Tenant is dirty but Pays on time

Paul Stewart · 2019-01-08T12:19:30-08:00

Hi Everyone So I currently House hack my home in Long Island NY. I have owned the property and lived in it for almost 3 years. I'm on my 3rd tenants that are a couple. They are very nice and always pay on time but being that I live on the premises I notice how dirty they are in many aspects. I have tried to speak on the issue with them before and they were receptive and apologized but yet its still the same thing. I have been inside the apartment several times to pick up rent and to fix a bathroom fan and a jammed window on another occasion and every time the apartment smells there is a sink full of dirty dishes old food laying around and just overall dirty... I have had mice in the apartment a few years ago and I know it is only a matter of time before I get mice again or worse Roaches...Other then them being dirty and their trash outside over flowing I have to say they are good Tenants... Any idea's on how to drill the message home to them that they need to clean the premises more..lol I know weird issue to have especially when its a house hack so we share the overall property. I have the main house they have a smaller 2 bed room on the side of the house. Any creative Idea's would be appreciated. Thanks

Asury Johnson

Rental Property Investor · Clarksville, TN · Member since 2017 · 73 posts · 99 votes

7y

We've been in this situation. I've done inspections of our priorities and literally couldn't walk in rooms to inspect it. That was with plenty of notice. It's such a double standard with landlord and tenants. Tenants can neglect the home, while landlords must provide a perfect, clean home at move in and fix every problem immediately! I know, it's part of the business. We do have a clause in our contract that states our properties are to be kept. If they violate this, we give them a written notice to comply and they have 7 days to fix it. If they don't, their lease can be terminated. The notice does enough and we've never had to evict someone over this. They are very understanding once we explain why the condition of the property is important to us. Some may have never owned a home and don't know the costs of repairs, cleanings, or even city citations.

1 Reply

Matthew Olszak

Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes

7y

Also consider if you are making a "scale-able" decision. If you weren't house-hacking and therefore not there all the time, and if you used a PM who sent maintenance staff to perform repairs, would the dirty dishes and smell be reported to you? Unless it was extremely repulsive, probably not. So you'd continue to rent to them and happily cashflow. If you want real estate to grow into a large investment for you, that is the approach you need to take.

1 Reply

Joe Osborne

Member since 2018 · 10 posts · 2 votes

7y

I too have a dirty, but he keeps it all inside, and has payed on time, every time, for 5 years. Definitely worth putting up with it. But the fact that it's your personal residence, B-class, and it's gotten to the outside with overflowing trash, I might get pickier. Would definitely raise their rent with that cleaning fee, and let 'em know why. Curious how it turns out!

1 Reply

Aqueelah Dames

Rental Property Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2018 · 7 posts · 0 votes

7y

@Nik Moushon Hi Nick. I'm new to BP. Considering you're a Pro, I was hoping to gain some info as to whether or not a property that I am about to get under contract is a concrete deal. I need help analyzing my #s please. Any info or help that you can offer would be appreciated

0 Reply

Aqueelah Dames

Rental Property Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2018 · 7 posts · 0 votes

7y

@Matthew Olszak Sorry to interrupt. As a side bar... hello Matthew, I'm new to BP. Considering you're a Pro, I was hoping to gain some info as to whether or not a property that I am about to get under contract is a concrete deal. I need help analyzing my #s please. Any info or help that you can offer would be appreciated :) sorry guys if this isn't allowed, this is my 1st post.

0 Reply

Alan Pederson

Investor · Kennedale, TX · Member since 2016 · 219 posts · 349 votes

7y

I lived in a C/D class neighborhood growing up and we were very poor. My mom kept the house spotless. It's not the neighborhood, it's the people. Even some well off people don't keep their house clean.

You don't want to deal with roaches, ants, termites, or mice. They do a lot of damage and you might not find out you have a problem until it's a big problem. This could be expensive to take care of. I would not hesitate to put out bait traps or have an exterminator come out monthly to spray. I would also look at getting new tenants. You have to protect your investment.

2 Reply

Matthew Olszak

Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes

7y

Originally posted by @Aqueelah Dames:

@Matthew Olszak Sorry to interrupt. As a side bar... hello Matthew, I'm new to BP. Considering you're a Pro, I was hoping to gain some info as to whether or not a property that I am about to get under contract is a concrete deal. I need help analyzing my #s please. Any info or help that you can offer would be appreciated :) sorry guys if this isn't allowed, this is my 1st post.

Post the deal #s and neighborhood in your local forum, that way you'll get folks who know the area and can tell you if you are accurate or not.

1 Reply

Aqueelah Dames

Rental Property Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2018 · 7 posts · 0 votes

7y

Ok thank you

0 Reply

Kristi Gray

Rental Property Investor · Milford, DE · Member since 2018 · 16 posts · 14 votes

7y

As you are house hacking I can see your concern, however, you need to have the business mindset and assess if their filth is causing actual damage that will in turn cost you more money than their security deposit or vacancy time as you clean it up. If so, and they don’t respect your warnings they have to go. We once had a filthy tenant and although I do inspections every other month, by the time the court granted us the eviction (4 months of issues with a lawyer) the trash equaled 12,000lbs, Carpets that had to replaced and mold, roaches everywhere... costly! Like more costly than a vacancy. So you have to assess the situation as a business person, not take it personally and protect your investment

0 Reply

Olu Efunwoye

Rental Property Investor · Springdale, MD · Member since 2018 · 65 posts · 24 votes

7y

Quite the opposite for me. Tenant is very clean but ALWAYS couple of weeks late.

1 Reply

Staneley Cesaire

Investor · Utica, NY · Member since 2016 · 24 posts · 26 votes

7y

@Paul Stewart Because you live there, i would ask them to leave (my 7 yr old daughter just said to ask for more rent) this is not a bad idea either. Some people will just leave, saving you an eviction cost. Others will be more responsive, paying fees can be a good deterrent. You can tell them the reason, pest prevention, make sure add something for yourself since have deal with this issue. When house hacking I feel it is very important you feel comfortable with your tenant. So Take photos of the condition and evict. Now if they have a year lease. This will not be easy, “dirty “ can be a matter of opinion. In that case i would continue to tell them to clean up and be very specific. tell them exactly what you are worried about like, you might want to say “ take out the trash by Monday 5pm”, or “make sure you put trash in this container “ next do pest preventative treatments . That way when or if pest comes around you already set up traps for them. Good luck!

0 Reply

James Wise

Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes

7y

Originally posted by @Olu Efunwoye:

Quite the opposite for me. Tenant is very clean but ALWAYS couple of weeks late.

Post the eviction notice sooner. If they don't pay, evict them. Unlike living like a dirty savage non payment of rent should NEVER be tolerated.

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Pat L.

Rental Property Investor · Upstate, NY · Member since 2012 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes

7y

We always get rid of them as the vermin etc is not worth the aggravation & how will you show it if they decide to move???

This is one we inherited (my stunned wife in pic) & they always paid on time even after we initially raised the rent $100/month. This woman was a stay at home mother. The bathroom was worse & the bedrooms looked like crime scenes. We literally had to gut it to the studs.The pic below shows it rehabbed & that immediately got us $750/month vs the original $475.

By the way when they did vacate they literally left everything so we had to package & store the disgusting mess for 30 days.

1 Reply

Olu Efunwoye

Rental Property Investor · Springdale, MD · Member since 2018 · 65 posts · 24 votes

7y

@James Wise I was in court in Monday for Failure to Pay Rent. they failed to show up. I got judgement for bal of $1,400 (out of approx $2k rent) owed from Dec rent. Later that day they deposited $1,300. It would cost be $40 fee to file Writ of Restitution (for a balance of $100 on the judgement) They know how to circumvent the system very well; these are "professional tenants". Jan isn't paid yet. The Judge wouldn't add amount that to the judgement, it will take another filing (and another 30days of waiting for hearing). @Brandon Turner's book on Managing Rental Properties has taught me a lot in the last few months. I can't wait for their lease to be up. Definitely not getting a renewal.

1 Reply

James Wise

Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes

7y

Originally posted by @Olu Efunwoye:

@James Wise I was in court in Monday for Failure to Pay Rent. they failed to show up. I got judgement for bal of $1,400 (out of approx $2k rent) owed from Dec rent. Later that day they deposited $1,300. It would cost be $40 fee to file Writ of Restitution (for a balance of $100 on the judgement) They know how to circumvent the system very well; these are "professional tenants". Jan isn't paid yet. The Judge wouldn't add amount that to the judgement, it will take another filing (and another 30days of waiting for hearing). @Brandon Turner's book on Managing Rental Properties has taught me a lot in the last few months. I can't wait for their lease to be up. Definitely not getting a renewal.

You shouldn't accept partial payments. Have you given them access to your bank account to directly deposit rent? Why don't you take away the access & just close the account so that you can refuse to accept any amount that is less than what is owed plus your court costs?

0 Reply

Account Closed

Investor · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes

7y

Argh. Dirty people. They are more suited for the stable, not the house. However...

The City of Milwaukee has a trash problem. It's everywhere. The city does a terrible job of picking it up, unless you live in a rich white neighborhood, and then they promptly pick it up twice a week. That's right, I said it, because it's true. I'm talking to you Mayor Barrett. But hey, please keep playing with your streetcar and wondering why you couldn't get elected as governor, because that's the stuff that truly matters. I will digress (for the moment).

So, it's really no wonder to me that many of the houses in some of our poor communities are full of trash. Maybe I'll take a picture of my alley and post it. It's nuts. People fill up their own containers, then start filling up their neighbors containers, then it spills out, then it's everywhere. People just give up and start throwing it out the windows of their cars as they drive down the street. It's a snowball effect. Trashball? On the bright side, them squirrels are the fattest I have ever seen. I suppose the city could use some cats. Maybe a different mayor too.

0 Reply

Keith A.

Rental Property Investor · TX · Member since 2019 · 236 posts · 392 votes

7y

Originally posted by @Account Closed:

Argh. Dirty people. They are more suited for the stable, not the house. However...

The City of Milwaukee has a trash problem. It's everywhere. The city does a terrible job of picking it up, unless you live in a rich white neighborhood, and then they promptly pick it up twice a week. That's right, I said it, because it's true. I'm talking to you Mayor Barrett. But hey, please keep playing with your streetcar and wondering why you couldn't get elected as governor, because that's the stuff that truly matters. I will digress (for the moment).

So, it's really no wonder to me that many of the houses in some of our poor communities are full of trash. Maybe I'll take a picture of my alley and post it. It's nuts. People fill up their own containers, then start filling up their neighbors containers, then it spills out, then it's everywhere. People just give up and start throwing it out the windows of their cars as they drive down the street. It's a snowball effect. Trashball? On the bright side, them squirrels are the fattest I have ever seen. I suppose the city could use some cats. Maybe a different mayor too.

How does the race of a neighborhood, your mayor, the mayors election or the trash problem of your city have anything to do with what this thread is about?

1 Reply

Nathan Bise

Flipper/Rehabber · Hager City, WI · Member since 2018 · 22 posts · 10 votes

7y

@Paul Stewart After a couple months Your explain the cleaning company won't do free any longer with their condition. Increase their rent 125. Hold 25 a month aside for infestation budget down the road that will still happen.... It's free pickins for all but 2days a month (until the cleaning lady comes).. They move out or cover cost.... Your protecting your investment... All is good... #Reihack!

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Alex Bacon

Rental Property Investor · Vicenza, Italy · Member since 2017 · 70 posts · 43 votes

7y

If they're filth is bothering you that bad and you can afford the hit financially boot em at the en of their lease. I don't think you'll get through to them by repeatedly talking to them, it's how they live and they don't notice it. I had to evict a tenant due to pets that she just used potty pad and never cleaned up. They were making the entire ground floor stink and other tenants were complaining. I was already planning on rolling over the appartments to upgrade and raise rents so it was an easy decision for me and they're on 30 day leases for now. If you decide to keep them, I'd agree at the end of their lease increase the rents. If they stay you'll have additional income to cover a pest control company and maybe even a little extra or they won't accept the rent increase and leave..win win. At this point though you're going to have some cleaning to do when they leave so no point in rushing that head ache. Plus I doubt you'll easily evict them if you're mid lease and it's cause they're dirty.

Good luck

0 Reply

Account Closed

Rental Property Investor · Jacksonville, Florida Area · Member since 2016 · 106 posts · 48 votes

7y

@Paul Stewart I would amend to the lease as soon as possible, that the tenant has to pay for regular pest control service.

0 Reply

James Wise

Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes

7y

Originally posted by @Matthew Olszak:

Also consider if you are making a "scale-able" decision. If you weren't house-hacking and therefore not there all the time, and if you used a PM who sent maintenance staff to perform repairs, would the dirty dishes and smell be reported to you? Unless it was extremely repulsive, probably not. So you'd continue to rent to them and happily cashflow. If you want real estate to grow into a large investment for you, that is the approach you need to take.

This is a really good point people don't often look at. Is what you are doing scale-able. Don't get Rental properties have treated me well but the hassle of dealing with them for the relatively small amount of money per property isn't worth the hassle if you've only got 1 or 2 units. If you are going to start investing you should do so with the idea that you need to quickly scale up to at least 5-10 properties with an eye for many more for it to be worthwhile. As such you should operate your business in a way that makes sense for scale. The way that a person with 100's of rentals manages them must be efficient & streamlined. Don't wait till you've got that many doors to start operating them that way. Do it now so you are prepared to grow smoothly.

2 Reply

James Wise

Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes

7y

Originally posted by @Pat L.:

We always get rid of them as the vermin etc is not worth the aggravation & how will you show it if they decide to move???

This is one we inherited (my stunned wife in pic) & they always paid on time even after we initially raised the rent $100/month. This woman was a stay at home mother. The bathroom was worse & the bedrooms looked like crime scenes. We literally had to gut it to the studs.The pic below shows it rehabbed & that immediately got us $750/month vs the original $475.

By the way when they did vacate they literally left everything so we had to package & store the disgusting mess for 30 days.

hahaha the expression on you're wife's face... "I hate you Pat"

0 Reply

Ann Bellamy

Lender · Tyngsboro, MA · Member since 2009 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes

7y

The fact that this is your home changes things, both legally and from a "what I put up with" perspective.

First and foremost, it's your home. You get to decide what you will tolerate. if you don't want the mess, get rid of them. they won't change. The laws surrounding tenants in a property you live in are generally different from properties that are strictly rentals.

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Tenant is dirty but Pays on time

Tenant is dirty but Pays on time

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