Sometimes, You Feel Like a Jerk

Sometimes, You Feel Like a Jerk

Real Estate Investor · Sacramento, CA · Member since 2008 · 566 posts · 356 votes

I rarely start a thread, but today I had an experience that I just have to share.

A year ago, I thought I'd hit the jackpot. A single mom with two teenagers (15 &16) moved into one of my rentals. She had two other, older sons that didn't live with her, one in graduate school. When they came for the showing, she had her sons take off their shoes when they entered the house. I liked that. In the beginning, there was a lot I liked about having her as a tenant.
Rent to income ratio was a great 30%, moving from a 10 year stay in an apartment that was "converting" to Section 8 to raise rents. 4 years in the same job, more years in the same field. A couple small claims actions 7-8 years ago (no evictions) that had been satisfied. Everything checked out. Thought I'd have a great tenant for years. That was a year ago.

After a couple months, one of her sons, and 5 of his pot smoking buddies are caught, having broken into my vacant house next door, getting high. The two adults are hauled off to jail (one on parole, had it revoked, and the other was wanted on another charge), and I end up at the PD to sign the complaint. Turns out Jr has had numerous run ins with the law, and was "on their radar." All were charged with Criminal Trespass, and the two adults with possession of THC.
The next day, I was at the vacant house and three of the four minors Mothers asked to meet with me. It went well and I agreed to let the boys work it off. There was a small list of damages. Cost me about $100, and for two weekends, they did what they could, which wasn't really much. One had some practical experience, lived on a farm, but the other three knew little more than which end of the hammer to hold on to. I began to think of the three as the lost boys.
After working off their debt, the lost boys asked if they could help me finish renovating the vacant home (for some money, of course). I was doing the clean up and renovating myself, on weekends. I agreed. For the next 8 weekends or so, they helped, and I taught. Watching to make sure they didn't hurt themselves was about as much as I could do, and cutting through the power cord of my circular saw was exciting but nobody was hurt. And, gutting and finishing a bathroom was the high point. I paid them something each weekend for their work.
You hear the term, disadvantaged youth, but I hadn't really ever seen it up close before. No Dads in their lives, not doing well in school, no interests, no skills, little or no money, no direction, living only for the moment. They enjoyed learning about the tools, though, and arguing about who would cut next, or who holds the drywall and who gets to use the cordless drill. Work went slow, but I looked forward to it more than if I was working alone.
As the months passed, rent became later and later. Every excuse in the book, even the "rents in the mail." The best one, however, was "the bank took my money." Seems she had a "second chance" LOC at a credit union, for those hoping to restore credit. She didn't make a few payments and when her direct depo hit, they took it.
In Nov, after spending a day working on the vacant, I got a call saying they had no hot water. I returned to find the pilot out, but it lit, I tested it, turning it off and on. Relighting. Watching it. When I left, told them I couldn't find anything wrong, it was working and if they had any further problems, to call me. This was about the 10th of the month, she hadn't yet paid the rent.
The next night, Monday night, I get a call. Water's out again. I go over, it starts, I go through it all again. Can't find anything wrong with it. I've changed many thermocouples and gas valves over the years, on water heaters and in furnaces. Hot water heaters are no mystery. They work or they don't. This one was working. You can guess what I was thinking, Professional Tenant!. It was a 4 year old water heater and the rent hadn't been paid.
Friday, her payday and no call. I call about 8pm and am greeted with a drama queens rant about being out of hot water all week, she and her kids are sick from bathing in cold water, and she's had a plumber out there for three hours that day and he couldn't fix it. Said he'd be back on Monday. I said I'd be there in the next morning. I called the plumbing company and asked their answering service to get someone to call me asap. The next morning I found the valve and burner taken out, and an old style "universal" thermocouple had been installed. It didn't fit right in the newer water heater (smaller pilot light), and after putting everything back together, the pilot would not stay lit. I went and got the right thermocouple, and a new valve and installed them. Just as I was finishing, a plumber arrived to see what was up. He played dumb as to who did what, saying only that his boss had asked him to stop by and find out what was going on. They never did return my calls or bill me. That was Saturday.
On Monday, I get a letter from the City. On the prior Monday, between my first and second trips for the hot water heater, she had called the city and complained. The city code inspector had come out on that day and inspected the house. Professional Tenant status confirmed. There were 4 "violations." No smoke detector in the basement, hot water heater, stove wouldn't light, and the stairs to the basement needed repair.
A little background. I know the inspector. Have dealt with her on more than a few occasions, and have never had any problems with her (or, her with me). That house, in 2006, was the house I did a full gut on. New 200A electrical service, complete rewire, new plumbing, new hot water heater, insulation, drywall, windows, doors, the works. $40K. All permitted and inspected by the city. I was told NOT to do anything with the basement stairs. They were solid, but ugly. And, I mean Butt ugly. The reason they wouldn't let me replace them was that there was no way to meet today's rise, run and width code for stairs, so no new stairs.
So, I call an appliance repair company. $100 service call. He shows up. Nothing wrong. Stove works fine. He adjusts the thermostat. I get the bill, pay it, and bill the tenant.
I show the inspector the bill, which shows what the repairman’s comments were. She apologizes, says she doesn't have a gas stove and doesn't know anything about them, but thought it took too long to light.
I show the inspector the smoke in the basement, and mention it was right where it was 4 years ago when it passed inspection. A little jab, I guess. She tests the hot water. Then we discuss the stairs, and I say she's telling me I have to do what I already know the city won't let me do. She goes back to city hall to talk to the real building inspectors (she's just the code violation inspector). They say no permit. Work it out. We meet again and she wants’ me to put a 2X4 here, another there, level that step. I say, why don't you just let me replace it? She reluctantly agrees. I replace it in a weekend, She inspects, done. To be honest, I'm proud as a peacock that those four, basically bogus violations was all she could come up with in my 100 year old house.
I've about had it. I can put up with Kids-Will-Be-Kids (not the first time I've had a vacant unit broken into for a party), the whole water heater/city episode was a bother, but, hey, got my stairs, but the rent is the rent. Despite her good rent ratio, she just couldn't afford this house and continuing on this way just wasn't going to happen.
As the kids moved through the juvenile court system, I would get a form letter on victims rights, a form for damages, and a call from the case worker to discuss each case as it came up. They would suggest an outcome and ask for my thoughts or if I had any objections. Each time was pretty much the same. The first three had no record, and the recommendation was community service, and I agreed. But my tenants son hadn't come up until recently. I got the form letter, but no call.
In May, when the rent was late, I served a 14 day notice to terminate. Her last day in the house was May 22nd. I drove by and was surprised to see her actually moving. I was sure I was going to have to evict. I asked when I should come back for the inspection and returned at that time. They were still cleaning. Cleaning. I was shocked. The only items noted on the move out checklist was a broken rail on a kitchen cabinet drawer, and a dirty carpet. They couldn't get a couple large items out of the basement and I agreed to meet them today so they could get them out.

Finally, today. I replace the rail on the cabinet drawer and she comes to get the last items out of the basement.

As a potential tenant arrives for a showing, she tells them how nice it was to live there. She apologizes for not getting the items out last week. She's crying.

I had heard that she had moved her stuff into storage and was staying with family. What I didn't know is that yesterday she and her son had gone to court, and she told the court that no, she didn't have a permanent residence right now, and she just couldn't control her son anymore and didn't know what else she could do. They took him into custody and sent him to a youth detention center until he turns 18.

I've evicted my share of tenants over the years. Never felt sorry for any of them, either. Have always advocated separation between landlord and tenant. Don't get involved, friendly but not friends, keep it business, stick to the lease, do your part and don't let tenant dramas pull you in.

But tonight, I just feel like a jerk.

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Homeowner · Burleson, TX · Member since 2008 · 756 posts · 376 votes
15y

Ralph, I am a landlord and a veteran school teacher. You are right, there are a huge number of boys without proper male guidance out there. That is probably the main reason I still teach school, for those boys. I try to teach them about growing up and doing the right thing. I also teach the girls to not allow those boys to treat them badly. With all I do 10 months of the year it's still not nearly enough.

Also, I do not invest in properties in my school district because I don't want to have to evict one of my students.

You, most definitely, are not a jerk. You did work with the mom for many months. You also worked with the kid for a while. You tried to teach the son some skills. He is making his own choice. Mom is making her own choice as well. Their bad choices are not a reflection of you or your business.

If it bothers you too badly, join a Big Brother organization, Boy Scouts, or Junior Achievement. You will be able to work with kids that need it and want it. Just don't expect any overnight miracles. When you work with them you are working with the result of many years of negative conditioning.

Also, one other thing about teens. I have seen the occasional teen that had everything and still made bad choices. Two engaged parents, enough money, stable home, smart, resources, still turned the wrong way. It happens.

I do not know of any way to check a juvenile's criminal background. Does anyone else know?

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  • Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y

    Wow...

    You've got a big heart, I wouldn't feel bad you tried your hardest.

  • Flipper/Rehabber · Seminole, FL · Member since 2010 · 859 posts · 316 votes
    15y

    Dont feel that way. You tried, but you can only change people that want to be changed.

    THey will probably be better off in the end.

  • MI · Member since 2011 · 228 posts · 75 votes
    15y

    Hmmm. Ralph. Are you in the rental business, or are you a welfare counselor? I think they have government agencies, ministers, shrinks and probation officers to deal with this sort of stuff!

    Did you check her rental history? Any prior eviction judgements? Did you talk to her prior TWO landlords?

    Single moms with teenagers are tough. I read an article recently that minority single mothers have the highest eviction rates. Of course, you got to be careful not to discriminate. I just avoid low income minority neighborhoods to lower the odds of trouble.

    PG

  • Homeowner · Burleson, TX · Member since 2008 · 756 posts · 376 votes
    15y

    Ralph, I am a landlord and a veteran school teacher. You are right, there are a huge number of boys without proper male guidance out there. That is probably the main reason I still teach school, for those boys. I try to teach them about growing up and doing the right thing. I also teach the girls to not allow those boys to treat them badly. With all I do 10 months of the year it's still not nearly enough.

    Also, I do not invest in properties in my school district because I don't want to have to evict one of my students.

    You, most definitely, are not a jerk. You did work with the mom for many months. You also worked with the kid for a while. You tried to teach the son some skills. He is making his own choice. Mom is making her own choice as well. Their bad choices are not a reflection of you or your business.

    If it bothers you too badly, join a Big Brother organization, Boy Scouts, or Junior Achievement. You will be able to work with kids that need it and want it. Just don't expect any overnight miracles. When you work with them you are working with the result of many years of negative conditioning.

    Also, one other thing about teens. I have seen the occasional teen that had everything and still made bad choices. Two engaged parents, enough money, stable home, smart, resources, still turned the wrong way. It happens.

    I do not know of any way to check a juvenile's criminal background. Does anyone else know?

  • Involved In Real Estate · Hyattsville , MD · Member since 2011 · 298 posts · 256 votes
    15y

    No you are not a jerk. You had a tenant you went above and beyond for them even after they called the inspectors on your house, even after they vandalized your house next door. THIS IS A BUISNESS!!! I can see your halo but if you want a friend, I'll be your friend, I won't live in your house, I won't borrow your money and I won't destroy your house as a matter a fact I won't even live in the same state as you.
    I learned a long time ago you cannot let tenants be your friends, its sad to feel sorry for people but at some point people have to take responsibilty for their own lives. How could you fix this situation- You can't unless you let them live rent free, destroy your property and you personally mentor them until they grow up and become good citizens.

  • Joel OwensBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
    15y

    You pay the rent or your gone.It's that simple.

    Even if a property is paid for many landlords stress they have to pay the bank and that gets tenants to pay up.

    Sometimes not filing eviction but putting the paper on the door will get them to pay.Professional tenants will check at the court house to see if you actually filed.

    Usually the judge will set up a payment plan to pay some each month on the back rent along with regular rent to catch up.That is usually cheaper for a landlord then them moving and having to recondition and lose rental income waiting for lease up again.

    If you start going soft that is when the knife goes in the back.

    When landlords get burned out form doing it for years they start to get mentally drained and let things start sliding.Doesn't matter if you have a 2 unit,20 unit,60 unit apartment or own 10 houses scattered about.

    If you start to let things slide then tenants talk especially if you are renting other properties to their friends or family.They will talk to each other and start testing the waters coming up with only have the rent or an excuse for no rent etc. Pretty soon you have to bring the hammer as no pays are spreading like a cancer.You file tons of eviction notices and all of the sudden everyone pays again.

    It will cost the tenant much more to move their stuff and put deposits than to pay the rent.Having a temporary problem is one thing when they can get back on track for next month.When they habitually make excuses it's time to cut the cord and let them go.

    It's like a bad home loan.If the lender can work it out they let them stay but if there is no chance of recovery they let them go.

    Everyone has life problems they have to deal with no matter who you are.I think you tried to help and hoped for the best.Sometimes people are destined to fail.

    You have to condition tenants to perform.

  • Landlord · Seattle, WA · Member since 2010 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y

    Ralph, there is no question that you are not a jerk. Being a landlord is not always easy and can become less easy if you get involved in the daily life of your tenants.

    I think a landlord can help people that are in need, but if they are your tenants eventually there will be problems.

  • Real Estate Investor · Sacramento, CA · Member since 2008 · 566 posts · 356 votes
    15y

    There were really two things different here, when I compare this experience with most other tenants. Character, hers, and my breaking one of my golden rules.

    She is still going to rate high in my opinion. Her major failure being rent payment history. When her tenancy was finally terminated, she actually moved in with family to avoid eviction. That was unexpected and rare in my experience. There is a lot I still respect about her, and in almost every other way she was everything I hope to find in a tenant.

    As to the whole Professional Tenant thing, I found I don't fear code enforcement, they and the police are my friends. And I follow the letter of the law. Nothing to fear, and it just becomes part of what you sign up for when you do this. Ha! Not so much as a missing window screen! I'm still jazzed about that one.

    And to Phillip, as much as I'd like to say those two are mutually exclusive, (landlord vs counselor), they cannot really be separated. Simple self interest (avoiding the cost of vacancy and eviction) dictates treating each case according to its own merits, and I have no illusions about being in it by myself. I've become an unwilling expert in local social programs and charities. Can't pay your utilities, go see these people, if they won't help, go see those people. Rent's late, here's five day notice, go see those people. Helping an otherwise good, low income tenant through a tough spot is better than dealing with the alternatives. Just makes good sense. She just made a little too much to qualify, and had an ongoing problem. It wasn't just a rough patch.

    Wouldn't change a thing. The "friendly, not friend" policy still firmly in place. Just a rough day on the conscience.

  • Real Estate Investor · Sacramento, CA · Member since 2008 · 566 posts · 356 votes
    15y

    Joel, I both agree and disagree. In your comments, there is a who's responsible, or who's in charge question unanswered. Most of your comments boil down to a measure of the landlord, their integrity, reputation and ability to manage their own business effectively over time.

    I'll never lower myself, but expect them to rise to meet my expectations. Easy to say, tough to manage.

  • Real Estate Investor · San Antonio, TX · Member since 2010 · 328 posts · 182 votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Joel Owens:
    You pay the rent or your gone.It's that simple.

    Agreed.

  • Altus, OK · Member since 2008 · 2k+ posts · 690 votes
    15y

    When it all comes down to it you're running a business and without paying tenants you are losing money in your business so in retrospect you need to get rid of those who can't pay and put in those who can to keep your business running.

    So no you're not a jerk. She had the responsibility to pay her rent and did not live up to her end of the deal.

  • Investor · CA · Member since 2010 · 150 posts · 40 votes
    15y

    I can see how you feel like a jerk, but be reassured that you're not. it sounds like she wanted to do good, but her sons dragged her down.

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