right place here because there is an absolute wealth of great information here, far, far more than could ever fit in any book or even on a set of DVD's or whatever other media! Plus, unlike nearly every other website that claims to be for RE investors, this one isn't just a little bit of info that's meant to lure you in so they can then put the hard sell on you to buy some "educational materials" at some ridiculous price! They do sell a few things I suppose, like the book on flipping houses, which I bought a copy of myself even though I've been flipping houses since 2004 or so and I still learned from it! That book is $30 or something around there, much better than the $2000 or $10,000 or whatever crazy price other people are charging for their "can't miss" programs! 

Anyway, to answer your question (or attempt to) about the "best" areas of Milwaukee to invest in, quite honestly you could really make a case for ANY area being the best area! What I'm really saying is, you need to sit down and really think about and analyze what your goals are-both short and long term, what you have as far as money to invest-either cash on hand or what you're able to borrow from a bank, relative, private money lender, whoever. Also, you need to decide what level of involvement in this you're looking to provide, is this going to be your new full time career or is it something you'll have to manage to do outside of the time required for a full time job, or maybe somewhere in between. I'm sure I could think of more criteria for you to consider, but those three things-your goals, what you have to invest and how much time you can spend on it are a good start.

From there, first off, are you just talking about the city of Milwaukee itself or the entire metro area (a big area to cover) or part of the metro area or ????? Just for this example, lets say you're interested in all of Milwaukee County and eastern Waukesha County, which is still a good sized area but fairly reasonable. Now, what are you looking for out of these investments? Probably the two big areas or RE investing these days are rehabbing/flipping houses and buy and hold (being a landlord). Again, for my example, lets say you're looking to buy and hold. Then it comes to your short and long term goals, are you looking for big time monthly cash flow, long term appreciation of the value of the properties, maybe a combination of the two? If you're looking ONLY for maximum cash flow and really don't care about appreciation, (you'll certainly take it if it comes, but you're not counting on anything big) then quite honestly, some of the "rough" areas of the city of Milwaukee are where you should start looking. If you're new in town, just go to the Milwaukee Journal website and look at their interactive "crime map". You'll see that the vast majority of murders are all clustered in mainly one or two general areas-guess what-those are also usually the best areas for pure cash flow and a good number of investors make great money in those areas! You'll also see, looking at the for sale listings, that you can buy properites-single fams, duplexes, multis-for some incredibly low prices in those areas. Of course, they come with their drawbacks too, how interested are you in spending time in areas where murders are fairly common? Again, some investors don't mind at all and they can do very well in those areas, in fact they'd probably tell you those areas are the best to invest in, because compared to buying in higher priced areas, they're still getting decent rents and they paid a fraction of what you'd have to pay to buy in other areas, for not a whole lot more rent!

Moving on from there, as the neighborhoods get safer as far as crime rates go, the prices to buy will go up, as well as the rents, but the rents usually don't go up proportionally as much as the purchase prices, so your % return gets lower and lower. Taking it to an extreme, you could buy a house in Elm Grove and pay a LOT of money to buy it and then rent it out but between your interest, taxes, maintenance, etc you might not be cash flowing much at all! The flip side is that while the super cash flow properties in the high crime areas pay out every month, the long term appreciation may not be much at all, while the Elm Grove home might end up going up in value enough to retire on! (certainly not guaranteed though!) Between these two extremes, are a lot of areas that are safe areas but nothing fancy, where you can buy in for a reasonable amount and get good rents, so you'll have some cash flow as well as a good shot at some long term appreciation. 

Lastly, for your condo question. I've bought a bunch of stuff through the Milwaukee and Waukesha Cty sheriff's auctions and condos are a crap shoot in my opinion, but with enough research you certainly can make money there as well. There are a bunch of low end condo complexes, many on the NW side of Milwaukee where they have units going through the auction constantly and since they're usually bought back by the bank, they're then listed on the mls, many for $30k or well under that. I don't know too much about those condos, not my "cup of tea" but I suppose you could buy one and rent it out and cash flow on it. On the other hand, there's been a boom over the last 15 or 20 years of new condos downtown and in the 3rd Ward, which are generally all pretty pricey, usually starting around $200k for a 1bed/1bath tiny unit and going up into the multi-millions in certain spots like University Club Tower where one 9000+ sq foot unit that covers an entire floor on maybe the 35th floor is appraised by the city at $13 MILLION!!!! If you can find a steal on a downtown or 3rd Ward condo and either want to flip it or buy and hold, you could also do quite well. BUT!!!!!! Before you consider buying ANY condo, get to know top to bottom what banks are looking for as far as the financial health of the condo associations!!! Banks learned the hard way over the last 5+ years that writing mortgages on condos in complexes where the condo associations are poorly run, have little or no reserves, or whatever other issues can lead to disaster such as when the whole place needs a new roof badly and there's nowhere near enough in the reserves for a new roof, which of course will cost BIG bucks for a giant condo building. How do the condos get a new roof then-like when its so bad that its leaking all over the place and destroying the entire building and the lowest estimate is $300k??? If there's 30 units in that building, then the only answer is to send each unit a bill for $10k!!! So, definitely do lots of research on that whole part of buying any condo!!!