Why is Brooklyn a lot more popular than Astoria, Queens?

Question

Hi All, am hoping for some feedback here.I am comparing Astoria in Queens against what I think as similar neighborhoods in Brooklyn, ie  Bed-sty, Bushwick, Crown Heights.

If it is up to me, Astoria would be my #1 choice without a doubt.

But demand for Astoria housing never seems to be able to catch up with Bed-sty, bushwick, crown heights.

Can someone offer some insights why you think that is the case?

Astoria has so much more to offer IMO.  And it is way closer to Manhattan.

Many thanks

Eric Hajdu · Answer

Mary Joe, I'm not sure exactly what property type your looking for and your budget, but I would consider Greenwood, Sunset Park, and even some parts of Brooklyn Chinatown.  These areas are trading at a discount to Bushwick and Bed Stuy, but offer a lot in terms of amenities such as cafes, gyms, transportation options, etc.  Also, there is a large supply of 2-4 family homes priced under 1.5mil.

In general, I think proximity to grocery stores is becoming less of a factor, as many New Yorkers rely solely on delivery.  The pandemic made train accessibility less important, but I notice that it is becoming desirable again.

One final thought, investing in NYC is so different than 95% of the markets around the country, and most of the metrics traditionally used by Bigger Pockets won't work if you are trying to model profitability.  I have said this in previous post, but you invest here if you want to build wealth over time, not for immediate cash flow.  There are some fringe areas where you can achieve 6-8% annualized return, but with that comes risk of unreliable tenants, stagnant property value growth, etc.  Feel free to message me privately if you have more specific questions, I've been active in the local market for 20 years, and have a pretty solid network of contractors, brokers, etc.

Dor Sagi · Answer

I live in Bushwick, Brooklyn. I've never been to Astoria, however from what I heard of it, I don't think that you're comparing it to the right neighborhoods. I would probably compare it to Greenpoint, Ridgewood, Clinton Hill, and maybe some more established neighborhoods in downtown Brooklyn.

Bushwick and Bedstuy and grungy (in a good way). Bushwick is way ahead of Bedstuy in the gentrification process. Lots of hipsters. Lots of bars, restaurants, nightlife, etc. (Depends obviously which blocks). The future of the neighborhood is to be the next Williamsburg in my opinion :)

Bedstuy has some super grungy areas, and some really beautiful quiet historic tree lined streets. Very up and coming!

I'm not a Crown Heights expert, but it is more similar to Bedstuy than to Bushwick.

My opinion is solely based on how I feel from living in Bushwick (since 2015) and from my experience with the rental market (I'm a real estate agent, but don't do sales. Only rentals).

Feel free to DM if you have more questions!

Eric Hajdu · Answer

@Mary Joe

I agree with what Dor said, you can’t really compare Astoria to Bushwick or Bedstuy, it is more like the Bay Ridge of Queens.  Meaning it is safe with tons of things to do, but not very progressive and young people don’t want to live there.

Also, in general people in the outer boroughs who pay a premium want to be close to Downtown Manhattan/Wall St.  Queens is more convenient to midtown and the upper East side.

I am bias to Brooklyn since I live/invest there, but I think Queens is great.  I just don’t see huge upside in Astoria, I think Ridgewood or some of the rapidly changing areas are more interesting.  Good luck in your search!

Khari F. · Answer

ridgewood and bedstuy would be best bet just as far as event/culture trends (where young ppl want to live). ppl moving to bedstuy dont mind the grungy and still borders bushwick. bedstuy willl prob have most growth as far as minority owned small businesses. trains, gyms close by. also wyckoff hospital is buying mfh nearby and using them as offices. it's possible a larger hospital network like lij/northwell health will buy them and expand so you may have a rental property to sell to them. lol. dont be suprised if new mayor proposes some new train or fast rail line like the L train on outskirts of bk\queens. your prop value will skyrocket in 10 years if you bet on that. I say bet on the long game of appreciation in these area. cash flow is for you, appreciation is your kids.

Abel Curiel · Answer

Great insigths from @Dor Sagi and @Eric Hajdu!

Astoria has many unique traits that are tough to compare with up & coming neighborhoods in Brooklyn. My wife grew up in Astoria and loves going back to the cafes, bars and restaurants. What she and many love about Astoria is that certain parts of the neighborhood still have the same feel it had 20+ years ago.

That said, I think Eric hit the nail on the head by comparing it to Bay Ridge in Brooklyn. Both neighborhoods have a suburban feel. Astoria, in my opinion, isn't as attractive as Brooklyn neighborhoods with more transportation options and shorter commutes to Midtown.

In the rental space, Astoria apartments go very quickly and typically receive multiple qualified rental applications from my experience in this market.

All the best to you on your neighborhood search!

Abel

Mary Joe · Answer

Thanks Eric.  You are right, it does seem that young people do NOT want to live in Astoria , their first choice would be LIC if they ever decide to move to Queens. What are some of the areas in Brooklyn that you think are worth looking into for long term buy and hold landlords?  Relatively close to subways, shops, restaurants ?

I have been looking into areas like Weeksville (near Crown Heights) but one thing that is holding me back is that it is kind of far from shops and restaurants, you are not really within walking distance to popular shops and supermarkets etc.   I am concerned it may take months before I find a tenant.

Of course, there are properties that are closer to Prospect Park or downtown brooklyn that are close to shops and restaurants; the only problem is that the prices and ppty taxes are a lot higher in those neighborhoods and at the same time I don't see a premium in rental income high enough to justify those prices.

Mary Joe · Answer

Thannks so much for your insights, very helpful.  I am comparing Astoria vs Bedsty, Bushwick, Crown Heights based on the similar price points these neighborhoods all share.   More established neighborhoods like Clinton Hill and downtown Brooklyn would be a lot more expensive than Astoria from what I know (no experts here).

I am just bewildered that based on my observations, demands for housing in areas like Bedsty, Bushwick, Crown Heights etc are easily 3 times more than Astoria on any given day. BTW, I share your assessment of Bedsty, Bushwick etc, that it does feel kind of rough and grungy ( but in a good, up and coming gentrification way to a certain extent).

Thanks again for your feedback.

Why is Brooklyn a lot more popular than Astoria, Queens?

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