First flip, title insurance and home insurance questions

First flip, title insurance and home insurance questions

Flipper · Montreal, Quebec · Member since 2017 · 5 posts · 0 votes

Hello BP,

I'm a starting RE investor and i'm about to close on my first real estate wholesale deal on the west coast of Florida. 

The deal is structured like this:

- I am buying a duplex from a wholesaler for 160,000$, he got it on auction for 153,000$. 

- The real estate agent is confident that he can sell it within 90 days for 185,000$+ based on the comps in the area, which means that if he sells it around that price, minus closing costs (8$%) i should net in the area of 10,000$ to 12,000$ (+/-185,000$ * (1-0.08%) = 170,200$ ---> 170,200 - 160,000$ = 10,200$). I went to see the house and it's in great shape, no apparent defaults and the house is mint, no rehab to do whatsoever! This is all nice on paper but some other questions popped into my mind and I wanted to get your two cents on this.

Since this is my first flip, even though I read up on the subject, I am still unaccustomed to the flipping game. Apparently, flippers don't normally buy title insurance and don't insure their flip for the duration of the flip. Being green, this seems risky to me even though i've done my Due Diligence on the property and it seems to be clear of leans and back taxes, furthermore, not insuring the house for the 90 day period (give or take) seems like a big risk if I get the unlucky fire from the tenant living in one of the units (one unit rented, other isn't).

I understand these two things could reduce my margin and it's a risk management call but if you could give me some insight on this it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance for your help!

Sincerely,

Max.

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Dawn BrenengenBusiness Member
Moderator
Real Estate Broker · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
9y

@Maxime Benoit There is no way I would buy a home and not insure it.  Home owner's insurance for a few months will not be that expensive.  Title insurance is probably not totally necessary, but I would still get it if it were my deal.  I'm not one to be penny wise and pound foolish.  Again, it's not that expensive.

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  • Dawn BrenengenBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    @Maxime Benoit There is no way I would buy a home and not insure it.  Home owner's insurance for a few months will not be that expensive.  Title insurance is probably not totally necessary, but I would still get it if it were my deal.  I'm not one to be penny wise and pound foolish.  Again, it's not that expensive.

  • Real Estate Professional · West Palm Beach, FL · Member since 2012 · 23k+ posts · 13k+ votes
    9y

    Flippers absolutely DO insure their flips.  There's too little profit here, if everything goes just right.  You'll also have some closing costs buying.  Some agents have a very optimistic opinion about selling prices.

    @John Thedford knows that market well of it's Ft Myers and south, owns a few rentals there, and give you an opinion, with the address or neighborhood.  Please tell me it's not in Lehigh.  Y

  • Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2016 · 374 posts · 189 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Dawn Brenengen:

    @Maxime Benoit There is no way I would buy a home and not insure it.  Home owner's insurance for a few months will not be that expensive.  Title insurance is probably not totally necessary, but I would still get it if it were my deal.  I'm not one to be penny wise and pound foolish.  Again, it's not that expensive.

     This is 100% incorrect.  I have done multiple times.

  • Real Estate Broker · Naples, FL · Member since 2013 · 9k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    9y

    Please send a PM with the address. If you have not already listed the property please let me know. 

  • Investor · Fort Myers, FL · Member since 2012 · 462 posts · 200 votes
    9y

    @Maxime Benoit

    I'm with @Wayne Brooks on this one. Way too thin. If that agent was your best friend, I wouldn't trust them on value.

  • Flipper · Montreal, Quebec · Member since 2017 · 5 posts · 0 votes
    9y

    Thanks you all for your replies, much appreciated. I've ran the numbers and the price i am paying is pretty much the value based on cap rate, however when i look at the comps, they are selling between 180,000 and 190,000, hence, i am a bit inclinded to trust the agent to some extent because there is proof that it can sell at that price. Nonetheless, i do agree that the spread is tight, especially if i include the title insurance and home insurance in my buying cost. In my head, for a first flip anyways, it would be preferable to have them for peace of mind. This greatly reduces my spread though...

    The other option i have is if it doesn't sell near the asking price, i can always buy and hold and collect rent in the meantime.

  • Real Estate Broker · Naples, FL · Member since 2013 · 9k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    9y

    Margin is too thin IMO. I have owned two in Lehigh. I much prefer Cape Coral. I get higher rents and better applicants. There are some parts of lehigh that I would yell RUN if you were buying in that area. 

  • Thomas FranklinPro Member
    Real Estate Investor · Miami, FL · Member since 2010 · 939 posts · 739 votes
    9y
    Maxime Benoit A dwelling policy where I build the policy based on my needs. I would also consider a builders risk/ rehab policy. I would, however, want to include coverage for building materials such as tile, which would be lying around during the construction process. If materials such as tiles are stolen from the home, the cost would not be covered in a traditional homeowner's policy for the home you live in. As the investment project progresses, the insurance needs also change. I would need unoccupied insurance (vacant house coverage), if no work is happening. This home coverage against lost money when vandals burned the house down, or squatters move in.
  • Dawn BrenengenBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    @Account Closed what was incorrect?  You would buy a home and not insure it?

  • Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2016 · 374 posts · 189 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Dawn Brenengen:

    @Account Closed what was incorrect?  You would buy a home and not insure it?

     I missread your post.  My apologies my lady.

  • Dawn BrenengenBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    @Account Closed   Thanks for that.  I was confused  :D

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