From W2-Job Single Mom to Flipping Real Estate Rockstar with Amanda Young

Brandon:
This is the BiggerPockets podcast show 422.

Amanda:
It’s limiting beliefs, you don’t have to have a whole lot of money to get into real estate and make money. You really don’t. And you can see, as my examples, I really did not have a whole lot of money to put into these deals at all.

Speaker 3:
You’re listening to BiggerPockets radio, simplifying real estate for investors large and small. If you’re here looking to learn about real estate investing without all the hype, you’re in the right place. Stay tuned and be sure to join the millions of others who have benefited from biggerpockets.com, your home for real estate investing online.

Brandon:
What’s going on everyone, it’s Brandon Turner, host to the BiggerPockets podcast here with a phenomenal show for you that’s going to go down in the history of BiggerPockets podcast as one of the ones that people remember and come back to over and over and over. Interviewing an amazing person named Amanda, you going to get to know her in a minute, but first let me introduce you to my friend, my partner in crime, Mr. David Greene. David, when you were a kid, what did you want to be when you grew up?

David:
Well, I went through a phase where I wanted to be what my dad did and he painted houses. Thank God I moved out of that one. And then I think I wanted to be a professional athlete and that definitely didn’t happen. And then I had no idea what I wanted. I actually went through a lot of anxiety through high school and college because I didn’t know what I wanted to do, but I love to just get ahead of everyone else, I’m very competitive. So it was really hard that I couldn’t figure out like what race I wanted to run.

Brandon:
It’s hard to win a race when you don’t know what you’re running.

David:
When you don’t know which one you’re in. Yeah, that was my life. So when I finally found real estate, I had like 30 years of pent up frustration that I just unleashed on the whole thing.

Brandon:
All right.

David:
What did you want to be when you grew up? Tall? You did a good job.

Brandon:
I wanted to be tall, yeah. I wanted to be a teacher was my thought, like a calculus teacher. In high school is what I was going to do, it’s calculus teacher. And I’m glad I didn’t do that, because I still couldn’t do it before.

David:
Are you that good in math that you could do calculus?

Brandon:
I mean, I was in calculus in high school, I didn’t do it in college much. Well I, whatever. I did a college class in high school and I liked it, but then I went for a history degree. You don’t use calculus in history. So anyway, I’m actually looking forward to teaching Rosie. I’m going to be Rosie’s like, because we’re probably going to homeschool Rosie since we travel so much. So anyway, I get to be her math teacher. So starting like now I get to like go all the way through math again all the way up and hopefully make Rosie a little-

David:
You’re one of those weirdos that like gets excited about math.

Brandon:
I loved it, I loved it. I loved it.

David:
I’ll never understand you people.

Brandon:
Yeah, I loved it. I love math.

David:
Thank God you exist.

Brandon:
All right. With that said, let’s get to today’s quick tip.

David:
Tip.

Brandon:
My quick tip for you is set a number of offers you are going to make in 2021 per week on average, maybe it’s one per week on average, maybe it’s half of one per week on average. Maybe it’s one of them per month on average, but set that number knowing that not all of your opportunity is going to accept it. And if that scares you, if you’re like, why do I have to make an offer? Well, guess what? Now you’ve got a really good goal to figure out how to make an offer. And that’s the first domino to knock down. Let’s figure that one out. So set yourself a goal for the number of offers you’re going to make in 2021 and let’s work backwards to make sure you do that. Success is not a surprise for you listener. And now-

David:
Let me give a second quick tip.

Brandon:
Oh, please. Okay, cool.

David:
A quickly, quick tip. If you want to become friends with someone that you’re having a hard time getting in there, or you want like a mentor type of a situation, figure out what their goals are and help them meet their goals. If somebody wants to be Brandon Turner’s friend and they bring him a mobile home park or someone to invest in your fund, or they invest, that’s a very quick way to get into your inner circle and kind of see the other things you have going on. So change the question from how do I bring value to you, which is very general to how do I help you accomplish your goals? Which is much more specific.

Brandon:
Dude, that’s so good. And so like yeah, you just said you want to triple your business, so Hey, if you are in the Bay Area and you know somebody who wants to buy or sell a house, talk to David Greene, because that’s how you’re going to bring him value. And man, that’s such a good tip. Such a good tip.

David:
That’s exactly right. That’s what’s going to make me want to bring you into the world that I’m creating and see what I can do to now help you achieve your goals, which was probably the reason that you wanted a mentor in the first place. Right? It’s just a much better approach.

Brandon:
Yeah, crazy man. That’s good. That’s good. You’re smart, dude. I was not sure what they say about you. And now I think we’re ready to get into today’s show. Today’s guest is Amanda Young. Amanda is just a fire cracker of a woman who just started as a single mom, not knowing what she’s doing, having no money, was able to build financial freedom. Doubled her income, crushed it, despite a lot of obstacles in her path. You’re going to hear about that today. It’s really a great story of just Daring Greatly, which is a book she mentioned later in the end of the show. But she’s such a perfect example of that. You guys are going to love this interview. So I don’t want to fool around, I just want to get right into it, David, are you ready?

David:
Yeah. This is a story that someday could be made into a movie. So this is really cool. I think you guys are going to really like it.

Brandon:
And apparently she was on TV. She had a TV show or something.

David:
Yeah, she was.

Brandon:
She was on a TV show. So anyway, you’ll hear about that too. So without further ado, let’s get to our interview with Amanda Young. Amanda, welcome to the BiggerPockets podcast. Good to have you here.

Amanda:
Hi, thank you guys so much. It’s an absolute honor to be here with you guys.

Brandon:
Aw, thank you very much. Thank you. Well, it’s an honor to be here with you because I hear you have a pretty incredible story. So I’m excited to dig in a little bit. Walk us through how you got into real estate. Like why real estate, what were you doing before that? And kind of how did you get into that very first deal?

Amanda:
Okay. So back in 2012, I just recently got divorced. I was finally able to kind of just sit down and breathe and allow myself to dream and basically closed that one chapter. And I thought to myself now, what does my next chapter look like? What do I want to do for myself and blossomed real estate. I went to the library, I didn’t have a lot of money. So I went to the library and I read every book, every business book I could get my hands on. I read even stock market books, none of those made sense to me until I landed on Rich Dad Poor Dad and as soon as I got ahold of Rich Dad Poor Dad, it completely changed my life. It completely changed my mindset. Put me on a path of a lot of fun and greatness and made a lot of money on the way, so I’m so grateful for that.

Brandon:
Well, can I pause there? I don’t know if I … I never ask this question. People talk about Rich Dad Poor Dad a lot. I talk about Rich Dad Poor Dad a lot, what is it about Rich Dad Poor Dad for those who maybe haven’t read it, what is it about that book that gets so many people fired up?

Amanda:
You know what it is? It’s a mindset game changer. It teaches you how to look at money completely differently than what you’ve always been taught or known. So you want to put your money to work for you like little soldiers out in the field. So once I realized that and a lot of other lessons that I obtained from the book, I was able to implement that in my life.

Brandon:
Yeah, so true.

Amanda:
So it’s just an absolute game changer. I highly recommend it to everyone.

Brandon:
Yeah, a hundred percent agree. I mean, so you get this book, you read the book and you’re like, aw, this fired me up. So what do you do with that?

Amanda:
So that was about in 2012, 2013, I threw myself into research. I happened upon you guys, that was back when Brandon and Josh were doing the podcast.

Brandon:
OG’s of the BiggerPockets podcast, yeah.

Amanda:
Long time ago. And basically you guys were my mentors. I was a single mom, there were no REIA groups in my area. So you guys taught me all the language I needed to know, different strategies, different ways to invest. So I’m forever grateful for you guys for that. So everything you guys talked about and did, I basically implemented. One show talked about going to local REIA meetings. So I got myself plugged in to one that was about an hour away, that was the closest one. I was a single mom, so I would load up my son and I would drive him an hour to Tampa. We would go to these REIA meetings. He hated it, but we did what we had to do.
There was just one night a month, so we would go and from the REIA meetings, I learned a lot more ways to invest in strategies. And I was also able to get plugged in with other investors like me and I learned a lot that way as well. So that, between 2012, 2013 and my research, in 2014 I was finally able to save enough money to buy my first rental property, I was very excited. It was late 2014.

Brandon:
What was it? I mean, like what’d you buy?

Amanda:
It was a three, two block home in my town. I was able to purchase that on what they call a home path loan. They’d no longer have that available to investors, however, back in 2014, it was a special loan where you only had to put 10% down. So I was able to save that money and put the 10% down on a three, two home that cost I think 78,000. And right now I get 1350 in rent on that house. It’s crazy.

Brandon:
That’s awesome. And where was that one located?

Amanda:
Spring Hill, Florida

Brandon:
Spring Hill, Florida. All right. You’re in the game at that point. Why do you think so many people get stuck at the education phase, the research phase, which you were in and then don’t buy that first property? Like what was that different for you?

Amanda:
Analysis paralysis. They get scared. What if I lose my money? What if a hurricane comes and blows it away? A lot of what ifs, you kind of have to get past that, you kind of have to get some courage, muster up some courage and go out there and buy your first property. Now, mind you, when I bought my first property, I was a single mom and I didn’t have a lot of money. I got a lot of backlash. I got a lot of, are you crazy? You don’t have a man in your life to help you. You’re a single mom, what are you doing? And I said, “Hey, I have this dream, I’m going to follow. I’m not going to let anything stand in my way, I’m going to do it.” So I did. So I bought my first property.
Shortly thereafter, I almost lost my son. He had a facial tumor. He was in the hospital for two weeks. We almost lost him. He had to go through reconstruction surgery. After he got out of the hospital, he wasn’t able to go back to school, I had to homeschool him. It was a very traumatic time in our life. And then about a month after that, I lost my job. So now I’m unemployed and I have a son at home who I have to take care of. So more so than, what I normally would have had to and now I don’t have a job, I’m unemployed. And what did I do? I did not let that stop me. I went ahead and I found another property to purchase, another rental in my neighborhood.

Brandon:
Well, how do you do that though? How do you purchase? You got no job, you’re at home, how do you buy that second property? A lot of people get stuck here, they buy the first, they can’t figure out how to buy the second.

Amanda:
Yes. They can’t figure out the second. Well that property, I won a list of probate leads at my local REIA.

Brandon:
They actually had like a contest and they … That’s cool.

Amanda:
Well, you put your business card on a bucket or whatever. And they drew my name. I had no idea what probate was. I didn’t know how to work a lead list. So the lady who runs that company, she kind of held my hand. She says, here’s some example of letters to send, just stick them in the mailbox and see what happens. And lo and behold, I got a call back from a lady in Michigan and she had a home here in Spring Hill. Her father passed, so it was a probate. I was able to negotiate a subject 2 deal. She wanted 6,500 cash and I took over the loan on subject 2 financing.

Brandon:
Yeah, let’s talk about the subject 2 for a minute, because that’s something that a lot of people don’t know what that is. And it’s a powerful strategy, so how would you explain subject 2 to somebody who has just no idea about this?

Amanda:
So subject 2 is taking an existing loan over that’s not in your name. So the loan was in the dead guy’s name and I just took it over. I started making the payments for whomever the person’s name is that is on that loan.

Brandon:
But how do you, because like a lot of times what happens is like, when somebody dies or you sell a property, you have to pay back the loan. So the bank is going to want their loan paid back, so how did that not happen? What did you do to prevent that?

Amanda:
So through going to some REIA meetings and listening to your podcast, I learnt a couple of strategies to kind of prevent that loan from being called due. First thing I did was I put it in a land trust, and so that way now on public record, it says family trust of who did previously own the house. And then what I also did is I went to the bank and I opened up a checking account and I opened it in a fictitious property management name, so property management of whatever. And then I wrote all the checks out of that account. So when the bank received those checks, it said property management company so that they wouldn’t be flagged like, oh, this is coming from a different person other than who owns the house.

Brandon:
That’s fascinating.

Amanda:
And it did, it never got called due, thank goodness.

Brandon:
I’ve never heard that. So what do you do if, because this is a danger, why I haven’t done subject 2 very much at all really. I don’t think I’ve ever done a single subject 2. So what do you do … No, maybe I did one. I did one sort of, it was like a hotel, but anyway, what do you do if a subject 2 loan is called due? What if the bank does say, hey, wait, no, this guy died. Or you bought the property, you got to pay us back. What would you have done?

Amanda:
I would have went out and secured a bank loan or a private money lender or I could have just sold the house.

Brandon:
Yeah. That’s the bottom line, I love that you said that. Because that’s, like subject 2 is risky in that like the bank could ask for their loan back. They don’t necessarily want to just have people buying properties and not refinancing or buying it.

Amanda:
Right.

Brandon:
But if they do call it, you got some time, you can go sell it, you can refinance it. You can go get another loan, you can bring in a partner. There’s a lot of options, so.

Amanda:
Yeah, the most important thing is to secure the deal. So you can start getting cash flow from that and then just be prepared with plan B if the bank does call it due, however, you can take preventative measures so that it doesn’t happen.

Brandon:
Yeah. Can I bring up an important point here too? Like, this is true in so many areas of real estate or really any business, but especially real estate is how many people out there will say things like you can’t do subject 2, it doesn’t work anymore. Or you can’t do this strategy or that strategy, it doesn’t work here. People are so quick to be like, this doesn’t work or hey, that doesn’t work, but you just perfectly illustrated like there are back doors and there are avenues and there are other things with almost everything. So that’s just a word of warning to everyone listening to this, is when people tell you like you can’t do something or that something’s not a good idea, be careful who you get your advice from.

Amanda:
Yes, very much so. And to be honest, when somebody tells me I can’t do something, it just, it drives me harder to do it to prove them wrong.

Brandon:
Yeah, a hundred percent. All right. So you gave this lady the 6,500 bucks she wanted, took over her property and now you just rent it out and you just make the mortgage payment, and so you get to keep all the difference for cashflow and that you’ve been doing that ever since, right?

Amanda:
Yes, absolutely. And realize the tax benefits as well, so there’s that.

Brandon:
Yeah. There’s a lot of really cool things that you get with that. Okay, so what came next? Walk us through the rest of your story.

Amanda:
Okay. So I like to utilize creative financing strategies. So driving for dollars, driving around different neighborhoods, I found a for sale by owner sign wrote in pencil and I’m like, oh, that’s opportunity all over.

Brandon:
Yeah.

Amanda:
Oh, man. So I was able to make an appointment and went and negotiated at the kitchen table. So this couple, they were older. It was their second home and I knew that if they sold that house, they would be subject to capital gains tax. So I explained to them that, hey, if your owner finances, you will have to be hit with so much taxes up front, so what do you say, I’ll give you a little cash down and I’ll just make monthly payments to you and you guys can have a supplemental income and not be hit with taxes so hard. And they liked that idea. So I was able to negotiate at the kitchen table, $5,000 cash down and I think it was a $62,000 mortgage at 6% over 20 years.

Brandon:
Yeah, that’s great. So now they get-

Amanda:
That was a great one.

Brandon:
Yeah, it’s win-win. They get their money coming in every month, just like to help them in retirement, you get a property, don’t have to deal with a bank and only $5,000 down. Sounds pretty awesome to me.

Amanda:
Yeah. And I still own that house today. And actually that one, I was able to utilize that house. I reified that note this year because interest rates dropped. I was at 6%, now I’m at 3.9, I believe it is on a 30 year note. I pay the same in my monthly payments. However, I was able to pull about $20,000 out and I went and bought another rental without taking any money out of my pocket. And boom, I got a free home.

Brandon:
I love it. I love it. All right. So what’s your portfolio look like? Where do you get to, let’s go to the end of your story. Like how many units do you have or how many have you bought? Like what’s the last few years look like? And then we’ll kind of fill in that kind of hole.

Amanda:
So right now, currently I own seven rentals. They pay all my bills. I did own two more, but I sold them. I got a ridiculous price, so I sold them. So yeah, my seven rentals pay my bills, but I also started in 2016, I started a flipping business. So from 2016 till current I am flipping houses a lot.

David:
That’s awesome.

Brandon:
And you don’t need a W2 job to flip houses, right?

Amanda:
Oh, no, I don’t have a W2 job.

David:
I just want to say, I know we’re just getting started here, Amanda, but this is so cool-

Amanda:
Oh, really?

David:
That you lost your job and then went and made more money through real estate, when for most people that would just be, well, I guess I can’t do it.

Amanda:
Well, I don’t want to brag or anything, but I make, I think more than double than what I made in my W2 income, I make over six figures doing this.

David:
Yeah. And all without the ability to get the easy financing, that’s really what I was getting at. I’ve heard it said, a wise man once said, necessity is the mother of invention. That sounded really cool.

Brandon:
Did you say that David?

David:
No, it wasn’t me.

Brandon:
Did you say that? Is that your quote?

Amanda:
Is that your quote?

David:
No, I don’t have wise quotes, I just have a good memory. I remember how this goes.

Amanda:
For me, success was not an option, so I had to be successful. There was no other option for me out there, but to succeed in real estate or go back to work. And I did not like that idea because I had a son, like I said, who I had to take care of. So yeah, success was not an option, it had to be done. So I did it.

David:
That’s so good.

Brandon:
Yeah. I mean, that’s the mentality. One thing I find difficult, in fact, I had a conversation the other day with a buddy of mine, buddy of mine’s pretty wealthy, has good amount of money. And he was talking about how difficult it is now to start something new because he doesn’t need it. He doesn’t have the need anymore. Like he doesn’t … And I’ve been through that as well. Like once you have a lot of … like you lose a little bit of that fire when you already have a lot of money and you’re already wealthy. And so it almost, some people think that having no money and having limited resources is a detriment, but I would almost argue that, that should give you more passion and fire and excitement. The fact that you have little money when you get started is a benefit to you, not a disadvantage, it’s an advantage to you.
And when you shift your thinking from that to that, like obviously you’re like, oh yeah, that’s right. Like in fact, I think one of the scariest things that when people message me and say, I’ve got $200,000 to invest or I’ve got $500,000 to invest-

Amanda:
What do I do?

Brandon:
… what do I do? I’m like, hold on. Like, hold on. That is a scary spot to be in. Like I would much rather be in the spot when getting started of I’ve got 15 grand than if I’ve got 500 grand, because that 500 grand is very easily lost, but the 15 grand you’re going to hold on a lot tighter and be a lot smarter about it. So that’s cool.

Amanda:
It’s limiting beliefs. You don’t have to have a whole lot of money to get into real estate and make money. You really don’t. And you can see, as my examples, I really did not have a whole lot of money to put into these deals at all.

Brandon:
Yeah, that’s great. We got these little clips from the beginning of every show, like to kind of tease what’s coming, every episode of the podcast. I feel like the last like minute, there’s been like 10 things you said that every one of them, I like wrote down, I’m like writing down, like this would be a great tease for beginning the show. I know this would be a great tease. No, this is a really good, like everything you said there, I’m like, oh, this is so good. So basically you pay your bills, you can pay your bills through the income coming from the rental property. So we call that level one … Yeah, so good.

Amanda:
I do. All my bills are paid through my rental income, my mortgage, groceries, gas. I do not live an extravagant lifestyle. My house is just a normal house. I drive an old beat up Toyota as a work truck. So if you’re not extravagant and then you can kind of get to a point where you don’t have to have a W2 income. And what happened for me was the W2 income was really holding me back in a lot of ways. I did not have time to devote to real estate. Real estate was my passion because between the time I bought my second rental and then started my flipping business, I did have to go out and get another W2 job and that really hindered my business in a lot of ways. But I had to do what I had to do. And then 2018 corporate America quit me.
My boss at the time sat me down and she says, and Kristen, I love you. Thank you so much. But she sat me down and she says, “Amanda, this is not your passion, your passion is real estate. And you need to follow your passion. I have to let you go,” because I was in a sales position, I didn’t meet my numbers. So she let me go. But she says, this is where you need to be. This is where you excel at, this is what you’re passionate about. And one day I’m going to see you on TV. And she actually, she saw me on TV. I was on the Discovery Channel for doing what I do.

Brandon:
Oh, no way, that’s awesome.

Amanda:
I specialize in sinkhole homes in my area.

Brandon:
Wait, what? Sinkhole homes? Sinkhole?

Amanda:
Sinkhole.

David:
This is a Florida thing, tell us about this Amanda. Brandon has not heard of it.

Brandon:
I’ve seen like on the news once in a while, like sinkholes are a thing in Florida, but I don’t know, maybe if you specialize …

Amanda:
I love them.

Brandon:
Yeah, what is this?

Amanda:
So I will tell you that at one of your podcasts long, long time ago, you had somebody on there to say, go after the product that nobody wants and that everybody else is scared of. And for me, that was sinkholes, nobody in my area invested in sinkhole homes, nobody wanted them at the time. And so I said, that is what I’m going to do. I’m going after the sinkhole homes, because nobody wanted them. And everyone was scared of them. So thank you.

Brandon:
Well, I mean, yeah, it’s like we always talk about, run towards hard-

David:
There you go.

Brandon:
… like run towards the thing that’s difficult. Right? You ran towards hard. But okay, when I think sinkhole, I think like there’s this hole that opens up in the ground and the house falls into it and now there’s no house anymore. Like what do you even do with a sinkhole house? Like how is that a thing? My mind is blown right now. I don’t know how this happens.

Amanda:
That’s okay, they’re great. So if you watch the discovery channel show, it’s called Sinkholes-Buried Alive. Very rare does a sinkhole actually open up to where it swallows the entire house, that’s kind of sensationalized. So what happened in my area back in the early 2000s, there was a sinkhole scam going around. There’s these guys that would walk around and knock on your door and say, hey, you had a crack in your sidewalk, you got a sinkhole. Fill out this piece of paper, we’ll deal with the insurance company and you’ll get a big fat check. So that’s exactly what happened. If you had a crack in your sidewalk, you could declare a sinkhole. What happened was the insurance companies would pay off your mortgage, they would send you like 100,000, $150,000 check to fix the said sinkhole.
Well, nobody fixed the sinkhole around here, they just took that money and they bought boats and vacations and cars and extra homes or whatever. Well, now fast forward, the County has all these houses that are flagged sinkhole, okay? Well, there’s really 90% of the time, there’s really no sinkhole. But what I do is I take these houses and I buy them 50 cents on the dollar or less, and I repair the sinkhole. I have it pinned or I have another engineer come along and retest it and see if in fact, is there a sinkhole or not. And if there’s not, we get a new engineering report, which supersedes the old one from the fraud and the flag is removed and now the house is just like any other house in the neighborhood. If there’s an actual sinkhole, I have an engineer come out and they pin it all the way around the whole perimeter.

Brandon:
What does that mean?

Amanda:
They take-

Brandon:
To pin it, what is that?

Amanda:
So they take like steel beams and they drive them down into the ground until they hit a certain PSI. And so when they get past all the lime rock and all the sediment and everything, when they get to a certain PSI, they anchor that beam. And then they anchor the other end on the house, it’s kind of like a bracket, right?

Brandon:
Okay, yeah.

Amanda:
So they put it under the house and so now your house is supported by usually about 30 beams on the entire perimeter of the home. And now once it’s repaired and once it’s remediated, the ARV is exactly the same as any other house in my community. In fact, sometimes they’re even more desirable because in my area, it’s almost not, do you have a sinkhole? It’s when are you going to get a sinkhole? A lot of people would rather have one that’s repaired so they do not have to deal with it in the future.

Brandon:
California is like that with earthquakes, that’s what it sounds like you’re describing, like the retrofitting that they do to make it safer for earthquakes is what they’re doing out there. Wasn’t there a case of a sinkhole in, was it Bowling Green, Kentucky, maybe where they make the Corvettes? I think that was a big thing in the news.

David:
I think that was a thing.

Brandon:
Yeah. They had a huge hole and all these like really expensive Corvettes fell into the sinkhole.

Amanda:
Oh, that was too bad. That would be so bad.

Brandon:
Yeah. So this is really interesting that … Here’s what I want to ask, how did you find this niche? Did someone tell you about this? Did you just stumble upon it?

Amanda:
So like I said, you guys were the ones that kind of said, go after the things that nobody else wants. And if you live, we’re called sinkhole alley. I mean, they’re so prevalent here that if you live here, you just know about them, I mean, it’s just how it is. It’s like hurricanes, sinkholes, we have to deal with all that. So, what I did was I ran an ad in the newspaper. So in my community, there’s a newspaper called the Senior Voice and it’s for all the older people. And so I ran an ad, I ran a full-page ad and said that I bought sinkhole homes and that I was a sinkhole specialist, but I had never bought a sinkhole home.

Brandon:
You’re a specialist.

Amanda:
But that got me a ton of leads and I was able to purchase quite a few. I’ve done quite a few of them, and I was able to purchase those, remediate them, and then turn around and sell them.

Brandon:
And just so I can … I want to pull out a couple of things here, because a lot of people might be listening to this and they’re thinking super specific right now. Like oh well, I don’t have sinkholes in my area, so I’m not going to … this doesn’t apply to me. Like it might be a sinkhole, might be asbestos, it might be lead based paint, it might be bad tenants that need to be evicted. I think right now, one of the biggest opportunities we have in the next six months to a year is all these tenants like in the US that have just not paid rent for months and months and months and their landlords haven’t been able to do anything about it. Like that’s a massive problem. And so like people yeah, there’s solutions to this.

Amanda:
So, interesting enough that you bring up about the tenants, my property manager has effectively COVID proofed my tenants.

Brandon:
I love that.

Amanda:
Yeah. I have a phenomenal property manager. She is absolutely amazing. She is incredibly smart. What she has done is she has put in place tenants who have multiple sources of income and we’re not talking about hin and her, we’re talking about just one of them having multiple sources. So if COVID takes one away, we can still pay rent on their other sources of income.

Brandon:
That’s great.

Amanda:
It’s phenomenal. I have not had an issue, not yet at all.

David:
Yeah, that’s great.

Brandon:
Yeah, I love it. So what your story really illustrates here, what I love is that you had this passion, this dream, you had a need, like a need, you had to figure this thing out. You went out there and you did it. You got like what I call level one financial freedom. You can pay your bills with it, which is great because now that gives you, that’s like if you played Cashflow the game, you’re outside the little rat race circle and now you have the ability. Once you achieve level one financial freedom, you can go do other stuff to either make more money. Like now you’re flipping houses because you can do that, you don’t have to rely on … the fear of like, well, what if a month or two goes by without getting a flip? Well, your bills are paid.
So you have that freedom to go do that. When I was 27, I had enough cashflow, I was making three grand a month. It was enough to pay all my bills. And I was like, all right, well, I guess I can go start a podcast so that’s where the BiggerPockets podcast came from me. Me and Josh started that because we’re like, I mean, I didn’t have to worry about like what I was going to do. And so this is so like so important, just this idea of like, get that level one financial freedom, like have a reason why, I mean, everything you’re talking about is just so good.

Amanda:
Thank you.

Brandon:
So let’s talk a little bit about the flipping. Like what kind of like volume do you do? I mean, are you doing 20 a month? Are you doing a couple a year?

Amanda:
Oh, goodness!

Brandon:
Not that.

Amanda:
I wish I was doing that. Well, for me, I started in real estate. I did not know the difference between a 20 year roof and a 30 year roof. I didn’t know what a double tap was, I didn’t know what a shark bite was.

Brandon:
And then it double’s up like when you kill a zombie and then you hit him a second time, isn’t that a thing?

Amanda:
Yeah, exactly.

Brandon:
A double-tap, anyway.

Amanda:
So, all in due time, I would love to do 20 flips a month, but I had to learn from nothing, this industry. So I started when I flipped in 2016 and then 2017, every year I do more because I learn more and I understand the process more now. So I’m at a point now where I would love to scale and I can scale because now I have teams in place. I have a lot more education under my belt. I’m very confident in what I do now. So probably per year I might do half a dozen or maybe eight or 10, but now I’m at a point where I feel confident and comfortable enough to scale to get to 20 or more a year.

David:
Well still, half a dozen a year, that’s more than I ever did in a year. Like I’m not a flipper much either, but like, I do a few in a year and I’m like, oh, that was a good year. So you’re still killing it.

Brandon:
What have you found it’s like to flip and I hate this question because even just asking it comes across kind of weird, but like it’s true. Flipping as a woman is different than flipping as a man, right? Like it’s largely “A man’s world” of dealing with contractors and all that. Have you found that or it has not been an issue at all?

Amanda:
No, no. It’s an issue.

Brandon:
Okay.

Amanda:
Unfortunately, it is an issue. You can’t let it stop you. I combat that with education. I know what I’m talking about. If I don’t I ask a lot of questions and I speak to a lot of ladies. A lot of ladies come up to me and say, gosh, I wish I could do what you do. I don’t know where to start, I’m not confident. It’s such a male dominated industry and I just want to say, but use it to your advantage. I love to be the underdog and be underestimated, so there’s a lot to be said about being underestimated and going in and beating the boys out. I love doing that, sorry.
So ladies, it’s great. Especially with negotiating, twice now, twice that I know of, I beat the boys out in negotiations, not because I had more money. The first one, I was the lowest bidder by 10 grand. The second one, I was the lowest bidder by $17,000. And it was only because I went in there, not a heavy hitter. I didn’t go in there aggressive. I went in there and I figured out exactly why these ladies needed to sell their home. It had nothing to do with the money. So if you could just use that to your advantage ladies, you could really, really make it in real estate. And I really wish that a lot more women would come and get into the business. You had Ash on a couple episodes ago, the only woman in the room, I haven’t even read the book, but I have been there, I know exactly what she’s talking about.
I would go to REIA meetings, I would not only be the only woman in the room, I would be like the youngest one in the room. And I would be the only one in the room with a small child sitting there at the meeting. So do what you have to do, it’s not a bad thing. I’m very passionate about it, I’m very passionate about helping other ladies. I help a lot of other ladies where and when I can, but I just can’t stress it enough, it is not a bad thing, it’s a good thing. Get out there and do it.

David:
Yeah. That’s so good. Well, that’s always when we get in our own way, when we assume there’s something about me that won’t let me succeed because I’m not like everyone else and I can’t do it. And then you went and found that, that thing that made you different than everyone became a competitive advantage in many scenarios. So that’s just why Brandon and I were harping so much on mindset now because real estate is really simple. I’m sure you can agree, Amanda. It’s not easy, but it’s simple.

Amanda:
And it’s not rocket science.

David:
Yes, it’s our own self that gets in the way of being successful. Is that similar to what you found?

Amanda:
Absolutely. Oh my goodness, yes.

David:
So I got a question for you about that. When it comes to what catches your eye in a deal, can you share with the listeners what you see that makes you go, ooh, I want to pursue that one?

Amanda:
Oh goodness. I’m at the point now I could walk into the house and I can just see it in my head all redone, all prettied up, new cabinets, new flooring, new lighting. I look for a location, I can’t change the location of a house. Is it in a good neighborhood? Is it in a upcoming neighborhood? Does it have good bones? If it has a weird layout, I don’t really like them, weird layouts are hard to sell. Is it open, airy, have a good feel about it? I just know immediately. I know immediately when I walk up, I know what my buyers are looking for, I know what’s going to sell in the market. Every day I look at what has sold. I look at what finishes were put in, so I know what that neighborhood needs to have, as far as the rehab.
I think it just comes from experience. When I first started and I still do this. When I first started, I would drive around. I’d pop into other people’s rehabs. I did not know these people, I didn’t care. I just knock on the door. Hey, what are you guys doing?

Brandon:
That’s awesome.

Amanda:
That’s one of the tips. I speak at a lot of local REIAs and this, that, and the other, a lot of women’s groups. And I give a lot of tips on how to get started and how to build your knowledge base and knocking on other people’s rehabs doors and seeing what they’re doing, where did you get those cabinets? What kind of flooring is that? What contractors do you use and start getting to know the other investors in your community. And they, I have not had one person to turn me down when I was asking questions or inquiring about building supplies or materials or what have you. So that’s a really good way to get started.

Brandon:
That is such a good tip. And it’s something that people right now are listening and they’re nodding, going, that’s a really good idea. And then they’re never going to do, but like it’s so easy. You see a rehab, you pull over, you walk up to the front door and talk to the people. Like it’s sometimes the simplest things are like the hardest to do.

Amanda:
Yeah.

Brandon:
Oh man. All right. So today, like if you could sum up like what are the best ways right now you’re finding deals? Like how are you finding deals today and then how are you funding deals today?

Amanda:
So primarily all my deals are off market. I find them all driving for dollars, mostly driving for dollars, knocking on doors. I also encourage people to let everybody that you know, know what you do, let them know what you’re passionate about. People are very willing to help you when you’re very excited about your business. And I tell all my soccer mom friends, I say, listen, you give me a lead I close on, I will take care of you voluntarily. I will make it worth your while. When I’m driving around knocking on doors, I go to the neighbor and say, hey, I got $500, if you can give me their information and I close on that deal, I will give you some money. So word of mouth is a big one. I get a lot of deals that way, but mostly it’s me out pounding the pavement.

Brandon:
Yeah. I love that you said the driving for dollars thing too. We’ve been working at BiggerPockets on developing some new stuff that may be out by now, it may not be, so I won’t talk too much about it yet, but oh, we got a new product coming out in the BiggerPocket, it’s going to help with a lot of off-market deal finding stuff and driving for deals is one of those, like driving around looking for those properties. What do you look for? Like what immediately on the outside of a property are you like, that’s something I want to stop and write down the address and look them up or email or call or mail a letter to, what triggers that?

Amanda:
Unkept tall grass, bad roofs is a big one. Here in Florida we get hammered with weather. So bad roofs, tall grass, trash everywhere, unkept. I’ll go look in the windows, if it’s all old, if it’s 1970 or ’80 original, I want that house. And I’ll mail a letter. I’ll knock on neighbor’s doors. I’ll skip trace them. I’ll call them. I’ll call their neighbors. I’ll call whoever I can get ahold of. And from there I’ll negotiate the deal.

Brandon:
Yeah, it’s really, again, it’s not rocket science.

Amanda:
It’s pretty easy.

Brandon:
What about funding those properties? When you get a flip under contract, you want to go flip a house, what do you do for funding?

Amanda:
Right now I’m using my own capital. I am looking at bringing on some private money lenders so I can scale. That’s what I hope to do. At first, when I very first started, I did have to use hard money for a couple deals. But after that, I just kind of let my capital snowball with each deal. And oh, I also brought on a business partner. So she and I now flip together. It’s on, you have more capital together to purchase, you have more purchasing power. Two, now you have two brains on the deal and two is better than one and three, it is so much more fun to do it with somebody else. So when I first started, it was all by myself, but now I have a business partner and we’re just rocking and rolling. I mean, it’s great. It’s phenomenal.

Brandon:
That’s cool. How did you know, how’d you find your partner and how did you know they were the right one for you?

Amanda:
So one of the local REIA meetings, she showed up, she is a realtor. She showed up and just said, “Hey, I’m here, I want to learn. I want to invest myself.” So she and I just hit it off. We were out driving for dollars one day, just running around, we happened upon a deal. And we’re like, well, what do you think about doing this one together? Well okay, let’s try it. So we said, we’ll do that one together. We’re going to do one. We’re going to see how this one goes and if it goes well, we’ll talk about the next one. Well, that has been since 2016 and we’re still together, still flipping, making a lot of money. It’s so much fun.

Brandon:
It’s the best way to find a partner. I really think so. It’s like, do a deal and then do another one, then do another one, see how it goes. You don’t know how someone is going to be until you work with them a little bit. So just-

Amanda:
Oh, we have so much fun. We get into so much shenanigans. It is, I’m living the dream. I mean, I’m working harder than I’ve ever worked in my life as far as like physically goes, but it is great. I’m living the dream. I couldn’t ask for anything more.

Brandon:
That’s phenomenal. All right. Well, let’s move this along and go to the next segment of the show. It’s time for our deal-

David:
Deal.

Brandon:
Deep dive.

David:
Deep dive.

Brandon:
It’s part of the show where we dive deep into one particular deal that you’ve done. So Amanda, without further ado, let’s jump into the questions here. Number one, first of all, do you have a property in mind you can think of that we can-

Amanda:
Yes.

Brandon:
Okay, good. First one, what is the property? What type of property is it and where’s it located?

Amanda:
It’s a two, two block home located in Spring Hill.

Brandon:
All right. Two, two block home, Spring Hill. All right, next question.

David:
And how did you find that deal?

Amanda:
This is the deal I spoke about earlier. It was the probate lien deal. So it came from a probate list that I mailed a letter and she called me.

Brandon:
Perfect. How much was the property? What they want and then what’d you buy it for?

Amanda:
Well, they wanted 6,500 cash-

Brandon:
Oh sorry, that one, okay.

Amanda:
And I purchased it on the BOA note for 4,200.

Brandon:
Okay.

David:
Did you negotiate that, how did you come up with that number?

Amanda:
That’s what she wanted, she wanted that 6,500. I don’t recall why she wanted that, but that’s what she wanted. And I didn’t even try to negotiate her down because it was such a good deal. I do that a lot. If a seller comes to me and says, this is what I want. And I’m like, you know what? I can make that work. So let’s just roll with it.

Brandon:
There you go.

Amanda:
So that’s what I did.

Brandon:
All right. So we know that you negotiated that way. You funded it with the, you said earlier the subject two, right?

Amanda:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Brandon:
So you just took it with their mortgage in place and then you said you rented it earlier. So do you still have it today? Did you eventually refinance it? Like what was the long-term story with that?

Amanda:
So this one’s very interesting. I moved in a tenant and he was a vet and he called me about six or eight months later. And he says, “Amanda, I love this home. My daughter loves this home, I really don’t want to move again. I just don’t, can I purchase it?” And I said, ” Well, Tom, I wasn’t really intending to sell that house. Let me think about this for a minute.” And I said, I thought about it and I went back to him and I said, ” Okay. So if we can agree upon a price, I’ll sell you this house, but I won’t sell it to you until I have owned it a year and a day.” And he’s like, “Well, okay, that sounds good.” So we negotiated an $85,000 purchase price and I waited and he waited until I owned that property a year and a day to close.

Brandon:
Why did that matter to you, a yer and a day?

Amanda:
Because I wanted to do a 1031 exchange.

Brandon:
Okay.

Amanda:
Yeah. I wanted to utilize the tax benefit of that 1031 so well, I didn’t have to pay taxes on all my products and I wanted to roll that into another property.

Brandon:
And you’re saying if it’s within a year, it’s a short-term capital gain, so it wouldn’t be eligible for 1031?

Amanda:
So the 1031 exchange has rules. And to be able to utilize that you have to have owned a property for a year and a day at minimum.

Brandon:
Yeah. Makes sense.

David:
Got you.

Brandon:
Okay. So what did you end up doing with this deal?

Amanda:
Well, I wanted to roll it into one property, but that’s not what I actually did. I rolled it into two cash flowing rental properties with very little money out of my pocket.

Brandon:
That’s awesome.

Amanda:
Pretty great.

David:
That’s awesome.

Brandon:
So you took one property-

Amanda:
And I still own those two today.

Brandon:
And they both got flowing?

Amanda:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Brandon:
Cool.

Amanda:
I love taking one property and either turning that one property into two or one or more rental properties. And that’s what I was able to do. So I utilized my sub 2 deal with a 1031 exchange and I used all the proceeds to roll that into two cash flowing houses, two block homes that cashflow crazy with very little money out of my pocket.

David:
That’s so good.

Brandon:
So good. All right. And what did you learn from this deal? Any lessons you can pull out or you can teach people about it?

Amanda:
Oh goodness. Yes, I learned a lot. I mean, I learned that I didn’t need a whole lot of money to invest in real estate. I learned the art of taking one deal and turning it into multiple. I learned the ins and outs of 1031 exchange. I learned the ins and outs of subject 2 deals. I had to hire a lawyer for all this and a 1031 custodian. So I was able to get plugged in with people who are much smarter than me in those fields. So I was able to use those in future deals of mine as well, so that’s good. It was really good.

Brandon:
That’s phenomenal.

David:
Well, that’s awesome. We should probably mention a few things about a 1031 exchange. The first one that a lot of people get wrong is that they think that they can get the money put in their own account. And then they just have the 45 days. Yes, that face you just made. I’ve had clients make that before. So you cannot have what is called constructive receipt. So you need to set up basically, it’s like an escrow company that handles the funds on your 1031 exchange. And then you’ve got 45 days to identify or is it? Yeah, it’s 45, right?

Amanda:
It’s 45 to identify 180 to Close.

David:
180 to close.

Amanda:
Yes.

David:
There you go. And that’s not like holidays or business days. Brandon’s got a good story. He’s got some 1031 sweat that he can share with us some day. He had a really good story there, but please, if you’re thinking about copying this strategy, don’t make the mistake of thinking you just get the money on a regular sale and then go 1031 because it won’t be [inaudible 00:47:16].

Amanda:
No. Before you want to utilize a 1031, you really do before the sale of the property, you want to go find the custodian or a company that does this and let them handle all the paperwork. The money actually does have to go from closing to them. It doesn’t ever actually go to your account or in your hands. It goes to what they call a custodian and they sit on it until you’re ready to purchase your next property.

David:
Yeah.

Amanda:
In my case it was two.

David:
That’s awesome.

Brandon:
Yeah. It also shows like the monopoly strategy of like, houses to hotel. It’s not that you had a hotel, but you traded up from one house to two of them and made more money. And I bought a 1031 for my 24 unit into another 24 unit and then mobile home park. So I went from 24 units to 75 units like that. And yeah, you can just do that kind of thing throughout your life. I mean, until they do away with the 1031 someday.

David:
Yeah, until the 1031 ges away.

Brandon:
[crosstalk 00:48:16]. And I hope not to. Every election cycle comes back and they start talking about getting rid of it and then they never actually do get rid of it because half of Congress owns real estate and they like it, but we’ll see. We’ll see. All right, well, that was a good deal deep dive.

Amanda:
Thank you.

Brandon:
And now it’s time to conclude today’s show with our famous four. All right. The famous four. This is the part of the show we ask the same four questions every week to every guest. And so I’m sure you’ve heard them many times before, but now it’s your turn. And with that, Amanda, let’s get into the famous four. Question number one.

Amanda:
Okay.

Brandon:
Favorite real estate related book.

Amanda:
Has to be Rich Dad Poor Dad, hands down, completely changed my life. I highly recommend that to anyone who is getting started or if they’ve just never read it, they really, really do need to sit down and read it.

Brandon:
All right.

David:
Awesome. What is your favorite business book?

Amanda:
So my favorite business book, actually I chose one that is, I feel a prerequisite to business and it’s called Daring Greatly by Dr. Brene Brown. And I know you have the quote behind you.

Brandon:
I do. You’re the first person to ever notice that I had that quote behind me, I think. I don’t think anybody has ever brought that up. Actually, I read that quote in that book and I was like, that’s such a good quote. And so I put it behind me.

Amanda:
It’s amazing. So this book kind of gave me the courage, it taught me to show up, be seen, I’m going to step into a large arena and I might fail. And if I fail, it’s going to be okay. So this where Rich Dad Poor Dad kind of gave me the dream, this one gave me the courage to go ahead and step out of my comfort zone and do it.

Brandon:
All right.

David:
When you’re not tracking down sinkholes, filming TV shows, making dreams come true, what are some of your hobbies?

Amanda:
I love to be on the water. I’m an avid kayaker. I have a set board and as often as I can, I like to be out kayaking or on the boat fishing, something like that.

David:
All right, very cool. Well, my final question, what do you think separates successful real estate investors from those who give up, fail or just never get started?

Amanda:
Hands down Grit. I read that book and I’m like, that’s me. Absolutely Grit. I’m not the smartest. I don’t have the most money. So I have a lot of determination and grit. So that is what pushed me and got me through to where I am today.

David:
That’s so cool.

Brandon:
I think you’re smarter than you give yourself credit for, you are a rocket ship. It’s awesome to see.

David:
Absolutely.

Amanda:
Oh, thank you.

Brandon:
Congratulations. That’s very, very cool. Well yeah, it’s been awesome having you on the show today, but we’re not quite done. David’s got one more question for you before we get you out of here.

David:
Last question of the day, tell us where people can find out more about you?

Amanda:
Well, I’ll provide my email so they can email me if they like, I love talking to people and encouraging other ladies. So please reach out. And you can find me on Instagram. And I also run my towns, local REIA. So you’re welcome to come to our free meeting once a month. What I also do is I do onsite rehab meetings. So when I purchase a property, I’ll do a onsite before, I won’t touch it. I’ll have everyone come through and look at it. And then I’ll do a post onsite meeting where after I’m done with the rehab and we have the appraisal back, I’ll have everyone come walk through and I’ll provide exactly what I spent where, and I’ll share my contractors and other people that I’ve used to rehab the house and I’ll show them exactly what the numbers shook out to be. What did I make, where I had to spend my money and did the deal go well or didn’t it? So you guys are welcome to come to that as well.

David:
Awesome.

Brandon:
Very cool. Well, Amanda, this has been fantastic. Really, really good.

Amanda:
Thank you.

Brandon:
Yeah, you’re just like such a inspiration and just a proof of all the stuff we talk about on the show and proof that like, if you want it bad enough, you can really do anything and congratulations on all your success. And I look forward to seeing where you head in the future, by the way, where are you headed in the future? What’s do you want to do the next five, 10, 20 years? Where do you see yourself?

Amanda:
I like to tell people I’m an opportunist, so I want to keep doing what I’m doing. I absolutely love it. And I’m excited for what opportunities that might come my way. So I would like to keep flipping and acquiring once rental properties until maybe I meet a certain passive income amount, and then maybe I’ll take a little vacation or something break. I do want to take an RV across America eventually. So I’m gearing up for having the ability to do that. My son is going to graduate high school and I’m hoping to have enough passive income where I can just take off in my RV and travel wherever I want for as long as I want.

Brandon:
That’s amazing. And final question. I forgot to ask this earlier, how can our audience provide value to you?

Amanda:
I am looking for private money lenders, so I can scale this business a little bit more than what I have. So right now that’s really what I need is some private money lenders.

Brandon:
Cool, Amanda. Well, thank you very much. And David Green, you want to get us out of here?

David:
Yes, sir. This is David Greene from Brandon, a wise man once said Turner, signing off.

Speaker 3:
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