How can Blockchain be integrated into the "title search process" of buying a home?
New Haven, CT · Member since 2020 · 62 posts · 18 votes
How can Blockchain be integrated into the "title search process" of buying a home?
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Investor · VA · Member since 2015 · 21k+ posts · 19k+ votes
2y@Carlos Ptriawan
Some
Companies do this as they have title farms I believe
But as mentioned you have counties in many areas of this country where aunt bettty and uncle Billy have been working the desk in the recorders office for 50 years and will hand it down and everything is done in person - not even electronic filing
Then you have areas like lake county Indiana that are so corrupt they also don’t do electronic (or didn’t for years) because of politics / corruption
So while it’s a perfect example - government will not allow it to get implemented as it would be efficient and reduce costs which the government never wants to do that
7e investments53 Reviews
12 Replies
- Rental Property Investor · RVA · Member since 2016 · 5k+ posts · 4k+ votes2y
Probably not. If so it'll be a long time. It has nothing to do with the technology. Rather, it depends on government adoption of such a technology. If that were to happen, it's going to be a long time from now, in my estimation. Governments have no real reason to adopt such a technology at this time.
I would expect a GPT type technology to be far more useful in this situation. It'll take some time for the technology to develop in for this specific vertical, but compared to a blockchain I'm far more bullish on GPT technology.
- Member since 2022 · 3 posts · 2 votes2y
Weird to pose this question this way. Almost sounds like a solution in search of a problem. This has been common to several blockchain use cases. This is a long video but worth the investment of time.
- New Haven, CT · Member since 2020 · 62 posts · 18 votes2y
Quote from @Taylor L.:
Probably not. If so it'll be a long time. It has nothing to do with the technology. Rather, it depends on government adoption of such a technology. If that were to happen, it's going to be a long time from now, in my estimation. Governments have no real reason to adopt such a technology at this time.
I would expect a GPT type technology to be far more useful in this situation. It'll take some time for the technology to develop in for this specific vertical, but compared to a blockchain I'm far more bullish on GPT technology.
I see your argument. Its an interesting point and much is changing which is why we are both talking about it so we can stay above the curve. One thing that can't go away, is the relationships we make so that referrals keep coming in!
- Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes2y
Quote from @Alexander King:
Do you think the blockchain technology to record and verify transactions on one mutually accepted ledger will ever be able to be accomplished for USA real estate? I understand the general process of how the title companies like Catic operate but would anyone with more in depth knowledge be able to elaborate on how the specifics would be able to be transitioned to a blockchain platform? Do any title companies already use blockchain in their operations? If not would it be possible to start one that does.
I think there would be danger if you keep hard asset transaction into crypto-like transaction. The threat of cybersecurity is extremey serious and I can tell you hacker is always two step ahead of the good guy.
However there still need to capture all transaction in one cloud-like that saves the whole database and AI or LLM model could create faster title insurance issuance.
- Investor · VA · Member since 2015 · 21k+ posts · 19k+ votes2y
@Carlos Ptriawan
Some
Companies do this as they have title farms I believe
But as mentioned you have counties in many areas of this country where aunt bettty and uncle Billy have been working the desk in the recorders office for 50 years and will hand it down and everything is done in person - not even electronic filing
Then you have areas like lake county Indiana that are so corrupt they also don’t do electronic (or didn’t for years) because of politics / corruption
So while it’s a perfect example - government will not allow it to get implemented as it would be efficient and reduce costs which the government never wants to do that
7e investments53 Reviews - Specialist · Winter Springs, FL · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 747 votes2y
The idea of using block chain tech in title recording is not new, it's been discussed for years.
One of problems in implementation is where and when do you start. US land records go back to before there was a US. Some titles start with a grant from the King of Spain or France or England. Some states have laws that cut off ancient claims at 30 years or 40 or 60 so maybe you could start there. So, if you start at 30 years, who's going to bear the cost of someone chaining the title for every piece of property in the US?
Then you have a problem with ambiguity in legals and the interpretation of the interests in the property. States that were one of the 13 original colonies don't have the benefit of having been surveyed and laid out under standard plan like the subsequent states. Legal descriptions in those states can rely on the old apple tree on farmer Brown's property as a boundary. Figuring its location today takes a lot of field work, interpretation of land records, historical use and guesses.
Then there's US Government Survey work which is notoriously inaccurate. Overlaps and hiatuses abound.
Easements can also be ambiguous in their location and terms.
Then we get to the issue of interpretation of what's found. Was the easement just for ingress and egress to the lake or is the easement holder also entitled to park there and put out a chair? Was the grantor competent to sign the deed or does the fact that she was 98 years old and in a nursing home when the evil sister (ES) had her sign the deed that left out her other daughter and son render her subject to claims of incompetency to the undue influence of ES? Or did mom sign at all since the medical records show she was in and out of consciousness at the time.
These are all examples of things that lead to title disputes that just identifying the interest may not resolve. Title insurance claims people work out these issues every day. With a block chain, who is going to step up to resolve the issues and reimburse the losing party?
- Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes2y
Quote from @Peter Walther:
The idea of using block chain tech in title recording is not new, it's been discussed for years.
One of problems in implementation is where and when do you start. US land records go back to before there was a US. Some titles start with a grant from the King of Spain or France or England. Some states have laws that cut off ancient claims at 30 years or 40 or 60 so maybe you could start there. So, if you start at 30 years, who's going to bear the cost of someone chaining the title for every piece of property in the US?
Then you have a problem with ambiguity in legals and the interpretation of the interests in the property. States that were one of the 13 original colonies don't have the benefit of having been surveyed and laid out under standard plan like the subsequent states. Legal descriptions in those states can rely on the old apple tree on farmer Brown's property as a boundary. Figuring its location today takes a lot of field work, interpretation of land records, historical use and guesses.
Then there's US Government Survey work which is notoriously inaccurate. Overlaps and hiatuses abound.
Easements can also be ambiguous in their location and terms.
Then we get to the issue of interpretation of what's found. Was the easement just for ingress and egress to the lake or is the easement holder also entitled to park there and put out a chair? Was the grantor competent to sign the deed or does the fact that she was 98 years old and in a nursing home when the evil sister (ES) had her sign the deed that left out her other daughter and son render her subject to claims of incompetency to the undue influence of ES? Or did mom sign at all since the medical records show she was in and out of consciousness at the time.
These are all examples of things that lead to title disputes that just identifying the interest may not resolve. Title insurance claims people work out these issues every day. With a block chain, who is going to step up to resolve the issues and reimburse the losing party?
I thought Alexander(OP) only ask for one buy and sell transaction to be recorded in blockchain, but not the whole county. That would be crazy and for what advantage ? Who can access the record ? hacker ..... lol
- New Haven, CT · Member since 2020 · 62 posts · 18 votes2y
Quote from @Peter Walther:
The idea of using block chain tech in title recording is not new, it's been discussed for years.
One of problems in implementation is where and when do you start. US land records go back to before there was a US. Some titles start with a grant from the King of Spain or France or England. Some states have laws that cut off ancient claims at 30 years or 40 or 60 so maybe you could start there. So, if you start at 30 years, who's going to bear the cost of someone chaining the title for every piece of property in the US?
Then you have a problem with ambiguity in legals and the interpretation of the interests in the property. States that were one of the 13 original colonies don't have the benefit of having been surveyed and laid out under standard plan like the subsequent states. Legal descriptions in those states can rely on the old apple tree on farmer Brown's property as a boundary. Figuring its location today takes a lot of field work, interpretation of land records, historical use and guesses.
Then there's US Government Survey work which is notoriously inaccurate. Overlaps and hiatuses abound.
Easements can also be ambiguous in their location and terms.
Then we get to the issue of interpretation of what's found. Was the easement just for ingress and egress to the lake or is the easement holder also entitled to park there and put out a chair? Was the grantor competent to sign the deed or does the fact that she was 98 years old and in a nursing home when the evil sister (ES) had her sign the deed that left out her other daughter and son render her subject to claims of incompetency to the undue influence of ES? Or did mom sign at all since the medical records show she was in and out of consciousness at the time.
These are all examples of things that lead to title disputes that just identifying the interest may not resolve. Title insurance claims people work out these issues every day. With a block chain, who is going to step up to resolve the issues and reimburse the losing party?
Use of AI can eventually be used to back date all the electronic records and the old school recordings would have to be scanned in. Once that is in, just like we pay for title insurance now, maybe it is then paid to the source of the company to integrates blockchain to record title. Just. a thought.
- Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes2y
Quote from @Alexander King:
Quote from @Peter Walther:
The idea of using block chain tech in title recording is not new, it's been discussed for years.
One of problems in implementation is where and when do you start. US land records go back to before there was a US. Some titles start with a grant from the King of Spain or France or England. Some states have laws that cut off ancient claims at 30 years or 40 or 60 so maybe you could start there. So, if you start at 30 years, who's going to bear the cost of someone chaining the title for every piece of property in the US?
Then you have a problem with ambiguity in legals and the interpretation of the interests in the property. States that were one of the 13 original colonies don't have the benefit of having been surveyed and laid out under standard plan like the subsequent states. Legal descriptions in those states can rely on the old apple tree on farmer Brown's property as a boundary. Figuring its location today takes a lot of field work, interpretation of land records, historical use and guesses.
Then there's US Government Survey work which is notoriously inaccurate. Overlaps and hiatuses abound.
Easements can also be ambiguous in their location and terms.
Then we get to the issue of interpretation of what's found. Was the easement just for ingress and egress to the lake or is the easement holder also entitled to park there and put out a chair? Was the grantor competent to sign the deed or does the fact that she was 98 years old and in a nursing home when the evil sister (ES) had her sign the deed that left out her other daughter and son render her subject to claims of incompetency to the undue influence of ES? Or did mom sign at all since the medical records show she was in and out of consciousness at the time.
These are all examples of things that lead to title disputes that just identifying the interest may not resolve. Title insurance claims people work out these issues every day. With a block chain, who is going to step up to resolve the issues and reimburse the losing party?
Use of AI can eventually be used to back date all the electronic records and the old school recordings would have to be scanned in. Once that is in, just like we pay for title insurance now, maybe it is then paid to the source of the company to integrates blockchain to record title. Just. a thought.
What is the cons of blockchain ?
- Specialist · Winter Springs, FL · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 747 votes2y
Quote from @Alexander King:
Quote from @Peter Walther:
The idea of using block chain tech in title recording is not new, it's been discussed for years.
One of problems in implementation is where and when do you start. US land records go back to before there was a US. Some titles start with a grant from the King of Spain or France or England. Some states have laws that cut off ancient claims at 30 years or 40 or 60 so maybe you could start there. So, if you start at 30 years, who's going to bear the cost of someone chaining the title for every piece of property in the US?
Then you have a problem with ambiguity in legals and the interpretation of the interests in the property. States that were one of the 13 original colonies don't have the benefit of having been surveyed and laid out under standard plan like the subsequent states. Legal descriptions in those states can rely on the old apple tree on farmer Brown's property as a boundary. Figuring its location today takes a lot of field work, interpretation of land records, historical use and guesses.
Then there's US Government Survey work which is notoriously inaccurate. Overlaps and hiatuses abound.
Easements can also be ambiguous in their location and terms.
Then we get to the issue of interpretation of what's found. Was the easement just for ingress and egress to the lake or is the easement holder also entitled to park there and put out a chair? Was the grantor competent to sign the deed or does the fact that she was 98 years old and in a nursing home when the evil sister (ES) had her sign the deed that left out her other daughter and son render her subject to claims of incompetency to the undue influence of ES? Or did mom sign at all since the medical records show she was in and out of consciousness at the time.
These are all examples of things that lead to title disputes that just identifying the interest may not resolve. Title insurance claims people work out these issues every day. With a block chain, who is going to step up to resolve the issues and reimburse the losing party?
Use of AI can eventually be used to back date all the electronic records and the old school recordings would have to be scanned in. Once that is in, just like we pay for title insurance now, maybe it is then paid to the source of the company to integrates blockchain to record title. Just. a thought.
Good luck.
- Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes2y
Quote from @Peter Walther:
Quote from @Alexander King:
Quote from @Peter Walther:
The idea of using block chain tech in title recording is not new, it's been discussed for years.
One of problems in implementation is where and when do you start. US land records go back to before there was a US. Some titles start with a grant from the King of Spain or France or England. Some states have laws that cut off ancient claims at 30 years or 40 or 60 so maybe you could start there. So, if you start at 30 years, who's going to bear the cost of someone chaining the title for every piece of property in the US?
Then you have a problem with ambiguity in legals and the interpretation of the interests in the property. States that were one of the 13 original colonies don't have the benefit of having been surveyed and laid out under standard plan like the subsequent states. Legal descriptions in those states can rely on the old apple tree on farmer Brown's property as a boundary. Figuring its location today takes a lot of field work, interpretation of land records, historical use and guesses.
Then there's US Government Survey work which is notoriously inaccurate. Overlaps and hiatuses abound.
Easements can also be ambiguous in their location and terms.
Then we get to the issue of interpretation of what's found. Was the easement just for ingress and egress to the lake or is the easement holder also entitled to park there and put out a chair? Was the grantor competent to sign the deed or does the fact that she was 98 years old and in a nursing home when the evil sister (ES) had her sign the deed that left out her other daughter and son render her subject to claims of incompetency to the undue influence of ES? Or did mom sign at all since the medical records show she was in and out of consciousness at the time.
These are all examples of things that lead to title disputes that just identifying the interest may not resolve. Title insurance claims people work out these issues every day. With a block chain, who is going to step up to resolve the issues and reimburse the losing party?
Use of AI can eventually be used to back date all the electronic records and the old school recordings would have to be scanned in. Once that is in, just like we pay for title insurance now, maybe it is then paid to the source of the company to integrates blockchain to record title. Just. a thought.
Good luck.
Why only good luck Peter :) I guess the idea doesn’t make sense but these GenZ are so much into crypto these days lol
- Member since 2022 · 3 posts · 2 votes2y
All, back to the original question (paraphrased): "will blockchain be used as a mutually-accepted ledger for recording and verifying U.S. real estate transactions?"
Answer: No. There is no way that this is happening in any meaningful way for the foreseeable future.
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