New Loan Level Price Adjustments - how does it impact you?

New Loan Level Price Adjustments - how does it impact you?

Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2019 · 434 posts · 248 votes

The Federal Housing Finance Agency, FHFA, the governing body that controls the conventional loan world.  Think of them as the parent of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.  They have set multiple new pricing grids for all conventional loans, and these pricing grids directly impact mortgage rates.  This is effective on all loans purchased by 5/1/23, so lenders may start implementing this in March or April.  FHFA changed the entire pricing grid, so while there are many many changes, here are some of larger highlights.  This only applies to conventional loans.

First, No significant pricing changes to:

1) Purchase/non cash out investment home or second home pricing

2) Purchase/non cash out Condo's

3) Purchase/non cash out of Manufactured homes

4) Subordinate financing hits (when you have a 1st and 2nd mortgage at the same time, there is price hit on the first mortgage)

Next, some of the larger changes to pricing:

1) Worse - Cash out got WAY WAY more expensive, especially over 70% loan to value and especially if your credit score is under 780.  For example, a cash out refi to 80% loan to value with a 680 credit score is going to be brutal...

2) Worse - High balance/super conforming loan sizes - got more expensive. Especially for ARM's and cash out. Like really crazy expensive. (this does not make sense to me, because these are high cost areas to live in, so they get a higher max loan size to stay conventional. These are not the uber wealthy, but they are getting hit big time now)

3) Worse - Your average borrower with a 720-759 credit score is paying more now

4) Worse - If your debt to income ratio is over 40%, you pay more now (silly rule, if we pre approve someone at 39% DTI but the underwriter changes it to 40%, now that borrower pays more.)

5) Better - 2-4 unit homes, pricing is a touch better now.  That is nice for investors.

6) Better -  borrower with a 620-699 credit score is paying less 

7) Better - 1st time home buyers within the area median income of their county get a better deal now (this went into effect a couple months ago)

There are a lot more small changes in these pricing grids, but overall I interpret this as the FHFA saying they want to make loans more expensive for anyone that has a home already or lives in a high cost area.  They want it to be more affordable for 1st time home buyers.  By looking at the numbers, I am also assuming that they want to improve the reserves of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac so they can be in position to one day be independent of the Federal Government and end their Sponsored entity status.  That is just my personal opinion based on the recent moves...


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Katie MillerPro Member
General Manager, Publishing at BiggerPockets · Denver, CO · Member since 2017 · 459 posts · 642 votes
3y

This is probably the most underrated post on BiggerPockets right now! 

See this reply in the discussion

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  • Investor · Youngstown, OH · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    3y

    I was already seeing high points for conventional loans. This is going to lead to a really interesting spring market. Realtors already turn their noses up at our FHA/VA/USDA borrowers, but those buyers are going to be flooding the market now.

  • Katie MillerPro Member
    General Manager, Publishing at BiggerPockets · Denver, CO · Member since 2017 · 459 posts · 642 votes
    3y

    This is probably the most underrated post on BiggerPockets right now! 

  • Lender · Tampa, FL · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    3y

    Hi @Zach Wain - Great, detailed post. This reminds me when Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, and Elizabeth Warren with absolutely zero lending background got together to teach us big bad lenders a lesson by making it harder for smaller operators to function thereby protecting their big campaign donors...the big banks (look up campaign contributors for those three...you'll be shocked). #4 on your pricing list, the DTI adjustment, is going to be unworkable. It's all silly, but I don't want to be here all day ranting, so I'll stick to that. LTV adjustments are straight forward and not really open to interpretation, but DTI can be calculated in many, many ways...particularly for self-employed borrowers. This is yet another example of regulation coming from those that have no idea what they are talking about. Good post.

  • Chris SeveneyBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Investor · VA · Member since 2015 · 21k+ posts · 19k+ votes
    3y

    @Zach Wain

    Would credit unions who hold their loans now be even more competitive ?

    7e investments53 Reviews
  • Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2019 · 434 posts · 248 votes
    3y

    @Chris Seveney - its possible, but I do not know the behind the scenes of how leveraged small banks and CU's are right now.  It makes more sense on large jumbo loans because they can underwrite less of them but have a larger amount of dollars lent out.  More efficient!  

    This makes FHA loans more competitive and we are seeing a big shift even for borrowers with perfect credit scores.

  • Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2019 · 434 posts · 248 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Katie Miller:

    This is probably the most underrated post on BiggerPockets right now! Can someone explain why those with good credit should be punished? 


     Thanks Katie, much appreciated!

  • Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2019 · 434 posts · 248 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Nicole Heasley Beitenman:

    I was already seeing high points for conventional loans. This is going to lead to a really interesting spring market. Realtors already turn their noses up at our FHA/VA/USDA borrowers, but those buyers are going to be flooding the market now.


    We are all going to see a lot more FHA loans now, so hopefully any realtors that have had bad FHA experiences will be able to call the lender, review the scenario, and be able to move forward without too many preconceived notations of Gov't loans.

  • Real Estate Investor · Tempe, AZ · Member since 2012 · 874 posts · 648 votes
    3y

    Wait, so buyers with poor credit aren't going to get 1.75% knocked off their interest rate like I've seen all over Twitter?? /sarc

    Solid post.  I did a double-take when I saw it was from 3 months ago.  Good work.

  • Investor · Youngstown, OH · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Zach Wain:
    Quote from @Nicole Heasley Beitenman:

    I was already seeing high points for conventional loans. This is going to lead to a really interesting spring market. Realtors already turn their noses up at our FHA/VA/USDA borrowers, but those buyers are going to be flooding the market now.


    We are all going to see a lot more FHA loans now, so hopefully any realtors that have had bad FHA experiences will be able to call the lender, review the scenario, and be able to move forward without too many preconceived notations of Gov't loans.


     That's my hope as well. Unpopular opinion and I don't care--I'm glad they're doing something to help out the government loan borrowers. 

  • Residential Real Estate Broker · Sedona, AZ · Member since 2017 · 751 posts · 504 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Zach Wain:

    The Federal Housing Finance Agency, FHFA, the governing body that controls the conventional loan world.  Think of them as the parent of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.  They have set multiple new pricing grids for all conventional loans, and these pricing grids directly impact mortgage rates.  This is effective on all loans purchased by 5/1/23, so lenders may start implementing this in March or April.  FHFA changed the entire pricing grid, so while there are many many changes, here are some of larger highlights.  This only applies to conventional loans.

    First, No significant pricing changes to:

    1) Purchase/non cash out investment home or second home pricing

    2) Purchase/non cash out Condo's

    3) Purchase/non cash out of Manufactured homes

    4) Subordinate financing hits (when you have a 1st and 2nd mortgage at the same time, there is price hit on the first mortgage)

    Next, some of the larger changes to pricing:

    1) Worse - Cash out got WAY WAY more expensive, especially over 70% loan to value and especially if your credit score is under 780.  For example, a cash out refi to 80% loan to value with a 680 credit score is going to be brutal...

    2) Worse - High balance/super conforming loan sizes - got more expensive. Especially for ARM's and cash out. Like really crazy expensive. (this does not make sense to me, because these are high cost areas to live in, so they get a higher max loan size to stay conventional. These are not the uber wealthy, but they are getting hit big time now)

    3) Worse - Your average borrower with a 720-759 credit score is paying more now

    4) Worse - If your debt to income ratio is over 40%, you pay more now (silly rule, if we pre approve someone at 39% DTI but the underwriter changes it to 40%, now that borrower pays more.)

    5) Better - 2-4 unit homes, pricing is a touch better now.  That is nice for investors.

    6) Better -  borrower with a 620-699 credit score is paying less 

    7) Better - 1st time home buyers within the area median income of their county get a better deal now (this went into effect a couple months ago)

    There are a lot more small changes in these pricing grids, but overall I interpret this as the FHFA saying they want to make loans more expensive for anyone that has a home already or lives in a high cost area.  They want it to be more affordable for 1st time home buyers.  By looking at the numbers, I am also assuming that they want to improve the reserves of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac so they can be in position to one day be independent of the Federal Government and end their Sponsored entity status.  That is just my personal opinion based on the recent moves...


    Thank you Zach for continuing to be one of the top lender/financing sources on BP. This is great info. It's a "Don't shoot the messenger" kind of situation.

    It's an infuriating policy of rewarding bad credit and bad choices and penalizing production/creativity and success. If I wanted illogical government oversight I'd move back to California.
  • Ryan HooverBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker · Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2018 · 125 posts · 82 votes
    3y

    Great update @Zach Wain!  As always you deliver great information and amazing service.

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