Northern Ohio Fix and Flip

Northern Ohio Fix and Flip

Real Estate Broker · New York, NY · Member since 2021 · 6 posts · 2 votes

I have two questions.

First, I am interested in hearing from people who have invested in real estate in towns in northern Ohio, those bordering Lake Erie.  I live in NYC, which seems far too expensive for my first fix and flip.  I am a little familiar with northern Ohio, as I have extended family there.  Certain towns appear to present interesting investment opportunities because the homes are much more affordable.  I am worried, though, that there may not be enough buyers out there.  While there is wide variation in wealth between towns (Sandusky is generally poorer than Vermilion), I still worry that even in the "wealthier" towns, there just is not a lot of demand for a nicely rehabbed house.  If the numbers online are accurate, homes often sit on the market for a long time before being sold.  

Second, I found a cheap house in the area that looks trashed and will need significant repair. If you zoom in on the map on Zillow, there are estimated values assigned to every property, not just those on the market. How accurate are those numbers and how much should I figure those "Zestimates" for similar neighboring properties into my market analysis? For example, they suggest that I could acquire the trashed property for $50,000, put, say, $40,000 into it, and achieve an ARV of maybe $120,000. I would never rely on these numbers alone, but should I rely on them at all and, if so, how much?

Thanks, all.

Clark

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Real Estate Broker · Huntsville, AL · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 872 votes
5y

Hey Clark Andrew! You couldn't be more wrong! Our market is absolutely on fire here in Northwestern Ohio! Check out Sylvania, Ohio if you want to flip! My co-worker just sold his house in 20 hours for 5k over asking price without inspection! He bought it for $192k and sold it for $320k 3 years later!

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  • Architect · Columbus, OH · Member since 2020 · 9 posts · 6 votes
    5y

    I've yet to invest but I may have some insight based on what I've learned here and what I've gathered from books and YouTube. One thing I will suggest is reading the book, "The Flipping Blueprint". It's very concise and goes into a ton of detail about your second question (even the part about Zillow's Zestimates). I've also just started reading "The Book on Flipping Houses" which is a bit longer and more extensive but seems great thus far and I would highly suggest it, it's also part of the BiggerPockets bookstore.

    I'm in Columbus, OH and I'm sure all of the other people from Columbus will come out of the woodwork on this one since Central Ohio is extremely hot right now. Inventory here is insanely low and any house that is reasonably priced will go fast. I've heard similar things about Cinci and Cleveland but can't speak for Vermillion or Sandusky. With that being said, if you're seeing that recently sold houses (within the past 6 months) sat on the market for 6 months or more before being sold, it's likely your house would do the same. It's also possible that those houses were not updated and people are looking for no-hassle, move-in ready homes, so I'd make sure to look very closely at houses with the same features that you're anticipating for your rehabs since, like you said, there may be more or less of an appetite for nicely rehabbed homes in Vermillion than for a run down "fixer upper". You could always call up a realtor in the area and tell them you're interested in investing in the area and would like some insight into the market.

    From what I've heard and read, do not rely on Zestimate numbers at all. Sometimes they're spot on and sometimes they're tens of thousands off. What I've read/heard is that you should take anything that isn't a hard piece of data with a giant grain of salt. If a wholesaler tells you an ARV, don't trust it, go find comps in the area that can give you cold hard facts to gauge from. If Zillow tells you a Zestimate, don't trust it, go find comps in the area that give you cold hard facts to gauge from. Basically, if a person or system tells you something and it's questionable where they got their numbers, don't trust it, go look up comps. Ideally, you'll want to look for houses on the same block, or very near, with very similar features such as beds, baths, square footage, whether it was rehabbed and how extensive, lot size, garage, etc... The ideal comp will also have sold within the past 30 days but if that's not available, look at the most recent beyond that. Hope this helps. I know ARV is your most important number since it determines your MAO, so getting it right is crucial. I've also heard the holding costs for a flip can be a killer if you're using hard money, so knowing how long your house will be on the market is insanely important.

  • Real Estate Broker · Huntsville, AL · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 872 votes
    5y

    Hey Clark Andrew! You couldn't be more wrong! Our market is absolutely on fire here in Northwestern Ohio! Check out Sylvania, Ohio if you want to flip! My co-worker just sold his house in 20 hours for 5k over asking price without inspection! He bought it for $192k and sold it for $320k 3 years later!

  • Real Estate Broker · New York, NY · Member since 2021 · 6 posts · 2 votes
    5y

    Thank you.  That was helpful.

  • Real Estate Agent · Orange County, CA · Member since 2016 · 207 posts · 111 votes
    5y

    We invest in the area in the east suburbs of Cleveland for the most part and yes there is plenty of demand for rehabbed homes. The biggest thing I will say is please don't use the Zestimate for anything else other than a very general figure. Zestimates don't take into account that it's a new build or been recently renovated, has foundation issues, fire damage, really ugly paint job etc. Don't forget that the vast majority of purchases are still to retail buyers so how the property looks is a HUGE deal and something an algorithm can't quite calculate. 

    I would suggest beginning with the basics and learning the area a little more and learning how to run comps and get your own values for properties. That's the foundation for everything. 

  • Real Estate Broker · New York, NY · Member since 2021 · 6 posts · 2 votes
    5y

    Thanks, Jacob.  That's very helpful.  I have some familiarity with the area as I have extended family there an have visited frequently, but will visit again soon to look at the real estate.  The house I am looking at now is on Lake Erie.  It is hard to find comparables due to the lack of recent sales and how different each house is.  The house has a detached two-car garage that could be turned into a separate living space for short-term rentals or simply a guest house.  But I am still working on figuring out whether such a conversion is permitted.  Given how popular the area is over the summer, the short-term rental could provide a significant offset to mortgage payments.  The main house itself is 3 beds / 3 baths and appears to need only some light cosmetic updates.  

  • David KlemPro Member
    Investor · Vermilion, OH · Member since 2018 · 23 posts · 13 votes
    5y

    Andrew, 

    I'm still behind buying my first investment and I live in Vermilion, Oh. Hwy 6 borders the lakeshore properties. VERY NICE! I live 1 block on the other side of Hwy 6. Bought my very first primary residence ever on 2/19. It's a 3 BR, 2 bath ranch style with only a crawlspace. Bought it for $149,000. I've been told that my home would sell very easily for a lot more than I bought it for without even putting it on the market. The problem is that I have a new wife of 2 yrs and her 2 kids 21 and 23. We need a place to live. I would make out selling but my question is, what about what I buy next? If it's a seller's market it's a 2 catch 22 for a primary residence.

    I'm almost debt-free and will then be ready to transition from my current job as a truck driver to something where I'm home every day and can move forward with REI. So to sum it up, I too have heard that this area is hot right now.

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