Rental Property Investor · Mine Hill, NJ · Member since 2014 · 229 posts · 396 votes
So my tenant has been asking about upgrading the vanity in her unit. The current Vanity is a small 24" vanity, it's not in bad shape, but I agreed a 30" vanity would be nicer in that space. So far I've told her I might be amenable to the change so long as it doesn’t violate any building codes. In our lease it states that the tenant must ask permission before making permanent modifications to the property, it also states that any tenant upgrades shall become the property of the landlord when completed and paid for by the tenant, and shall remain on and in the apartment on the expiration of this Lease.
I am curious to hear what others do, when a tenant wants to make an upgrade that is an improvement to the property? Just say no? Go in 50/50? Pay for the materials, but allow them to install it? Have them pay for the item, but you install it?
Tenants never get to do repairs on your property. What if they cut a water line behind the old vanity? Or don't get the plumbing hooked back up properly and you have water damage? Or do a crappy job. You get to pay for it all to get fixed. I'd tell her the vanity is fine and leave it as is. Once you start with this, they'll have another project for you to do and 3 more after that.
Most people answering here are men. Men simply don't use as many products as women do. We have hairspray and hair dryers and curling irons and make-up and whatever else, while men walk out of the shower and let their hair dry in the air..
So, I think I would suggest that above the commode cabinet for her, as that would seem to fit nicely.
As a woman, that little rim around the sink would not be acceptable for me to put my things.
If she's a good tenant, it would cost you much more to have a turnover in tenants, than to have a happy tenants, that stays longer.
It seems like most of the responders are saying either don't let them do it at all or go 50/50. Would it be so wrong to say they are allowed to do the upgrade if they hire a licensed contractor, pay for 100% of the cost and it becomes a permanent fixture of the property and must stay when they move out. That's the route I would take.
This is what I ended up replying to the tenant with:
"Good evening XXXX,
Sorry we were a little slow in getting back to you, we have given your request a lot of thought. If you read the Alterations section of our lease, our policy is to first determine whether a change to the apartment is worthwhile or not, if it is we will give permission to allow the change. With permission given, our policy is to have the requesting tenant pay for the change with the knowledge that the alteration shall become property of the Landlord. All that being said, we feel that we have encouraged you to search for this new vanity, without directly expressing our policy; because of this, we have decided to make a one time exception, and pay for 50% of the Cost of the Vanity itself and Installation(New Supply Lines, Valves, etc.). We feel it is best to leave the acquisition and transportation of the Vanity to you, but will take responsibility for the removal of the old vanity and the installation of the new vanity. We are okay with the change of the Vanity, but we do not feel the mirror it comes with is an adequate replacement for the current Medicine Cabinet, and do not approve its alteration. Please also confirm that the 30" vanity would not violate any building codes as referenced in our earlier correspondence. Hope you have a great night, let us know if you have any questions."
Lots of great feedback and suggestions in this thread. Tenants are tricky when it comes to suggestions. My rule is never promise or suggest upgrades, it might trigger a flood of more suggestions. Now that they know you are friendly to changes, what's next on their want list. I went through this with a tenant last year, they rented a shower and bath, the owner of the property was happy to make the change, against my advise. That bill was $1400. Not worth it and they still complained about the fixture that was installed.
@Sunny Burns I think it is ok to consider tenant requests like this. You need to weight the cost, quality of tenant and long term value it adds. For example maybe if she is at the end of a one year lease, you agree to do the upgrade with her signing a second year on the lease. Splitting the cost can be tricky unless it is made clear in writing they do not have any rights to the item or reimbursement when they move out. Tenants will throw it back in your face when you move out. For example they may say, yes I stained the carpet but I bought that new vanity for the bathroom so we are even. I also consider if the upgrade is fixing something that needs attention or adds value. If it benefits me, so I am more willing to do improvements like that. I would not let a tenant install anything that involves plumbing or electrical. Some places require licensed plumbers for jobs like this in rental properties (non-owner occupied).
In your specific case the vanity appears to be in good condition. Between a new vanity, sink and plumber it will cost several hundred dollars to replace something that is not bad. It doesn't appear there is enough room to put a larger vanity in so I would just tell her there is not space. If she needs more storage, there are bathroom storage cabinets designed to mount over the toilet that would work great. She could purchase one and you could agree to install it. It would be a quick handyman job. Here is one example from Home Depot, just search "over toilet storage" to find many more options:
I agree with Joe Splitrock's recommendations. The vanity appears (from a distance) to be in good condition and neutral (which will be important for renting in the future.) Is an extra 6" of counter space really going to be worth hundreds of dollars in material/plumbing costs? However, if doing so can be qualified as what prompts her to sign a (higher) second year lease, it may be worth it (taking into account what kind of tenant she is, how long it would take to find a new tenant, what rent is.) If it's more space she's looking for, I think the over-the-toilet medicine cabinet/shelving is a great compromise and doesn't require any plumbing work, i.e., less risk, comparable reward.
Actually the varied responses has nothing to do with the tenants. The different responses reflects the individual landlords business practices.
My approach is always to place my profits first. I do not do anything that has a negative effect on my bottom line that I do not have to do.
Your tenant is there, the cabinet works and the tenant will not leave if you do not replace the cabinet. When they do leave you will get another tenant. You will not get more rent by replacing the cabinet. No tenant is ever going to be of the opinion your unit is perfect, they are renters, they make do.
Replacing the cabinet is a favour not a business decision.
I would be hesitant to share costs on any capital improvement to the home. Let's not forget the obvious tax advantages for making capital improvements. If treated as a capital improvement, you will receive the benefit of the depreciation expense over the improvement's useful life. If treated as a one-time repair expense, then it is a business expense (albeit a relatively good one as it adds value) to which you can apply right to your bottom line for lower end-of-year tax treatment. If you share the costs with your tenant, you are shorting yourself on the tax benefit! If you want to ignore the obvious risks associated with sharing the costs that the other posters have noted (entitlement, shoddy worksmanship, etc), I think that the tax advantages are enough reason to make the improvement on your own. No matter which route you take, I think it is only reasonable that the monthly rent be increased marginally as this is not a necessary repair/improvement.
Sorry but I always get hung up on understanding the logic behind people intentionally incurring an expense for tax benefit. If my tenant is willing to spend $300 on a vanity, why would I instead incur the expense myself for a tax deduction? Follow my logic here, tenant pays $300 and I pay $0 versus I pay $300 and maybe get a $100 break on taxes. I still pay $200. I agree there may be reasons to not have your tenant pay, but taxes is not one of them.
Of course if you need to do the improvement take the tax benefit, but it is better to avoid expenses if possible.
@Sunny Burns The question is, what is the reasoning for wanting a larger vanity? The truth is, 30" isn't going to add much. Some type of organizing drawers under the sink, a shelf or unit as shown above over the toilet, will add a lot of storage space. Maybe a towel rack to the left of the sink.
I personally think having someone that wants to make improvements is a benefit to have as a tenant, it shows they take pride in their living space.
@Karen Margrave, @Michaela G., the tenant says the reason is mainly about not being able to put things on the counter. A 30" Vanity would increase the width by 6" and add ~25% more surface space, I think that is a valuable improvement especially since there would be more cabinet space as well.
She already has a over the toilet storage unit for those wondering, almost identical to the one @Joe Splitrock posted.
So my tenant has been asking about upgrading the vanity in her unit. The current Vanity is a small 24" vanity, it's not in bad shape, but I agreed a 30" vanity would be nicer in that space. So far I've told her I might be amenable to the change so long as it doesn’t violate any building codes. In our lease it states that the tenant must ask permission before making permanent modifications to the property, it also states that any tenant upgrades shall become the property of the landlord when completed and paid for by the tenant, and shall remain on and in the apartment on the expiration of this Lease.
I am curious to hear what others do, when a tenant wants to make an upgrade that is an improvement to the property? Just say no? Go in 50/50? Pay for the materials, but allow them to install it? Have them pay for the item, but you install it?
@Karen Margrave, @Michaela G., the tenant says the reason is mainly about not being able to put things on the counter. A 30" Vanity would increase the width by 6" and add ~25% more surface space, I think that is a valuable improvement especially since there would be more cabinet space as well.
She already has a over the toilet storage unit for those wondering, almost identical to the one @Joe Splitrock posted.
I totally get it. The vanity in my bathroom is 6 feet long an my wife manages to fill it with stuff while she is getting ready. I am sure the extra 6 inches gives a place for a makeup, hair dryer, straightener, etc. I don't think it is a bid deal if you do the improvement. Here are some key points others made:
- Ideally the tenant will fund half or more of the cost
- You do not want the tenant to do the install
- Link the improvement to a new or extended lease
- Make it clear in writing that the improvement stays with the property and she is not entitled to any monetary compensation when she leaves. Have her sign an agreement that states this.
There is no slippery slope here. If she brings you another request, just evaluate it on its merit. You can say yes to this request and no to the next one. Working with tenants to accommodate their needs is customer service.
Can you install a long flip up shelf in the space between the wall and the countertop? It can be flipped down for extra space, and flipped up if not needed, or even a permanent one that doesn't flip.
I do understand the need for space...we have a similar vanity and it really is a hassle for two people to keep stuff on it...and forget if I want to use the hair dryer and get ready for stuff...I sometimes go into the livingroom and plug in there!
Just say no. And mention the over the toilet storage options. Today it will be the vanity, tomorrow it will be something else. This is the type of tenant who needs to be looking at buying their own place. Iti's not your job to supply their every whim. Part of the job of being a landlord is learning how to say no.
I was really good at saying no as an apt mgr. I'd just look really understanding and say, I'm sorry but we just can't do that. Sometimes I'd blame my boss. Sorry, my boss doesn't allow that. But, in your situation, just say, sorry, the building codes don't allow it. But, you could put one of those over-the-toilet shelving units, as long as you don't attach it to the wall.
"No," is an acceptable answer. Don't hedge. You can look friendly and understanding, and just keep saying "no." I got really good at it. You can, too.