Is it ilegal to use fake POF? [[ WHOLESALING ]]

Wholesaling
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Is it ilegal to use fake POF? [[ WHOLESALING ]]

Account Closed
Rental Property Investor · Yuma, AZ · Member since 2019 · 637 posts · 46 votes

I KNOW IT MIGHT DEPEND. BUT, IS IT ILEGAL TO USE FAKE POF IN ORDER TO GET A PROPERTY UNDER CONTRACT

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Bill Plymouth
Real Estate Agent · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2018 · 416 posts · 396 votes
7y

@Account Closed conduct yourself with integrity.  Real estate investing is not about tricking people into giving you a good deal.  It’s about working with sellers to solve their problem and find a win-win scenario.  

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  • Theresa HarrisPro Member
    Member since 2019 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
    7y

    @Account Closed  It is illegal to use ANY fake documents.

    7Reply
  • Russell BrazilBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes
    7y

    Yes. That would be fraud.

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    7Reply
  • Briannan Burns
    Investor · Birmingham, AL · Member since 2019 · 42 posts · 11 votes
    7y

    Yes. Also, I'm sure you would be held accountable if anything were to fall through, because you provided the "proof".

    2Reply
  • Frank Wong
    Real Estate Broker · Bay Area · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    If you need to use fake documents to buy a property you are not financially ready. Don't go down this path, don't justify it in anyway, its fraud. 

    11Reply
  • Matthew Couto
    Realtor · Concord, NH · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 30 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed Any document you provide as proof will hold you accountable to the agreement- if that document is fake then that would be considered fraudulent.  I believe you could be sued for that also!

    2Reply
  • Bill Plymouth
    Real Estate Agent · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2018 · 416 posts · 396 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed conduct yourself with integrity.  Real estate investing is not about tricking people into giving you a good deal.  It’s about working with sellers to solve their problem and find a win-win scenario.  

    13Reply
  • Account Closed
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Yuma, AZ · Member since 2019 · 637 posts · 46 votes
    7y

    @Bill Plymouth they still want POF

    0Reply
  • Bill Plymouth
    Real Estate Agent · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2018 · 416 posts · 396 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed are you attempting to wholesale this property?  Are you speaking with an owner or an agent?  

    1Reply
  • Account Closed
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Yuma, AZ · Member since 2019 · 637 posts · 46 votes
    7y

    @Bill Plymouth agents

    0Reply
  • Jack Seiden
    Real Estate Agent · Washington DC · Member since 2016 · 847 posts · 656 votes
    7y

    This is the textbook definition of fraud 

    4Reply
  • Bill Plymouth
    Real Estate Agent · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2018 · 416 posts · 396 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed an agent is always going to ask for a proof of funds.  You are never going to get a property from an agent without a proof of funds.  You’re barking up the wrong tree there.  Wholesale works better when you are in direct contact with the owner, with no agents involved. 

    2Reply
  • Bill Plymouth
    Real Estate Agent · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2018 · 416 posts · 396 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed I would strongly suggest that you take a few steps back, educate yourself, build capital, and learn how to invest in real estate without committing fraud.  You might not have enough knowledge to accomplish this yet 

    3Reply
  • Account Closed
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Yuma, AZ · Member since 2019 · 637 posts · 46 votes
    7y

    @Bill Plymouth I will use the cash buyers proof of funds!

    0Reply
  • Account Closed
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Yuma, AZ · Member since 2019 · 637 posts · 46 votes
    7y

    @Frank Wong I will use the cash buyers' proof of funds. Frank! LIFE IS SHORT!😎

    0Reply
  • Bill Plymouth
    Real Estate Agent · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2018 · 416 posts · 396 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed great.  I would strongly suggest you delete this post.  BP has already been under the eye of the media recently.  A post like this doesn’t look good for the site.  

    1Reply
  • Lydia R.
    Investor · Austin TX · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    @Fili Aguirre People like you are the reason that wholesalers get such a bad reputation. Wholesalers get labelled as scammers, criminals, deviants and unethical and its people like you engaging in practices such as using fake POF that cause an entire group of people to be painted with one broad brush.

    9Reply
  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Lydia R.:

    @Fili Aguirre People like you are the reason that wholesalers get such a bad reputation. Wholesalers get labelled as scammers, criminals, deviants and unethical and its people like you engaging in practices such as using fake POF that cause an entire group of people to be painted with one broad brush.

    Same with the less than ethical HML that sell POF's for 50 bucks with doing no underwriting or verification that their client can perform.

    I think this has slowed down but for a while it was rampant..    

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  • Lydia R.
    Investor · Austin TX · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    @Jay Hinrichs Wow I didnt know there were HMLs that were doing that! Completely disgusting.

    0Reply
  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Lydia R.:

    @Jay Hinrichs Wow I didnt know there were HMLs that were doing that! Completely disgusting. 

    OH ya.. was very common hopefully many have cleaned up their act.. you know for a fact most wholesalers starting out would not qualify for any kind of loan period.. they either have next to zero money and or bad credit or both. but yet there is the POF.

    I also get wholesaler sending me screen shots of someone's bank account its usually not theirs or it can be photo shopped.. I then ask them to give me the phone number of their banker so I can verbally confirm..  that  usually creates a crickets response from them. 

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  • Lydia R.
    Investor · Austin TX · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    @Jay Hinrichs. 🤦🏽‍♀️🤦🏽‍♀️🤦🏽‍♀️🤦🏽‍♀️🤦🏽‍♀️

    0Reply
  • Aaron K.
    Specialist · Riverside, CA · Member since 2015 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    @Account Closed FRAUD alert. Even if you use your "buyer's" POF they aren't on the contract so it is still FRAUD all caps, go directly to jail do not pass go do not collect $200.

    6Reply
  • Account Closed
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Yuma, AZ · Member since 2019 · 637 posts · 46 votes
    7y

    @Aaron K. I will say I work with a group of investors and I "might" assign the contract or use the investors' funds to fund the deal 😎

    It doesnt sound like "Fraud" anymore. correct?

    0Reply
  • Wayne Brooks
    Real Estate Professional · West Palm Beach, FL · Member since 2012 · 23k+ posts · 13k+ votes
    7y

    @Account Closed This is Exactly why seller's and agents require a POF.....to prevent this "I have no money, but I hope to flip the contract" crap.

    To be clear, sellers/agents only accept a POF which shows the cash in the name of the person signing b the contract/making the offer.....not some other third party.

    1Reply
  • Aaron K.
    Specialist · Riverside, CA · Member since 2015 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    @Account Closed no because you don't as best I can tell.  That would be like showing them Wells Fargo's balance sheet as proof of funds, they also *might* fund the deal.  Sometimes white lies when negotiating are okay such as "Oh this one is gonna be slim for me" or things like that.  Other than that do NOT lie to or mislead someone in a real estate transaction full stop.

    1Reply
  • Nancy P.
    Naperville, IL · Member since 2018 · 330 posts · 357 votes
    7y

    Life IS short---unless you spend it in prison.  Which it looks like what your end goal is.  Do the right thing, FFS.

    5Reply
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