Sanity check with this tenet

Garry Martin · 2008-08-12T02:46:23-07:00

Hello all, I am hoping someone can give me an unemotional response to this issue. I have a tenet in a one family house in upstate ny. In the latest blowup, he called me to ask if I had been on the properity the day before. I told him yes, I was removing some tree limbs that had fallen in the last storm and retrieve a ladder the tenet had borrowed from my stall in the garage. He did not like the fact I was on the properity without calling him first. Keep in mind I never entered the house, just the yard. He then demanded that I call him before I come on the properity. When I informed him I can come into the yard at any time I choose, he exploded on the phone. I hung up on him several times and he kept calling back. It was not until I told him if he called again, he was out (rental agreement gives me the right to remove the tenet without cause) that he threatened to call the cops if I did it again. I wanted to give him his 30 day notice right there, but my wife did not want me to decide while I was still so angry. So I am looking for some input from other landlords. I should also say he does pay his rent but has been late by a couple of days for the last 4 months. As far as I know, I have to give 24 hour notice to enter the unit. Can anyone confirm for me that this does not apply to the yard? If you were in my shoes, what would you do with him? Thanks for any input you may have.

J.N. Miller

Real Estate Professional · seattle, WA · Member since 2008 · 43 posts · 1 vote

18y

I have a tenant like that. they pay the rent on time, but she is a control freak and also does not like landlords.--us and every other landlord she has ever had according to her. You can go onto your property without notice--you cannot just go up to the door and demand to come in w/o notice (of course.) Rather than have a constant hassle with her (she is a stay at home mom), we simply give her the "control", and email her that we will be on the property for whatever reason. and the time (which she demands to know)--so we give her a window 1-3 pm for example. We have found in renting that some tenants could care less if you are on the property, and some--like your problem and ours----view the house as their property and do not want anyone there without permission.--especially a landlord. If you want a constant aggressive situation that will only escalate and create larger problems, then don't give him what he views as control and "respect"--ie --notice that you are coming onto the property--you will find if you simply notify him, you will de-fuse the situation--a hostile tenant can damage your property and make your encounters an absolutely miserable situation--our problem tenant is like yours--aggressive, demanding and volatile--just a major pain --so we just placate her & give her notice & it seems to work--

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Gary Moore

Real Estate Investor · Anchorage, AK · Member since 2008 · 63 posts · 3 votes

18y

There two rules to being a landlord:

1) The landlord is always in control.
2) There are NO exceptions to rule #1.

You have a tenant who does not understand what their rights and obligations are. You can appease them by giving them notice about the yard like JN suggested. Or, you can explain the facts of life to them and give them the option to stay or go. If they stay, refer to the two rules, if they go, refer to the two rules before the next tenant moves in.

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Michael Rossi

Real Estate Investor · OH · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes

18y

Garry,

This is not as simple a question as it may seem.

Tenants have the right of "quiet enjoyment" of the property that they rent. That means that you can not interfere with their lives or be in (or on) their rented property without giving them proper notice, and then only for a valid reason.

A pertinent question is which party is responsible for the yard maintenance? If the tenant is responsible for yard maintenance and they haven't called you requesting your help with the fallen limbs, then I think it would be reasonable for the tenant to pick up the limbs and reasonable for you to have given them notice. If you take care of the yard (mow, etc), then I don't think you would be required to give notice to pick up the limbs.

It is also apparent to me that your procedures are a not formal enough. If the tenant is renting the garage, your stuff should NOT be there. If you have agreed in writing that a portion of the garage is yours, the tenant should not be "borrowing" your stuff from that area.

Without further information, I think the tenant was right. I believe that you violated their right to "quiet enjoyment" of the property and that you should have given them notice that you would be on the property.

Good Luck,

Mike

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Garry Martin

OP

Investor · Albany, NY · Member since 2008 · 17 posts · 0 votes

18y

Thank you for the replys...JN, I think I rented to your tenet's brother as the description you have is about 90 % correct for my tenet.

To answer a couple of questions:
The garage is a 5 car garage. I include 1 stall with the house. As with Michael's point in the last reply I will be building dividers soon.

The tenet did call for the tree limb being down.

As to the fair use issue, I am not an intrusive landlord. I often drive by my properities to see what is going on, but I never interfer with the tenet's use of anything. Also, when I do go by, it is always at a resonable hour. This was the frist time I had been on the properity without the tenet at my side. Just thought his reaction was over the top.

Thanks to everyone for the input. You all raise some good points. I think I will let it go for now (no eviction), but if he does it again, I have to say, I will pull the trigger. I hate turning over tenets for all of the usual reasons. But I refuse to be walked over.

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Account Closed

OR · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 845 votes

18y

First, your wife is correct: never make decisions while you are angry. Take her out to dinner to thank her.

This is how I do it: I give the tenant a courtesy call before I go over. It helps to keep relations cordial. There is no point in provoking a power struggle unnessarily.

However.... if you have a garage on the property, and you were outside the fenced yard, and especially since the tenant called about the limbs, you did not owe a call. I would have called (see above), but you are not in the wrong.

Ironclad rule around here: any tenant who threatens me or treats me with disrespect is out with a 30 day (or less) notice. Life is too short to put up with that stuff.

But again, I treat my tenants with respect, as long as they treat me with respect, and I wouldn't have had the blow-up to begin with.

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Sanity check with this tenet

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