Holdover tenant vs non payment eviction

Holdover tenant vs non payment eviction

Asheville, NC · Member since 2017 · 385 posts · 274 votes

I have somewhat of a tricky situation that I have never been in before and given the moratorium I am not sure how to proceed. I am located in Asheville, NC and have a rental property with two roommates that are on a month to month lease. Tenant A has been living in the property for many years and tenant B is the new room mate and they both signed a month to month lease when tenant B moved in. After two months tenant A placed a restraining order against tenant B and tenant B informed me of this and said that he is not allowed on the property at all even with a sheriffs escort. Therefore, he gave me notice through a text that he wanted to terminate the lease agreement. He did give proper notice according to the timeline and rent was paid that month and the following month according to our lease. I asked him for notice in writing and after a little back and forth with the "he said, she said" I got fed up and just terminated the lease myself with 30 days notice lacking anything in writing from either tenant. This was all done through texts including both of them at the same time but baring in mind that they cannot communicate with each other. But my timeline giving them notice was approximately 6 weeks out for them to move. 

Fast forward a few weeks and tenant B is constantly asking me if tenant A is out yet so he can go get his stuff. Tenant A asked if I would prorate one more week for her to try and find a place. She has lived there for about 7 years and has always been a decent tenant. My concern really wasn't the extra week of payment but just that I need her to move so we can go in a different direction with the property. I told her not to worry about the extra week of payment as I know it is very difficult to move right now in this area. Fast forward a little more and she simply cannot find a place to go to. At this point we are basically at the end of that extra week so I reached out some fellow landlords and fortunately was able to find her a place that had just gone vacant that morning and the landlord needed to clean and paint and was actually very appreciative of the fact that he would not have to list it and screen to find a new tenant etc. I have to admit, I was a little proud of myself for being able to help everyone out including myself. 

Understanding that everyone needed more time to make this happen, I just sort of stuck my head in the sand and crossed my fingers hoping for the best and did not bother to even try and evict. I touched base with her new landlord and her over the next couple weeks to make sure we were at least moving forward with everything. All the while, tenant B has been texting me every couple of days to find out the schedule of when she will be out because he cannot go get his stuff until she has vacated the property. I think tenant B may have really made someone angry in the process because like I said, he is not even allowed on the property with a sheriffs escort. This is according to both of them. I have not actually seen the restraining order because I don't really care and it is not my concern.

So here we are on August 21 (3 weeks past the original date of move out) and tenant A is supposed to be moving this weekend and tenant B will come behind her and get stuff as soon as she is out. I went over there this morning assuming I would see some moving things happening but was fully aware that it may not actually be taking place. My kindness of one week rent free has turned into 3 weeks and now she needs another week to actually get her stuff out and then tenant B can come get his stuff. The lawn is 3 feet tall and there is enough trash that I will need a small dumpster for this one. There is no way she can move all that stuff by herself. I am really kicking myself for not just pushing for an eviction at the beginning of the month for a holdover tenancy. But given the moratorium I wasn't really sure what to do and I don't want to have to evict her but I am out of patience and I feel that if I don't make her perform this could drag out for several more weeks. I put a stop on collecting any payments from them this month online so no payment has been made for August. When I spoke to her this morning over the phone she started to catch an attitude with me saying she has to work the next couple days and then she "might" have a couple days this week to start moving. She is cleaning the new place so that her and her new roommate can move in and she said she saw some bugs and may ask the new landlord to have it sprayed before she moves in. I am not waiting on anyone at this point. 

My patience is worn out and I am ready to start the process of eviction but am not sure if I even can. At this point I consider them holdover tenants and not non paying tenants. I do NOT want to file for non payment although I feel like a "7 day pay or quit" notice would get the ball rolling and would cost nothing for me to place on the door and would certainly motivate her to move more quickly. I also have to deal with tenant B after she is gone. I am also concerned about giving any legal notice as I don't even know where tenant B actually is. I don't know if I should be more patient and avoid the court and eviction at all cost or if I can even pursue it. I am completely torn. I know from the new landlord that she has paid her deposit and rent and is ready to move as of yesterday. But like I said before, I can tell it is going to take awhile so I would like to cover my bases in case something happens. Should I try and push forward with an eviction for holdover tenancy or should I just be thankful that she actually has somewhere to go. What would you all do in this situation? Thanks in advance for all your input. 

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Rental Property Investor · Asheville, NC · Member since 2019 · 35 posts · 9 votes
5y

Jon,

I think your hesitation to begin the eviction process is warranted and may not produce a quicker/cheaper result.

Sometimes it’s best to pave the way for a bad situation to get better. This might even mean paying for a mover yourself and truly have the tenant out of there in a day. Perhaps the other tenant’s persistence in contacting you will mean a swift move out on there part. Better to have the property vacated quickly so that you can begin an efficient turnover. 

Best of luck! 

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  • Rental Property Investor · Asheville, NC · Member since 2019 · 35 posts · 9 votes
    5y

    Jon,

    I think your hesitation to begin the eviction process is warranted and may not produce a quicker/cheaper result.

    Sometimes it’s best to pave the way for a bad situation to get better. This might even mean paying for a mover yourself and truly have the tenant out of there in a day. Perhaps the other tenant’s persistence in contacting you will mean a swift move out on there part. Better to have the property vacated quickly so that you can begin an efficient turnover. 

    Best of luck! 

  • Asheville, NC · Member since 2017 · 385 posts · 274 votes
    5y

    @Sam Morgan , I appreciate your response. After reading my post back over I think I really just need to wait another week and see what happens. Normally, I would just issue a pay or quit notice and then move for summary ejectment when the 7 days was up. That usually gets a response and with the time it takes to evict you have to be proactive in my opinion. I have been a landlord for 14 years and have only actually had to evict once because the tenant ghosted me and left me no choice but to take legal action. I try very hard to have open lines of communication with my tenants. I have never given cash for keys or helped a tenant move and don't plan on starting now, but I am trying to remain objective here. If I spend any money it will not be going to help any tenants move. I made this bed for myself so I suppose I will lie in it for another week and see what happens . I am still curious to know what others would do in this situation though given that we have this moratorium to deal with for the next few months. When I have had to evict it was for non payment but not for holdover tenancy. From what I understand you can evict for hold over but not for non payment during this moratorium. But I really have no idea at this point in time what is possible.

  • Asheville, NC · Member since 2017 · 385 posts · 274 votes
    5y

    After sleeping on it, this morning I have decided to just start the process of eviction with a 7 day notice to vacate for holdover tenancy. Let the chips fall where they may. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Hendersonville, NC · Member since 2016 · 446 posts · 412 votes
    5y

    @Jon A. - I haven't had any issues with getting hold-over tenants out.  My experience is with Henderson county through the moratorium, but I have a client who was successfully able to get a tenant out in Asheville as well.  When the moratorium went into effect, I kept tenants month to month for that very reason.  Just be sure you follow the procedures and do not mention "non-payment".  The moratorium does not require you to renew a lease with a tenant, which is effectively what you do each month with a month-to-month lease.  

  • Investor · Tempe, AZ · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 731 votes
    5y

    @Jon A., start the process and hire a moving company.  

    Inform the tenant of your reasons and by at least starting the process, it puts the heat on her to officially move out.  Just because you've filled the 7-Day notice doesn't mean you have to follow through on the eviction, it just gives you the opportunity if needed.

    For Tenant B, hire a mover!  Split the cost with them.

  • Colleen F.Pro Member
    Investor · Narragansett, RI · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    5y

    @Jon A.  not allowed on the property even with a sheriff escort sounds like BS to me.  Just saying. I had a similar situation and and even with an order of protection they were allowed on site to get their stuff

  • Asheville, NC · Member since 2017 · 385 posts · 274 votes
    5y

    I appreciate the responses. I placed a notice to vacate on the door. Tenant A is in the process of moving and not taking into consideration the fact that tenant B still needs to get his stuff out. I will file for summary ejectment on Monday. All of my tenants have been month to month for years. 

  • Augusta, GA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    Often that Pay or Quit notices lights a fire under the rear ends of tenants who have promised much in moving out but have never actually managed to take the steps toward doing so.  Once they realize the landlord is serious about filing for an eviction it's like "pack up the light bulbs!  We're moving!"

    Your tenant has enjoyed just about a month of free rent.   Thus, she had no incentive to get out.   Knowing you are taking legal steps to get her out may help move things along.

  • Asheville, NC · Member since 2017 · 385 posts · 274 votes
    5y

    @Gail K., yes you are correct. I think the real difference here is that this is not an eviction for non payment but an eviction for holdover tenancy because the lease was terminated on June 23 by tenant B. 

    Knowing this, I turned off payment on apartments.com because I did not want them to have the right to stay. I have never issued a "notice to vacate" which is different than a "pay or quit". Both of these are used for different reasons and I did not want to get caught on a technicality. The laws pertaining to evictions are already very confusing from state to state but throw in the moratorium and it is even more confusing. 

  • Augusta, GA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    I understand.  It is best to do exactly what you have done; post the "formal" notice to vacate so that your tenant understands you really do mean business in terms that she needs to move out.

  • Real Estate Agent · Asheville, NC · Member since 2020 · 68 posts · 39 votes
    5y

    @Jon A. I’m just now reading through this. So sorry - what a cluster!! How is all this affected by the supreme county’s ruling earlier this week??

  • Asheville, NC · Member since 2017 · 385 posts · 274 votes
    5y

    @Jordan Lockaby I have no idea really. I issued the notice to vacate and the first tenant left and then the second one was taking their time to get their stuff. Finally , he said he was done and they left me the worst turnover I have had in 14 years of being a landlord. Property goes on the market in a week or so. Tired of being a landlord with this particular property.

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