Tiny house park idea on large parcel of land
Rental Property Investor · Rutland, VT · Member since 2017 · 61 posts · 16 votes
If you could get it past the local government .
Bigger population which would be good. I think I have seen 2 people post on Front Porch Forum over the past year looking for ideas of where to park. One thing just to consider if how much someone might be willing to pay since many tiny home dwellers are trying to reduce costs. Good luck!
Above all else, you probably need to befriend someone on the city's council/zoning commission, have them champion this for you or at least let you understand how the city considers a tiny house to be different from a manufactured home. I would think an RV park might be more apropos given these are most likely going to be shorter termed stays with your perspective clients, but I think it is a neat idea.
Buzz Killington here.
Have you looked at projected numbers, based off similar projects? Given that you are in the woods, why will anyone pay you to park their tiny home on your land, instead of anywhere else (friend's place with a view, etc)? How much will they realistically pay you?
If you can generate enough buzz and hype (very full time job) to make it a popular destination, maybe it could work. Skeptical that it will produce profits worth your time.
For some reason I can not see the difference with the mobility of a tiny home vs a motor home bus or trailer. This land would be the same as a motor home park which runs the gamut from accommodating trailers to multi million dollar motor homes that people live aboard. Entertainers have been living aboard and travel from state to state for years or sleep in a rest stop in total comfort and not like a gypsies. Motor homes are totally self contained with inverters and generators as well as large holding and fresh water tanks. Informed people who like this lifestyle usually go with motor homes are they are professionally built and conform with DOT rules and regulations. Tiny homes are relatively flimsy, not built with steel cage construction and not aerodynamic from what they show on TV as well as uninsulateed. There are already hundreds of existing motor home parks as well as "resorts" with amenities like swimming pools, gyms and landscaping with sewerage and fresh water supply that conforms with the local zoning laws. If you want to move you just disconnect and you are on the road again. Ask Willie. Why not just purchase land for a motor home park and rent slabs?
I like your idea and I think it would be a good niche if you can get past all the government and zoning regulations and logistics. Based on what I see and read, it seems it would appeal to progressive millennials and perhaps people wanting to escape the rat race and live a more down-to-earth sustainable lifestyle.
Here's an article from California that might be of interest to you:
Off the top of my head, it seems the tiny homes tend to be built to be more energy efficient and have less impact on the environment. They are also more aesthetically pleasing. I think it caters to a different demographics.
Angela. From "practical", economical, roadworthy, environmental, safety experience, the tiny home is less efficient than a motor home. The motor home is self contained and has to meet the standard of the RV association industry. The tiny house is a wood frame on a steel chassis. Not all motor homes are the same. As for esthetics, I understand your point. if you like the look of tiny home then this is subjective. If a son or daughter would want to go this route, I would not recommend it knowing and owning a number motor homes and traveling the roads for a number of years. What is the r-value of the insulation in a tiny home? I have not seen any insulation. You cannot built a square house on a steel structure and move it without damage. All things considered. The community concept is not a bad idea. I would invest in a community. The tiny home concept has numerous short comings for the cost. Try moving a tiny home and you will see for yourself. Not made for the open road.
Sid, tiny homes can be custom built like RV's. Construction, steel frame, wood frame, r-values, etc. will vary depending on what the builder/occupant will specify and if they plan to use it alot on the road (as far as aerodynamics, weight, stability, etc.), I'm sure they would take that into consideration when it is built.
I agree that the aesthetics of a tiny home vs. RV's is subjective. That's the beauty of it. Since some people will be attracted to RV's and others to the tiny home and since RV parks are ubiquitous and there's a scarcity of tiny home parks, it presents an opportunity for those who want to provide a community to accommodate them. If there's a demand for the tiny home, there will be demand for a tiny home park and I think that the demographics that occupy a tiny home park vs an RV park will be different and will dictate the amenities that are available.
@Alice K. I have. I actually have rented one through airbnb and hauled everything from propane tanks to furniture up that 1/4 mile straight up hill to camp(we kept the garden down at the bottom near the river :) ). I am planning on doing this when it's my time after the kiddos are grown anyways. This would just be a starting point. I'm not sure what I would charge for "lot rent", but I am sure it would depend on what amenities each person wanted.
There are a lot of ways to look at this idea in a positive light, but there of course is almost always drawbacks. Heating and electric, most have some source. In the horrible event something bad happens to the house, it'll most likely be completely on the owner of the house. If you were in a campground and your RV caught on fire from the inside out thats all on you. If you were renting an apartment and that happened most likely the owner of the building would be the one covering that.
I look at it like this... even if I rent each "lot" for $100/mo, just the dirt it's sitting on, and I have 10 units there, I have ZERO overhead. The tenant doesn't like one of the neighbors they can move their unit to the other side of the property or move out at anytime and I'll pro-rate their rent and move in the next unit.
I would provide the house(s) eventually, but not as a normal lease type agreement. More of an airbnb type deal for getaways/seasonal rentals. Whole summer, whatever.
no overhead at all seems more than unrealistic. At the very least you'll have property taxes and landscaping cost. I do agree that I think you should have a option for water hookup and need to figure out the sewage disposal. I've thought about this before but it being exclusively vacation rentals in a desired area.
Cost wise the operation of a "tiny home community" should at least be comparable to a mobile home community which ideally is in the range of 30% of rental income once the occupancy reaches a certain level. Initially, possibly for many years, income would be negative. A tiny home community would be more management intensive than a Mobile home community if the home owners are transient. I don't believe the tiny home movement is intended to actually be transient, for the most part they are closer to mobile homes than RVs as far as the intent to be mobile is concerned.
If you understand the mobile home industry you know that building a community today is much more cost prohibitive than buying a existing community. Ideally the best option would be to get council to allow the purchase of a failing RV camp ground and convert/allow tiny homes with the RVs. Problem being that the tiny home owners will most likely be of the opinion they are better than the RV people and there will be issues.
Cost wise it is far more practical to purchase a existing mobile home unfortunately those interested in tiny homes are in fact not doing it to specifically to save money otherwise the practicality of mobile homes or manufactured RVs would win over.
Tiny homes are not practical.
I agree with Thomas S. and add that when you compare dollar for dollar and all construction costs it would be more cost effective purchasing a factory built trailer or motor home. Both are constructed to an industry standard with warranties and financing as well as licensed propane gas plumbers in a controlled factory environment. This is an added advantage of the manufacturers being able to purchase their materials in bulk where the tiny home builder is building one of so their construction costs are going to be much higher providing much less bang for the buck. The costs of a tiny home are quite a bit higher to a trailer for less space. The advancement in motor home and trailer design with slide outs, insulation and cabinetry has an edge to tiny home design and construction with the added advantage of chassis design and construction which enables over the road possibilities of long range mobility. As for the actual living community, there are negative connotations to operating a transient or mobile home park in many areas. Towns make it increasing difficult to secure zoning to build a new facility in most places. Even existing park operators are realizing that the land value are of greater value to subdivide, develop and construct houses with less zoning difficulty in development. I like the concept of tiny houses however, I am experienced and see that the movement will face stiff opposition and an uphill battle on many fronts with diminishing returns. There is nothing wrong with being creative and having a dream as long as it is realistic and has ROI.
Me also Garrett, Give some old experience and get some new ones. :-))
Check out littleriverescapes.com
They have a community in North Ga that sounds like what you are planning.
400 sq. feet doesn't appeal to my lifestyle but I have dock mates that live in houseboats and do just fine.
Good luck
@Garrett Blanchard - You've hauled propane tanks up hills?! *bows as sign of respect*
:))
Hi Garrett,
I posted on this subject a little bit ago, But just know on the news there was a feature about BABY BOOMERS and how they are retiring in hoards to a place like your talking about. They have the money, especially if they haven't taken their one time capital gains tax from selling their homes. Some of them are walking away with hundreds of thousands of $ in equity, They are buying homes under say 1000 sq ft. My thoughts here is this even though THE MELLINIALS are so in to the home and mortgage thing that's all most baby boomers know, Not to mention they like the idea of much less upkeep on a small place. Like I said before I believe you'd be wise to put in the infrastructure like a mhp, but instead maybe focus on those 2 target group of people. If you offer things like laundry a pool and spa, a club house with free wifi and so on people would seek you out. I've seen Amish tiny houses (or smaller houses) for extremely reasonable rates they are solidly build and looks like they could withstand just about anything. Of course these are merely the ramblings of one person, But I think your on to something. There are financing options available to persons like yourself who are looking to do what your thinking. Hell if people can find funding for medical ........let say ah........herbs you surely could. Best of luck
Melissa
Hi it's Melissa again. I've been going over all the really great replays, and one stuck out to me ( well they all did truth be told). And I'm thinking over here that if you could find a mhp either going belly up or in distress due to poor management or owner who don't give a fancy rat backside about the park then what would stop you from allowing tiny homes on one part with regular mh on the other, the infrastructure is all ready there. As long as the basics fresh drinking water, septic system {or clean out for more organic offerings} laundry a place for kids to play so on I don't see how or why you'd be turned down, Tiny homes are generally much better built than say an RV, which are meant only for short periods of time to be live in. They use crappy material and with in a year things really start to show it. Tiny houses are built to be lived in 24/7. Many are one of a kind and built with good quality and great materials. I stop now sorry I just think of all the homeless people out there who need a place however big or small to call their home. I think this might fill at least a small part of that need. Oh and don't forget about section 8 housing. Those are like having an atm in your living room just spitting you out cash month after month.
The big issue, as was stated, is zoning. There is not a universal agreement nationwide about tiny homes in zoning departments across the nation. Most counties use the IRC for a majority of their codes. For example, under the IRC, a room, (not bathroom or kitchen) must be at least 70 sq feet with 7 foot ceiling. This is a problem with tiny houses.
Some counties, usually in the mountains, here in Colorado allow them. Others do not. Here in Colorado tiny homes are registered through the DMV and not through county assessors. So you do not have the same procedures as you would with real estate, ie titling and recording.
You can go the route of petitioning your county to allow for changes but you will be up against parties who don't want those changes.
Look before you leap.
Here is an interesting "legal" tiny home community I found a couple weeks ago. Looks like a fun and exciting opportunity for telecommuters!
"We propose that tiny houses in small towns yield even more freedom and offer a unique opportunity to regain a sense of community and self sufficiency. So we’re proud of our city council resolution, passed in July, 2014, that declared Spur the nations’ first tiny house friendly town, where you can build or bring your dream house, no matter the size and set it on a foundation on a regular city lot and live the way you choose. After two years, over 70 lots have been sold to folks planning to make Spur their new home." Hope this helps!
Hi Guys,
That sounds like the place I mentioned in an earlier thread. But at least in Ca your right if it's on wheels like your describing it would be threw the DMV. And since your idea isn't permanent space rental but more of a nightly/weekly rental rates. Zoning would probably be a little more lacks on the back roads but you don't want to have it to far off the beaten path or people may not come. I think it's time will come if it isn't already here. Maybe do some market research in your area, get a feel for what folks in your area are thinking about this kind of place. If there recreational opportunities available and it would help bring tourist dollars and a few jobs to the area well so much the better. I'm just putting stuff off the top of my head here. Personally I can totally see where you are coming from on this and like its a great idea. Maybe look in to KOA camping. Out on the west coast it's kind of a members place where you pay X amount a year and X amount a night but your guaranteed a spot in a very nice place. Family friendly with certain facilities in place the advantage to being on their list of spots is built in clients.. Best of luck and maybe keep BP posted as to your progress with this. It's a super great idea
Sincerely
Melissa
Very intriguing model. Did you ever pursue this more? @garrett blanchard