Buying real estate via land contract

Buying real estate via land contract

Rental Property Investor · Member since 2021 · 4 posts · 6 votes

Hello everyone, I've never posted anything until now but I've been on here reading, learning, absorbing for a few months now and I haven't seen this topic fully discussed so maybe we can use my own situation to help not only myself but others in the future.

So let's start at the beginning...

Oh wait first I should mention I'm in Lancaster Ohio. I've seen several people from Columbus on here so I'm sure that's relevant.

Ok here we go

11/1/12 I move into 1 of 4 duplexes for 500 a month.

7/1/16 I receive a letter from my landlord offering me a chance to buy the building I live in on land contract. Wheels start turning I go back to him and say I'd like to buy all 4 buildings.

We negotiate the price of 85k a piece he keeps all deposits as money down we file the land contract with the courts and on 9/1/16 they're mine. Initial balance... $335,000

Math is I pay him 3,000 a month for payment, insurance, taxes etc. 8 units at 500 a month = 4,000 a month. Cool 1,000 bucks a month profit.

Upon buying there's an empty unit so on day 1 I get all the keys go in it's completely destroyed. I spend about 4,000 fix it all up the way I want it and rent it at 600 so I'm negative but I've now made it all nice and upped the rent 100 bucks

(He still rents from me 4 1/2 years later best tenant I could ever ask for).

I do this again 2 months later when some people move out not nearly as expensive maybe like 800 bucks in supplies plus my time.

So that's the pattern I've used and they've all been at 600 a month the past 2 1/2 years so now it's 1,800 a month I make. But I've never really made any profit because I like putting the money back into my investment via fixing things up (that's one of the reasons why I like real estate) Keep in mind I fix everything myself unless it's out of my realm and I hire someone but that's only happened once. I'm adding all of this to also explain for someone not involved in real estate yet but who wants to get into it. The pride you gain from doing this yourself and not using contractors is very gratifying for me personally.

Anyhow, back to the financial stuff. Land contract expired in Sep. but due to never ending covid issues we haven't closed yet.

I initially met with a couple bankers and it seems I have an issue. My income on my taxes is out of wack by alot. I go through a never ending (all legal) process to keep my income on paper as low as possible like 22k a year to protect myself from a ruthless b*** ex and her just as bad lawyer.

So here's the big question... How do I finance the remaining 290K ? You see the numbers... Great positive cash flow...

I've gotten pretty good with comps and figures all over the whole city of Lancaster and I'm very confident each building will get appraised right now in this market for 125k at the very lowest to 150k at the highest. Zillow (wherever they get their numbers) has them at 140 a piece which tells me I might be correct.

As I see it I have multiple options.

1) Ammend last year's tax return and file this year's taxes at some much higher amount bite the bullet pay a bunch of taxes but give the bank the numbers they want.

2) Sell them and make a potentially huge profit.

I don't like this option I want these buildings I've put 100s of hours of my time into these (they're kinda like my kids at this point)

3) Extend land contract till I figure it out

4) See what you great people here think.

I don't even know what happens after I post this as far as if I get notifications or what if you all reply.

So thank you all for taking the time to read this and I can't wait to see what people smarter than me think.

3Reply
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Most Popular Reply

Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Zach Powell:

Hello everyone, I've never posted anything until now but I've been on here reading, learning, absorbing for a few months now and I haven't seen this topic fully discussed so maybe we can use my own situation to help not only myself but others in the future.

So let's start at the beginning...

Oh wait first I should mention I'm in Lancaster Ohio. I've seen several people from Columbus on here so I'm sure that's relevant.

Ok here we go

11/1/12 I move into 1 of 4 duplexes for 500 a month.

7/1/16 I receive a letter from my landlord offering me a chance to buy the building I live in on land contract. Wheels start turning I go back to him and say I'd like to buy all 4 buildings.

We negotiate the price of 85k a piece he keeps all deposits as money down we file the land contract with the courts and on 9/1/16 they're mine. Initial balance... $335,000

Math is I pay him 3,000 a month for payment, insurance, taxes etc. 8 units at 500 a month = 4,000 a month. Cool 1,000 bucks a month profit.

Upon buying there's an empty unit so on day 1 I get all the keys go in it's completely destroyed. I spend about 4,000 fix it all up the way I want it and rent it at 600 so I'm negative but I've now made it all nice and upped the rent 100 bucks

(He still rents from me 4 1/2 years later best tenant I could ever ask for).

I do this again 2 months later when some people move out not nearly as expensive maybe like 800 bucks in supplies plus my time.

So that's the pattern I've used and they've all been at 600 a month the past 2 1/2 years so now it's 1,800 a month I make. But I've never really made any profit because I like putting the money back into my investment via fixing things up (that's one of the reasons why I like real estate) Keep in mind I fix everything myself unless it's out of my realm and I hire someone but that's only happened once. I'm adding all of this to also explain for someone not involved in real estate yet but who wants to get into it. The pride you gain from doing this yourself and not using contractors is very gratifying for me personally.

Anyhow, back to the financial stuff. Land contract expired in Sep. but due to never ending covid issues we haven't closed yet.

I initially met with a couple bankers and it seems I have an issue. My income on my taxes is out of wack by alot. I go through a never ending (all legal) process to keep my income on paper as low as possible like 22k a year to protect myself from a ruthless b*** ex and her just as bad lawyer.

So here's the big question... How do I finance the remaining 290K ? You see the numbers... Great positive cash flow...

I've gotten pretty good with comps and figures all over the whole city of Lancaster and I'm very confident each building will get appraised right now in this market for 125k at the very lowest to 150k at the highest. Zillow (wherever they get their numbers) has them at 140 a piece which tells me I might be correct.

As I see it I have multiple options.

1) Ammend last year's tax return and file this year's taxes at some much higher amount bite the bullet pay a bunch of taxes but give the bank the numbers they want.

2) Sell them and make a potentially huge profit.

I don't like this option I want these buildings I've put 100s of hours of my time into these (they're kinda like my kids at this point)

3) Extend land contract till I figure it out

4) See what you great people here think.

I don't even know what happens after I post this as far as if I get notifications or what if you all reply.

So thank you all for taking the time to read this and I can't wait to see what people smarter than me think.

 I would agree with the above comment. I would reach out to some commercial lenders to see if they can help. 

See this reply in the discussion

10 Replies

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  • Member since 2021 · 22 posts · 11 votes
    5y

    You have listed some good options.  Could you get a co borrower? 

  • New to Real Estate · Lehigh Valley, PA · Member since 2020 · 12 posts · 6 votes
    5y

    I suggest finding a small, local bank and working with them to determine a realistic number for you to finance. Do the math and extend the current land contract until the pay off reaches that number. In the mean time, save as much of your cash flow as possible. No sense in stressing about bank financing if the seller will continue to finance the properties for you, at a reasonable rate. Good luck!

  • Remington LymanBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2017 · 6k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Zach Powell:

    Hello everyone, I've never posted anything until now but I've been on here reading, learning, absorbing for a few months now and I haven't seen this topic fully discussed so maybe we can use my own situation to help not only myself but others in the future.

    So let's start at the beginning...

    Oh wait first I should mention I'm in Lancaster Ohio. I've seen several people from Columbus on here so I'm sure that's relevant.

    Ok here we go

    11/1/12 I move into 1 of 4 duplexes for 500 a month.

    7/1/16 I receive a letter from my landlord offering me a chance to buy the building I live in on land contract. Wheels start turning I go back to him and say I'd like to buy all 4 buildings.

    We negotiate the price of 85k a piece he keeps all deposits as money down we file the land contract with the courts and on 9/1/16 they're mine. Initial balance... $335,000

    Math is I pay him 3,000 a month for payment, insurance, taxes etc. 8 units at 500 a month = 4,000 a month. Cool 1,000 bucks a month profit.

    Upon buying there's an empty unit so on day 1 I get all the keys go in it's completely destroyed. I spend about 4,000 fix it all up the way I want it and rent it at 600 so I'm negative but I've now made it all nice and upped the rent 100 bucks

    (He still rents from me 4 1/2 years later best tenant I could ever ask for).

    I do this again 2 months later when some people move out not nearly as expensive maybe like 800 bucks in supplies plus my time.

    So that's the pattern I've used and they've all been at 600 a month the past 2 1/2 years so now it's 1,800 a month I make. But I've never really made any profit because I like putting the money back into my investment via fixing things up (that's one of the reasons why I like real estate) Keep in mind I fix everything myself unless it's out of my realm and I hire someone but that's only happened once. I'm adding all of this to also explain for someone not involved in real estate yet but who wants to get into it. The pride you gain from doing this yourself and not using contractors is very gratifying for me personally.

    Anyhow, back to the financial stuff. Land contract expired in Sep. but due to never ending covid issues we haven't closed yet.

    I initially met with a couple bankers and it seems I have an issue. My income on my taxes is out of wack by alot. I go through a never ending (all legal) process to keep my income on paper as low as possible like 22k a year to protect myself from a ruthless b*** ex and her just as bad lawyer.

    So here's the big question... How do I finance the remaining 290K ? You see the numbers... Great positive cash flow...

    I've gotten pretty good with comps and figures all over the whole city of Lancaster and I'm very confident each building will get appraised right now in this market for 125k at the very lowest to 150k at the highest. Zillow (wherever they get their numbers) has them at 140 a piece which tells me I might be correct.

    As I see it I have multiple options.

    1) Ammend last year's tax return and file this year's taxes at some much higher amount bite the bullet pay a bunch of taxes but give the bank the numbers they want.

    2) Sell them and make a potentially huge profit.

    I don't like this option I want these buildings I've put 100s of hours of my time into these (they're kinda like my kids at this point)

    3) Extend land contract till I figure it out

    4) See what you great people here think.

    I don't even know what happens after I post this as far as if I get notifications or what if you all reply.

    So thank you all for taking the time to read this and I can't wait to see what people smarter than me think.

     I would start reaching out to local commercial banks to start shopping your options. I have a list of them here in Columbus, Ohio.

  • Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Zach Powell:

    Hello everyone, I've never posted anything until now but I've been on here reading, learning, absorbing for a few months now and I haven't seen this topic fully discussed so maybe we can use my own situation to help not only myself but others in the future.

    So let's start at the beginning...

    Oh wait first I should mention I'm in Lancaster Ohio. I've seen several people from Columbus on here so I'm sure that's relevant.

    Ok here we go

    11/1/12 I move into 1 of 4 duplexes for 500 a month.

    7/1/16 I receive a letter from my landlord offering me a chance to buy the building I live in on land contract. Wheels start turning I go back to him and say I'd like to buy all 4 buildings.

    We negotiate the price of 85k a piece he keeps all deposits as money down we file the land contract with the courts and on 9/1/16 they're mine. Initial balance... $335,000

    Math is I pay him 3,000 a month for payment, insurance, taxes etc. 8 units at 500 a month = 4,000 a month. Cool 1,000 bucks a month profit.

    Upon buying there's an empty unit so on day 1 I get all the keys go in it's completely destroyed. I spend about 4,000 fix it all up the way I want it and rent it at 600 so I'm negative but I've now made it all nice and upped the rent 100 bucks

    (He still rents from me 4 1/2 years later best tenant I could ever ask for).

    I do this again 2 months later when some people move out not nearly as expensive maybe like 800 bucks in supplies plus my time.

    So that's the pattern I've used and they've all been at 600 a month the past 2 1/2 years so now it's 1,800 a month I make. But I've never really made any profit because I like putting the money back into my investment via fixing things up (that's one of the reasons why I like real estate) Keep in mind I fix everything myself unless it's out of my realm and I hire someone but that's only happened once. I'm adding all of this to also explain for someone not involved in real estate yet but who wants to get into it. The pride you gain from doing this yourself and not using contractors is very gratifying for me personally.

    Anyhow, back to the financial stuff. Land contract expired in Sep. but due to never ending covid issues we haven't closed yet.

    I initially met with a couple bankers and it seems I have an issue. My income on my taxes is out of wack by alot. I go through a never ending (all legal) process to keep my income on paper as low as possible like 22k a year to protect myself from a ruthless b*** ex and her just as bad lawyer.

    So here's the big question... How do I finance the remaining 290K ? You see the numbers... Great positive cash flow...

    I've gotten pretty good with comps and figures all over the whole city of Lancaster and I'm very confident each building will get appraised right now in this market for 125k at the very lowest to 150k at the highest. Zillow (wherever they get their numbers) has them at 140 a piece which tells me I might be correct.

    As I see it I have multiple options.

    1) Ammend last year's tax return and file this year's taxes at some much higher amount bite the bullet pay a bunch of taxes but give the bank the numbers they want.

    2) Sell them and make a potentially huge profit.

    I don't like this option I want these buildings I've put 100s of hours of my time into these (they're kinda like my kids at this point)

    3) Extend land contract till I figure it out

    4) See what you great people here think.

    I don't even know what happens after I post this as far as if I get notifications or what if you all reply.

    So thank you all for taking the time to read this and I can't wait to see what people smarter than me think.

     I would agree with the above comment. I would reach out to some commercial lenders to see if they can help. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Member since 2021 · 4 posts · 6 votes
    5y

    @Remington Lyman

    I would like that. Who do you have in mind ?

  • Rental Property Investor · Member since 2021 · 4 posts · 6 votes
    5y

    @Noah Black

    No that part is not favorable. The land contract is 5% aren't current rates better than that ?

  • Brandon SturgillBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker · Columbus, OH · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    @Zach Powell Are you saying you have a contract for deed and you cannot meet the contract terms?...if I'm the owner, we part ways and I have my property back...with improvements....not entirely sure what you are after. What were the terms of the contract?

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  • Brandon SturgillBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker · Columbus, OH · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    @Zach Powell we're actively buying MF in Lancaster... if you are looking to sell I'd be willing to start a conversation. Feel free to PM me.

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  • Rental Property Investor · Member since 2021 · 4 posts · 6 votes
    5y

    @Brandon Sturgill

    We're completely on the same page. He has no desire to F me. He doesn't want them back. Wants nothing to do with them. That's why he sold them to me in the first place.

  • Investor / Landlord · Columbus, OH · Member since 2015 · 276 posts · 174 votes
    5y

    @Zach Powell 

    @Brandon Sturgill gave you an important "heads up".  Do not ignore it.  I'm NOT an attorney but I understand Ohio Land Installment Contracts pretty well and I have over 30 years of experience with them as both a buyer and seller.

    There is a gray area that you'll need an attorney to sort out because if it "hits the fan", the following may matter.  Ohio law requires certain protective features for LIC's when the buyer is an owner occupant; i.e., when it is a consumer transaction.  Many of those features are not required for business to business (non-owner occupant transactions).  You've spoken in terms of a singular land contract which presumably was written based on the owner occupant standards for all 4 buildings which is a plus for you BUT you need an attorney for several reasons and the attorney can tell you if the document you have was done correctly.

    As Mr. Sturgill has correctly suggested, you are now (very likely) at the mercy of the seller.  The fact that you imply he is still accepting payments is helpful to your case but he can change that in 10 minutes by sending you a letter requiring you to pay the full amount (I don't recall the law on this point and it may be that since he's accepted payments he has to give you 60 or 90 or some other number of days to get the money but he can demand it).

    The fact is that you've got significant liability.  ALL THAT YOU'VE DONE IS AT RISK.  You say he doesn't want them back?  Maybe that's true but maybe he doesn't know what they are worth today.  Or, maybe he has a heart attack and he dies tomorrow and his heirs have a totally different way of looking at the situation.  At the risk of insulting you, you are a fool if you don't speak to an attorney who has a strong history with land contracts.   If you want to be an investor, you have to be ethical, honest and fair but you also have to be protective of your interests.  Oh, and by the way, you don't have the deed, only a promise that he will give it to you.  From day one you should have had that placed in escrow pending full payment (you can arrange for an escrow now with your land contract's new terms) or, even better, change the deal to you getting the deed now and you giving him a note and mortgage.  He's had years of you paying on time, he should be comfortable doing that.  That way you avoid banks altogether.  Even though you may be able to get a slightly better interest rate at a bank, by time you pay for the appraisals and costs you will almost certainly be in almost the same position financially and have a far more flexible mortgagee.  There's lots of ways the note can be written that will be beneficial to you and to him (he can get modest periodic balloons if needs them as an inducement, for example).

    Bottom line - you are standing with your pants down around your ankles.  Whether you trip and fall and lose it all or stop, pull them up and get headed in the right direction is all up to you.

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