thinking about buying a 4plex with no re experience and no idea where to start

thinking about buying a 4plex with no re experience and no idea where to start

Member since 2017 · 3 posts · 0 votes

yeah as title. i have a mortgage on my own house. recently a 4plex on fb caught my eye. theyre listing for 300k, new construction, on i think 1/2 acre or 1 acre mostly seems a big dirt parking lot in front. 1800sq ft. they claim the units rent for 1050. obviously these are small units 1 bed 1 bath, doing the math 1800/4 is 450 sq ft per unit. they look nice, being new construction, albeit spartan inside, metal building, concrete floors, washer dryer hookup. semi rural Oklahoma but about 80-100 miles from dfw. they also say all units are under 6 month lease (it seems to be friends of theirs, i'm guessing, as they mentioned it was full "despite not even listing it yet"?) for 1050/month all bills paid. they claim this cash flows 3600/month (4200-600). the math on that is they say electric is 90 unit, trash and water is 50 each for all 4 so theres your 600 and say they can provide receipts on all this. it's located  a handful of miles, about 6-8, outside the nearest small town with a wal mart etc.

one thing is it seems better apts, in town with 600-800 ft, go for more like 1k no bills paid. even adjusting for the all bills paid part, i feel like 1050 is aggressive on these. otoh near me some crappy tiny apt with mold and everything go for 750, and these are much nicer than that. i think 700-800 would be an absolute floor on what they could rent for.

i guess i just have no idea for example, insurance? is it more expensive being 4 tenants? they claim they pay 105/month insurance. this seems pretty low, granted its in the ballpark of what i pay on my own 1100 sq ft house, but i just feel like a 4 plex would be higher? how does the fact youre renting to tenants play into the insurance?? i would assume it might be much higher?

another maybe odd thing i worry about is it's a bit in the country, with 4 doors right next to each other i worry the tenants could fight, drama, drug deals, noise complaints, i have no idea but it just seems a bit strange. the layout just seems very conducive to drama, 4 door out front literally spaced ten ft apart with nothing else directly around and one big parking lot out front.

another concern i have is, i understand there are laws limiting how many people can be in apt. these being 1 bed 1 bath, thats room for what 1 couple, and one child at most? i worry what if tenants try to move a bunch of people in? i'm figuring it being rural ok, enforcement of laws/codes/taxes etc is gonna be lax as it gets, but still.

also how do the taxes work? they claim taxes are 100/month. again, seems aggressive but slightly plausible being its outside city limits. are the taxes more on rentals units?

what does anybody think? i really am a bit clueless.

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Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
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Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
2y

It sounds like you need some education before jumping in. Even if this property is a good investment, you don't know how to manage it once you have it. The smallest of mistakes can turn a great property into a money pit.

1. Start with BiggerPockets Ultimate Beginners Guide (free). It will familiarize you with the basic terminology and benefits. Then you can read a more in-depth book like The Book On Rental Property Investing by Brandon Turner or The Unofficial Guide to Real Estate Investing by Spencer Strauss.

2. Get your finances in order. Get rid of debt, build a budget, and save. The idea that you can build wealth without putting any money into it is a recipe for disaster and the sales pitch of gurus trying to steal your money. A wise investor will not try to get rich quick with shortcuts. If you can't keep control of your personal finances, you are highly unlikely to succeed in real estate investing. Check out my personal favorite, Set For Life by Scott Trench , or The Total Money Makeover by Dave Ramsey.

3. As you read these books, watch the BiggerPockets podcasts. This will clarify and reinforce what you are reading. You can hear real-world examples of how others have built their investment portfolio and (hopefully) learn to avoid their mistakes.

4. NETWORK!!! Get out of your comfort zone. Stop hanging out with your deadbeat buddies that spend all day drinking, talking sports, and otherwise wasting away. Go to BUILD YOUR TEAM at the top of the screen and look for local investors or meetups in your area. You can also find real estate investing groups through meetup.com, facebook, or a Google search. Birds of a feather flock together!

5. Now you need to figure out how to find deals and pay for them. Again, the BiggerPockets store has some books for this or you can learn by watching podcasts, reading blogs, and interacting on the forum. A handy search bar in the upper right makes it easy to find previous discussions, blogs, podcasts, and other resources. BiggerPockets also has a calculator you can use to analyze deals and I highly recommend you start this as soon as possible, even if you are not ready to buy. If you consistently analyze properties, recognizing a good deal will be much easier when it shows up. Find Brandon's videos on YouTube for the "four square" method of analyzing homes and practice. It doesn't take long to learn how to spot a good deal.

6. Study the market. You can learn to do this independently or get a rockstar REALTOR to lead the way. I highly recommend a well-qualified REALTOR who works with investors and knows how to help you best.

7. Jump in! Far too many get stuck in the "paralysis by analysis" stage, thinking they just don't know enough to get started. You could read 100 books and still not know enough because certain things must be learned through trial and error. You don't need to know everything to get started; you need a foundation to build on and the rest will come through experience and then refining your education.

You can build a basic understanding of investing in 3-6 months. How long it takes to be financially ready is different for everyone. Once you're ready, create a goal (e.g. "I will buy at least one single-family home, duplex, triplex, or fourplex before the end of 2019") and then do it. Real estate investing is a forgiving world; the average person can still make money even with some big mistakes.

The DIY Landlord Book4.7247 Reviews
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  • Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
    2y

    It sounds like you need some education before jumping in. Even if this property is a good investment, you don't know how to manage it once you have it. The smallest of mistakes can turn a great property into a money pit.

    1. Start with BiggerPockets Ultimate Beginners Guide (free). It will familiarize you with the basic terminology and benefits. Then you can read a more in-depth book like The Book On Rental Property Investing by Brandon Turner or The Unofficial Guide to Real Estate Investing by Spencer Strauss.

    2. Get your finances in order. Get rid of debt, build a budget, and save. The idea that you can build wealth without putting any money into it is a recipe for disaster and the sales pitch of gurus trying to steal your money. A wise investor will not try to get rich quick with shortcuts. If you can't keep control of your personal finances, you are highly unlikely to succeed in real estate investing. Check out my personal favorite, Set For Life by Scott Trench , or The Total Money Makeover by Dave Ramsey.

    3. As you read these books, watch the BiggerPockets podcasts. This will clarify and reinforce what you are reading. You can hear real-world examples of how others have built their investment portfolio and (hopefully) learn to avoid their mistakes.

    4. NETWORK!!! Get out of your comfort zone. Stop hanging out with your deadbeat buddies that spend all day drinking, talking sports, and otherwise wasting away. Go to BUILD YOUR TEAM at the top of the screen and look for local investors or meetups in your area. You can also find real estate investing groups through meetup.com, facebook, or a Google search. Birds of a feather flock together!

    5. Now you need to figure out how to find deals and pay for them. Again, the BiggerPockets store has some books for this or you can learn by watching podcasts, reading blogs, and interacting on the forum. A handy search bar in the upper right makes it easy to find previous discussions, blogs, podcasts, and other resources. BiggerPockets also has a calculator you can use to analyze deals and I highly recommend you start this as soon as possible, even if you are not ready to buy. If you consistently analyze properties, recognizing a good deal will be much easier when it shows up. Find Brandon's videos on YouTube for the "four square" method of analyzing homes and practice. It doesn't take long to learn how to spot a good deal.

    6. Study the market. You can learn to do this independently or get a rockstar REALTOR to lead the way. I highly recommend a well-qualified REALTOR who works with investors and knows how to help you best.

    7. Jump in! Far too many get stuck in the "paralysis by analysis" stage, thinking they just don't know enough to get started. You could read 100 books and still not know enough because certain things must be learned through trial and error. You don't need to know everything to get started; you need a foundation to build on and the rest will come through experience and then refining your education.

    You can build a basic understanding of investing in 3-6 months. How long it takes to be financially ready is different for everyone. Once you're ready, create a goal (e.g. "I will buy at least one single-family home, duplex, triplex, or fourplex before the end of 2019") and then do it. Real estate investing is a forgiving world; the average person can still make money even with some big mistakes.

    The DIY Landlord Book4.7247 Reviews
  • Member since 2017 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    2y

    I have been lets say "dabbling" in real estate knowledge for a few yrs. Even was more into bigger pockets yrs ago, lately more via youtube videos. I know all the basic terms and such.

    I do have money to invest. I dont have the full purchase price of this 4plex to invest though, so I would have to finance half to 2/3 which seems like a stumbling block. i can still make the numbers work, but at a much lesser monthly profit i suppose. i also dont have the w2 income to support 2 mortgages (counting the one i have on my house), so i assume any bank would have to count the existing leases towards my income which i understand is possible


    I guess I was wondering about advice, or red flags, anything, on this specific deal. Dont suppose I'll get it...again, i've never done a real estate deal other than purchasing my house over a decade ago. without experience there's just so much i dont know.

    networking is a sore spot, i'm just not a people person. thats one reason i look at real estate. since i plan to have any properties managed, i wont have to deal with a lot of people. i imagine you'll scold me for this but whatever. i'm never going to be a people person and thats set in stone. it's something i have to work around not overcome.

    It seems I always get to the same point with real estate where I take the safe and easy route and leave my $ invested in the stock market. the thing that appeals to me about re, and i'm more focusing on rentals, non b&b, is steady income with an appreciating underlying asset. whereas the market is up and down. i can get totally safe 5% from short term bonds, but i know my principle is withering away from inflation (i dont believe the gubt bogus 3% cpi). with a rental house i could get 5% rental income, and the house will appreciate ~5% a year. that's a huge difference. the other thing i'm somewhat interested in is flips, but same story there, i just dont have the knowledge, and all the reading this forum or watching yt's in the world only gets to the surface as it's all airy generalities.

  • Real Estate Broker · Albuquerque, NM · Member since 2015 · 285 posts · 232 votes
    2y

    @Ben Jones, @Nathan Gesner couldn't be more correct.  

    Before you jump into this, it sounds like you're at the education point of the program.  Mistakes in real estate cost real money and lead to a lot of problems, sometimes legal.  Yes, getting real life experience is important and that will come.  It sounds like you're struggling with the basics.

    The best advice I ever received from a 75 year old mentor, was "Make your mistakes on paper.  It doesn't cost you anything."  He was referring to a building boom that some builders were headed for disaster in their development.

    The same applies here.  Get educated before you lose more than you can afford to lose right now as you're getting started.  

  • Member since 2017 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    2y

    not sure what you mean by basics. what do you mean by basics?

    feel like i've consumed enough media over the years i'm past basics stage.


    ok lets try a specific question:

    what company can i call for an insurance quote on a 4plex that would be all units  rental not a live in? i tried geico and basically got a long  runaround and eventually disconnected they dont seem to know how to deal with a 4plex. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Broken Arrow, OK · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    2y

    Having invested in rural areas and small towns over the years, I’ll just say the numbers sound very high for rural Oklahoma for that small of units.  I own units in good areas in the city of Tulsa that are 850-1000 sq ft 2 Bedroom/2 Bath and only rent for $850-1000 mo. I wouldn’t even buy units that small personally.

    You definitely need to do more research and due diligence first.  Never ever trust the sellers numbers or what their broker tells you.  Do your own research.

    Also, they’re not figuring in all the expenses for rentals: 

    • ? $ for PITI (Principal, Interest, Taxes, Insurance);

    • 10% for Management; (even if self-managing, pay yourself for your time)

    • 5-8% for Vacancies; (Turnover happens & when it does it requires cleanup, repairs, listing, showing & leasing which can take up to a month easily.)

    • 5% for Repairs & Maint; (Repairs happen even on new builds)

    • 5% for CapEx; (Larger Expenditures will happen over time, so you have to figure for them.)

    • ? $ for Utilities (if paid by you)

    • ? $ for HOA Fees (if applicable)

    I’d recommend starting with something closer to you for your first deal. 

  • Lakeland, FL · Member since 2018 · 243 posts · 148 votes
    2y
    Quote from @Ben Jones:

    not sure what you mean by basics. what do you mean by basics?

    feel like i've consumed enough media over the years i'm past basics stage.


    ok lets try a specific question:

    what company can i call for an insurance quote on a 4plex that would be all units  rental not a live in? i tried geico and basically got a long  runaround and eventually disconnected they dont seem to know how to deal with a 4plex. 


    Hello Ben,

    Sounds like you have done some research and consumed some media on BP. My question for you would be, what makes this place so valuable to you? If the rental numbers are inflated by the owner and you aren't sure about a lot of other factors (insurance costs), why not look at other properties?

    Confirm tax information with the county, they usually can give you an estimate or sometimes the website will have a calculator for you. Also, make sure to ask for estoppel certificate (this shows the lease information that the tenant has been given and agreed to with the rent payment.

    Best,

    Brandon
  • Real Estate Agent · Lafayette, LA · Member since 2024 · 46 posts · 21 votes
    2y

    Hey Ben! 

    It's totally understandable having some doubts about the property, especially it being new construction. My suggestion would be to get in touch with a realtor in your area(NOT the listing agent) so they can run comps for you. They will also likely have contacts for a property manager, who will help you determine what rents would be(don't just take the seller's word for it) and then you can use them to rent and manage the units if needed. They should also be able to get you in touch with an insurance agent that can give you a quote for insurance. Also, you can call your county to get the correct property tax amount. 

    For financing, you can look into a DSCR loan, which the lender will use the potential income for the property to underwrite the loan. Talk to a lender about this.

    Let me know if you have any other questions! 

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