Tenant replaced stove without my knowledge and now issue with stove

Allentown, Pennsylvania
General Landlording & Rental Properties
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Tenant replaced stove without my knowledge and now issue with stove

Linda Thomas
Rental Property Investor · Allentown PA · Member since 2021 · 159 posts · 36 votes

Hello,

Tenant lived in unit for 9 yrs. Gas stove was new when tenant moved in. Tenant vacated unit last week and we noticed a different stove in unit. We questioned tenant and they said about a month ago the stove stopped working so they replaced it with a used one. We further questions why they did this without our Knowledge and we inform them that they were supposed to let us know if they were having a problem with their stove as it is the landlord's responsibility to repair or replace not theirs unless it was damaged caused by them. Needless to say, now the stove isnt working properly, the broiler function isnt working and there are a few other issues. We have a repair guy coming this week to check it out. Question is how would you handle this? If its repairable would u deduct part or all the costs from the security deposit? I know life expectancy on a gas stove is 15 years so I only had maybe 6 years left but why did the tenant inform me of this why did they do this behind my back why didn't they leave the old stove there so I could see that something was wrong with it maybe it was good that they tried to fix it but the still that's there is having an issue and I need to make sure that it is safe for the next tenant what if the stove is not fixable what would you do would you buy a brand new stove and have the tenant that just moved out pay for half of it for all of it how would you proceed with this looking for suggestions and advice thank you so much guys

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Bill B.
Investor · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 10k+ votes
3y

I hate to play devil’s advocate or call someone a liar. But….

If you aren’t separating in greatest of terms, or the tenant needed the money. Can you tell me that you KNOW they didn’t sell/give your working stove to their friend who had a broken stove “since they’re moving out anyway…”

I do have $100 that says they couldn’t provide you with a receipt for the broken stove they bought 1 month ago. 

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  • Theresa HarrisPro Member
    Member since 2019 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
    3y

    If they didn't tell you, you have no idea if the old stove could be repaired or why it broke.  I'd either fix the current one or get another one.  They were in there for 9 years.  

    3Reply
  • Bill B.
    Investor · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    3y

    I hate to play devil’s advocate or call someone a liar. But….

    If you aren’t separating in greatest of terms, or the tenant needed the money. Can you tell me that you KNOW they didn’t sell/give your working stove to their friend who had a broken stove “since they’re moving out anyway…”

    I do have $100 that says they couldn’t provide you with a receipt for the broken stove they bought 1 month ago. 

    6Reply
  • Caroline Gerardo
    Lender · Washington DC · Member since 2015 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    3y

    @Bill B. genius receipt and call the place. They had to haul away the broken one, no?

    Nine years and this is the single and only problem with tenant ever? If they were perfect charge them for the repair. What would break a gas stove? Are there burn marks on the wall???

    0Reply
  • Linda Thomas
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Allentown PA · Member since 2021 · 159 posts · 36 votes
    3y

    @Bill B. i totally agree and we did not end on good terms. I have a feeling they did something like that. Would you ask them for a receipt? How would you handle this? Should they pay for the entire repair? Or replacement? If need be? Why didnt they tell me? Because it was perhaps not legit. Would you charge half or full cost for repair/replacement? I understand it was 9 yrs old but maybe this is all false.

    0Reply
  • Linda Thomas
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Allentown PA · Member since 2021 · 159 posts · 36 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Theresa Harris:

    If they didn't tell you, you have no idea if the old stove could be repaired or why it broke.  I'd either fix the current one or get another one.  They were in there for 9 years.  

    Right they didn't tell me and that is the problem so i could confirm it was true. Why did they do this behind my back? They are on housing and low income i highly doubt they wanted the expense of a stove that they said wasnt working anymore. Or why not leave me it there for me , no they supposedly disposed of it too? 
    0Reply
  • Linda Thomas
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Allentown PA · Member since 2021 · 159 posts · 36 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Caroline Gerardo:

    @Bill B. genius receipt and call the place. They had to haul away the broken one, no?

    Nine years and this is the single and only problem with tenant ever? If they were perfect charge them for the repair. What would break a gas stove? Are there burn marks on the wall???


     So you would ask for receipt and call and confirm haul of old one? What if they don't have receipt or say bought on marketplace? There were other issues too not perfect tenant. No burn marks on walls or cabinet above. 

    0Reply
  • Richard F.
    Honolulu, HI · Member since 2008 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    3y
    Aloha,

    If the tenant was in there 9 years, I imagine the stove is the least of issues you will need to address to attract a better quality tenant at market rate. Have the repair guy give you a written and detailed estimate for the cost to repair, and deduct that amount from the Tenant's SD. Separately from that, decide if it is worth actually repairing, and if/how that fits with the rest of the work that needs to be done. Be sure you have the move in condition documentation and photos in case they try to argue over the SD in front of a Judge.

    Going forward, be sure you screen well, and perform annual inspections to ensure the entire unit is being reasonably cared for. This also gives you the opportunity to question the tenants regarding any unreported issues they may have.
    0Reply
  • Theresa HarrisPro Member
    Member since 2019 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Linda Thomas:
    Quote from @Theresa Harris:

    If they didn't tell you, you have no idea if the old stove could be repaired or why it broke.  I'd either fix the current one or get another one.  They were in there for 9 years.  

    Right they didn't tell me and that is the problem so i could confirm it was true. Why did they do this behind my back? They are on housing and low income i highly doubt they wanted the expense of a stove that they said wasnt working anymore. Or why not leave me it there for me , no they supposedly disposed of it too? 

     Something else is up.  It could be that they got another one and didn't want to bother you (I had a tenant do this with a dryer and he got a used one for $25 though he told me after the fact) or they did something sneaky.

    0Reply
  • Joseph Guzzardi Jr
    Rental Property Investor · Member since 2019 · 411 posts · 148 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Linda Thomas:

    Hello,

    Tenant lived in unit for 9 yrs. Gas stove was new when tenant moved in. Tenant vacated unit last week and we noticed a different stove in unit. We questioned tenant and they said about a month ago the stove stopped working so they replaced it with a used one. We further questions why they did this without our Knowledge and we inform them that they were supposed to let us know if they were having a problem with their stove as it is the landlord's responsibility to repair or replace not theirs unless it was damaged caused by them. Needless to say, now the stove isnt working properly, the broiler function isnt working and there are a few other issues. We have a repair guy coming this week to check it out. Question is how would you handle this? If its repairable would u deduct part or all the costs from the security deposit? I know life expectancy on a gas stove is 15 years so I only had maybe 6 years left but why did the tenant inform me of this why did they do this behind my back why didn't they leave the old stove there so I could see that something was wrong with it maybe it was good that they tried to fix it but the still that's there is having an issue and I need to make sure that it is safe for the next tenant what if the stove is not fixable what would you do would you buy a brand new stove and have the tenant that just moved out pay for half of it for all of it how would you proceed with this looking for suggestions and advice thank you so much guys


     Easier, quicker, more efficient to find a scratch and dent stove installed/replaced for $500-$600. Have a convo to get the prior tenant to maybe contribute, but doesn't sound like they will be open to doing so regardless. Save your time and move on. 

    0Reply
  • Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Linda Thomas:

    The stove was nine years old, so it's technically at the end of its life and not worth more than $50 - $100 even if it worked well. I wouldn't get too bent out of shape over this. Try to repair it and charge the tenant the repair costs. If the replacement can't be repaired or isn't worth the effort, charge your Tenant $100 towards a new stove.

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    1Reply
  • Caroline Gerardo
    Lender · Washington DC · Member since 2015 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Linda Thomas:
    Quote from @Caroline Gerardo:

    @Bill B. genius receipt and call the place. They had to haul away the broken one, no?

    Nine years and this is the single and only problem with tenant ever? If they were perfect charge them for the repair. What would break a gas stove? Are there burn marks on the wall???


     So you would ask for receipt and call and confirm haul of old one? What if they don't have receipt or say bought on marketplace? There were other issues too not perfect tenant. No burn marks on walls or cabinet above. 


     The timing is too too co-inky--dinky. Even if they got it on marketplace there would be a person who sold it, a truck, arrangements... When a tenant decides to move is not when they start paying for new appliances ~ maybe it broke months ago????

    Some gas stoves from the 1950's work as cute vintage ones. Ones made in China today probably last 15-20. If the pilot went out it was your right to inspect and repair it in place. I would be able to fix the pilot myself. Maybe it was a greasy mess? Maybe it did break and they are super nice???

     Is the used one the bought the same value as your one that was also used in place? Trip charge may be more than the repair cost. 

    0Reply
  • Scott Mac
    Austin, TX · Member since 2019 · 5k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    3y

    The small circuit boards can burn from power surges, leaving parts of the stove useless.

    Renters replacement stove, might have the same issue--or it just be an igniter.

    The cost to replace the board can be almost as much as a new entry level stove.

    If it were mine, I'd thank the renter for replacing it and have a fixup cost quoted, if it was around the price of a new stove, I'd buy the new stove and put it in (how is the rest of the kitchen--fridge, disposal, etc..., maybe do a total replace so everything matches, vs the 3am service calls...)

    I would also consider a surge protector for the new stove, and consider (cost out) whole house surge protection at the breaker box--from a master electrician.

    I would not charge the renter for this, it was not misuse or abuse--this happens to these circuit board controlled stoves.

    just my 2 cents.

    0Reply
  • Michael Peters
    Member since 2019 · 215 posts · 122 votes
    3y

    If the stove fits with the other appliances and is in good shape I would repair and charge the tenants from their deposit.  If you need to purchase a new appliance charge them a prorated amount for the new one and any related expenses.  Make sure to break out how you came to that amount in your deposit disposition.  I would use a 15 expected life on the stove.  If its older then that only charge if there are extra expenses outside of it they had just told you up front.  Consider adding a clause in your lease agreement around unauthorized repairs to cover yourself in the futur.e

    0Reply
  • Tim Miller
    Rental Property Investor · Laurel, MD · Member since 2016 · 378 posts · 382 votes
    3y

    @Linda Thomas They stole the stove and replaced it with a piece of junk. As other's have stated, they sold it for cash. You can't accuse them of steeling it but, you can say. The stove that came with the unit was taken without my permission and I now have to replace it. I cannot accept the stove you left without a "LEGAL" receipt for it. Therefore, the cost of a new stove minus normal wear and tear. The cost to install the new stove and the cost to remove and dispose of the stove you left behind. Come's to a total of $XXX and your security deposit does not cover the total. Have a good day.

    I wouldn't keep the stove. Tell the tenant that he left personal belongings in the unit and the pick it up or it will be disposed of. Good luck.

    0Reply
  • Greg M.
    Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    3y

    Tenant is a liar. No idea what happened to the original stove, but I don't believe their story.

    Unless your state has a listed life expectancy of gas stoves, a court will likely use the same rate that is allowed by the IRS for depreciation. For a gas stove, that is 5 years. Therefore, you probably can't charge the tenant for this. 

    0Reply
  • Linda Thomas
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Allentown PA · Member since 2021 · 159 posts · 36 votes
    3y

    Update: 

    repairman said the broiler cannot be fixed ,the stove is not safe for anybody to use so the tenant that vacated left me a piece of crap I'm going to charge the $75 service call from the technician from her security deposit and I guess I will look for a used stove and charge her a portion or prorated  amount not sure how much need to try to fig out

    1Reply
  • Carlos Ptriawan
    Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Linda Thomas:

    Hello,

    Tenant lived in unit for 9 yrs. Gas stove was new when tenant moved in. Tenant vacated unit last week and we noticed a different stove in unit. We questioned tenant and they said about a month ago the stove stopped working so they replaced it with a used one. We further questions why they did this without our Knowledge and we inform them that they were supposed to let us know if they were having a problem with their stove as it is the landlord's responsibility to repair or replace not theirs unless it was damaged caused by them. Needless to say, now the stove isnt working properly, the broiler function isnt working and there are a few other issues. We have a repair guy coming this week to check it out. Question is how would you handle this? If its repairable would u deduct part or all the costs from the security deposit? I know life expectancy on a gas stove is 15 years so I only had maybe 6 years left but why did the tenant inform me of this why did they do this behind my back why didn't they leave the old stove there so I could see that something was wrong with it maybe it was good that they tried to fix it but the still that's there is having an issue and I need to make sure that it is safe for the next tenant what if the stove is not fixable what would you do would you buy a brand new stove and have the tenant that just moved out pay for half of it for all of it how would you proceed with this looking for suggestions and advice thank you so much guys


     OMG, just replace it with a used one, only 128 bucks in our market :) I don't even bother asking for receipt, such a small issue.

    0Reply
  • Henry T.
    Member since 2022 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    3y

    He stole your stove. You blew it. You should not have attempted to fix his piece of crap. You should have told him you want your stove back and to come and get his belongings that he left behind. I would have charged him for the reduced value of my good stove, unless he left me one that was as good or better, and working perfectly.

    0Reply
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