Move a bedroom to the basement to create master suite??

Question

Hey all, I am currently looking at a property and it a 4/3 1880 sf with a finished basement and all bedrooms upstairs. I like the fact that all the bedroom are upstairs but to do this, the builder made the master the same size as all the other bedrooms. Fortunately the master does have a small three piece bath attatched. 
So here is my idea. Let me paint a picture. Four bedroom on the second floor, on in each corner with a decent size full bath on on side. When you walk down the hall the master is on the end left with another identical bedroom on the end right. I would like to knock down the wall between the two bedrooms and create two larger walk in closets and a small sitting area. 
I would then move a bedroom to the basement(which is finished) and put in an egres window to conform to code. 
Question 1: is this a cost efficient idea? I have not gotten quoted for the egress so I have no idea how much this would cost, I'm assuming a grand or two.
Question 2: can I now count the basement as square footage? I have heard that if you install an egress you are now able to count the basement as living area. 
So if this idea falls in my favor I will have a double size Mather suite with his and hers walk in closets, a much larger bedroom downstairs, and an increase in sq ft from 1800 to 2600....
Is this a realistic idea or am I just dreaming to big?

Account Closed · Answer

the egress window shouldn't be a big deal if it's a walk out basement...just have a guy do some demo work and then frame it up for a window..use treated lumber for anything that touches block/brick/ground..if it's block or brick on the perimeter, have a mason come in after him to make it look good...make sure to verify egress requirements..in my area they get complicated..windows have to have so much surface area of glass, so much square feet of openable area (can't open both sashes at the same time), so much distance from floor, etc.  you are pulling a permit, right???

is there a bathroom in the basement?  i don't think it's strange to have a bedroom in the basement, as many parents may actually want the space from a teenager..however nobody will want to crawl up 2 flights of stairs to pee in the middle of the night  :)

whoops, forgot to add, if doing this in brick or block, make sure to add a metal header..called a lintel, over the window..and of course make sure it's flashed correctly  :)

Nathan Emmert · Answer

What are the comps like?  If yours has a smaller, less functional Master than the comps, that might be a creative solution...

Of course, I know a lot of moms that would never be 2 floors away from their kids.

Brian Beadle · Answer

Yup I agree Tom. I was just curious what the general consensus would be. Sounds like a no across the boards. Thanks guys!

Ophelia Nicholson · Answer

As someone who rehabs I think its a bad investment. You are spending money that you really shouldn't have to in order to basically fulfill a dream. 
Dreams are great but money is so much better- why fix something that is not broken to begin with-Yes the master bedroom maybe the same size as the other bedroom but if you don't get added value in terms of cash returns then its a waste of time. 
Its one thing if it was a 2 bedroom and you needed to make it 3 to sell it. In this case you don't need to make it a 4- just make the 3 that you have stand out.

Brian Beadle · Answer

Absolutely, I wouldn't expect it to pull a premium against other comparable houses but I would like it to capture more attention and make the buyer "need" my property over the others.  Plus coming from an architecture/design background, I love projects like this, almost more than the paycheck. Im not  'spend as little as possible' investor. Completely no offense Rusty, that is a phenomenal  time tested business plan and its been proven to work over and over, But I love to have fun doing this.

But.......In the end, Im still an investor. So I guess what im asking is, would it be a BAD investment to undertake such a project?

Rusty Thompson · Answer

I wouldn't do it for a flip. I can almost guarantee that you will not make back the amount you spend. Yours might stand out from other 4 bedrooms, but not enough to get someone to spend significantly more for it. Unless its exactly what they have always wanted. If you want to finish the basement & homes with finished basements sell for significantly more, then spend as little possible making a functional family room down there.

Nathan Emmert · Answer

I had "heard" it's only a few hundred dollars to do.  It was discussed at a landlord class I took during the housing compliance section.  It's relatively straight forward... dig a big hole, cut a bigger hole in the cement wall... throw in a larger window... put in one of those metal guard thingies... backfill dirt.

IMO, just about anyone who wants "space" in their basement should look to do it just for the amount of extra natural light they bring in at a very reasonable cost.

Tom A. · Answer

Brian, there are certainly buyers that would value a larger master bedroom suite with a walk-in more than they'd value the 4th bedroom on the 2nd floor.  A 10 x 12 isn't that big for a master.  But there are also buyers who'll feel the opposite way.  I've run into more of the second type than the first lately, in fact just yesterday had a buyer tell me she didn't care how big her bedroom was, but having one bedroom on the lower level (of a tri-level) was a dealbreaker.  That's too anecdotal to base a financial decision upon however if you can get better information about your local market.

Can you get MLS comps for homes that fit scenario #1 vs. scenario #2 in the vicinity of your potential flip house?  Then cost out the master/basement bedroom project in terms of both dollar cost and extra time and compare.  I would use 1,880 as the square footage either way, and I'm pretty sure an appraiser would as well when it comes time for the buyer to get financing to purchase the home.  The basement bedroom will have a much lower $/sqft value than above-ground space.

Brian Beadle · Answer

Thanks Tom, it's good to hear a fellow Michiganders opinion. Do you believe it would detract more value than it would add? I feel that master suites are more in demand these days than in the past. At about 10x12, it sure doesnt live up to its name.

Move a bedroom to the basement to create master suite??

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