All She Has is a PO Box and 2 Cars

All She Has is a PO Box and 2 Cars

Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes

I found a goldmine of a  property today. Hidden gem off the beaten path. Absentee owner, no mortgage, lots of sweat equity.  The town has one of the big x's on the front of the house warning the fire fighters not to go in if there is a fire.

Its also one of the few multi families in this particular town. Very few were ever built. Buy and hold opportunity. 

No tax liens, two registered and insured cars sit in the drive way surround by trash. The last recorded deed for the property is in the names of a husband and wife both deceased. I checked probate records and found no open cases for those names. Intel from the neighbors say there is a daughter who is still alive. ( must be paying the taxes ). All my research points to a PO box. The daughter owns no land in her name according to public records and the several registries I have searched.

The daughter also does not have any utility bills in her name ( which leads me to believe she is living with someone else ).

Other than mail what can I do to find this woman? The house this woman has rights to is literally destroying the value of the neighbors home. The neighbor really wants to find her too, with the hopes she will sell the house to someone like me who will fix it up and restore value.

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Wholesaler · Atwater, CA · Member since 2013 · 161 posts · 27 votes
9y

Lots to do here...Look up decedents' "informant" on the death certificate. Or if your county does not file that as public records, you may call funeral homes to find the informant (name and phone #). Contact the city/county as to who is responsible person of interest (tax collector). Per states laws, that information is public... as a neighbor may need to know what hazards pose a thread next to them. Someone is paying those taxes! Send a letter to PO box and in red ink  outside envelope mark " ATTN Post Master;  Forwarding Address Requested". Thus any mail returned or in general the post master will give a physical address of said person. 

This is surely NOT an AP deal. I've completed some and would know.

One other thing...put a FOR SALE By Owner sign right in front! I bet that will get them to come out. 

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  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y

    Thanks for the replies. However im trying to find a way to get in touch with the daughter other than mail. Or have i come to an end with the mailbox.

    I can feel the neighbors pain, her home is not worth as much being in proximity to this house. Although the daughter is paying the taxes she is letting the house fall apart.

  • Investor · Memphis, TN · Member since 2015 · 105 posts · 68 votes
    9y

    @Rich Hupper There are people out there who make a living finding people like this.  Search for skip tracers.

    You can also try searching Facebook for the name.

  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y

    @Account Closed funny enough I already use skip tracing software. However this PObox is leaving me at a dead end.

  • Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2017 · 63 posts · 30 votes
    9y

    The registered cars should have a name assigned to them. Who's paying the insurance on the car? I don't want to be the bearer of bad news but she may be deceased, incarcerated, or out of country.Try hiring a private investigator or bailbondsman to find her. Sadly, you could try adverse possession but that'll take 20yrs in MA lol, sorry if this doesn't help.

  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y

    @Brandon Raeburn According to the neighbor she is still alive and my skip tracing software says the same thing. Adverse possession is definitely out of the question. 

    she must be violating some sort of city ordinance with the mess all around her house and the negative affect it is having on her neighbors home. However to each their own, she probably has ever right to let her house rot into the ground. 

  • Wholesaler · Atwater, CA · Member since 2013 · 161 posts · 27 votes
    9y

    Lots to do here...Look up decedents' "informant" on the death certificate. Or if your county does not file that as public records, you may call funeral homes to find the informant (name and phone #). Contact the city/county as to who is responsible person of interest (tax collector). Per states laws, that information is public... as a neighbor may need to know what hazards pose a thread next to them. Someone is paying those taxes! Send a letter to PO box and in red ink  outside envelope mark " ATTN Post Master;  Forwarding Address Requested". Thus any mail returned or in general the post master will give a physical address of said person. 

    This is surely NOT an AP deal. I've completed some and would know.

    One other thing...put a FOR SALE By Owner sign right in front! I bet that will get them to come out. 

  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y

    @Arcinio Arauz thank you for that tip about the mail I will do that. 

    Can you clarify what an "AP Deal" is?

  • Wholesaler · Atwater, CA · Member since 2013 · 161 posts · 27 votes
    9y

    @Rich Hupper AP...Adverse Possession. An entirely different strategy of  acquiring property. 

    In a rough nut shell... A person basically holds a claim on said property (pays the taxes) and adversely, openly claims that property as his/hers.

    After a period of time, 5, 10, 20 years a court order can give you free title. Each state is different and you must know the laws governing within state. Risky? Yes. Profitable? Very much so if successful. I've done a few and many others here BP have as well.        

  • Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    Who's cutting the lawn, if it's a company they need to get paid somehow. I'm sure the person(s) cutting the lawn would take a finders fee for being able to get you the contact info... Lot easier than the mail man.

  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y

    @Arcinio Arauz Adverse Possession will not work. Its 20 years here in MA. 

    @Matt K. No one is cutting the lawn unfortunately. Good idea though thinking outside the box.

  • Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Rich Hupper:

    @Arcinio Arauz Adverse Possession will not work. Its 20 years here in MA. 

    @Matt K. No one is cutting the lawn unfortunately. Good idea though thinking outside the box.

     Apply some moxie and "confirm" that you have the right address to send proposal to the registered owner to fix the citations that are being sent out (from the city). Not sure where that office would be, might be multiple...  but if you got free time, why not. With a little bit of luck maybe you get something other than the PO Box.

  • Tuttle, OK · Member since 2017 · 4 posts · 0 votes
    9y

    @Rich Hupper This is not in answer to your question unfortunately, but I am hoping you can answer one for me. I am newly getting started, like not one property under my belt yet, I have found two such properties like you are talking about. My problem is though that I do not know where to begin on finding out the info on them. Two very nice houses grown up and left vacant. My realtor friend says there's nothing in the MLS about them. Could you direct me on how to find owners, or any info on them? Thanks in advance!

    QBCowan 

  • JD MartinBusiness Member
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    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    9y

    I thought the title to this thread was a new hit Country song :D

    Skyline Properties
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  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Matt K.:
    Originally posted by @Rich Hupper:

    @Arcinio Arauz Adverse Possession will not work. Its 20 years here in MA. 

    @Matt K. No one is cutting the lawn unfortunately. Good idea though thinking outside the box.

     Apply some moxie and "confirm" that you have the right address to send proposal to the registered owner to fix the citations that are being sent out (from the city). Not sure where that office would be, might be multiple...  but if you got free time, why not. With a little bit of luck maybe you get something other than the PO Box.

    ""Apply some moxie and "confirm" that you have the right address to send proposal to the registered owner to fix the citations that are being sent out (from the city)"""

    I am confused by this. What proposal?  Are you saying I approach the appropriate town office as if I were a contractor hired to remedy any code violations the property may have?

  • Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Rich Hupper:
    Originally posted by @Matt K.:
    Originally posted by @Rich Hupper:

    @Arcinio Arauz Adverse Possession will not work. Its 20 years here in MA. 

    @Matt K. No one is cutting the lawn unfortunately. Good idea though thinking outside the box.

     Apply some moxie and "confirm" that you have the right address to send proposal to the registered owner to fix the citations that are being sent out (from the city). Not sure where that office would be, might be multiple...  but if you got free time, why not. With a little bit of luck maybe you get something other than the PO Box.

    ""Apply some moxie and "confirm" that you have the right address to send proposal to the registered owner to fix the citations that are being sent out (from the city)"""

    I am confused by this. What proposal?  Are you saying I approach the appropriate town office as if I were a contractor hired to remedy any code violations the property may have?

     Technically, you are trying to buy the house, you buying the house would correct the issues that are likely in violation of city ordinances.  Your proposal to buy the house would be therefore fixing the citations. I'm guessing the city would be more inclined to get the violations fixed vs acting as realtor to sell a house.

  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y

    @Bobbie Cowan 

    The first thing you need to do is see if there is a mortgage on the property. If yes then the bank is most likely paying the taxes. If there is a mortgage and the property owners are MIA they have probably defaulted on their loan and left the property. The bank will eventually foreclose and you will have to wait until the bank takes possession, secures the property and gives it to a local broker to market it. If you can find the owners before the bank forecloses and they agree to sell the property to you subject to the existing loan that is one option. However you may have to spend a lot of money just getting the loan current. Most properties are in default because there is no equity so the owners just run. It would turn into a short sale if the owners are willing to go that road. These are a pain in the unless you have done them before. 

     If no mortgage exists then the owner of the property needs to make sure they are Paying the taxes. Assessors send taxes to the property's mailing address. This could be a PO BOX (in my case), the physical address or some other address. If the mailing address and the physical property address are the same and the property looks abandon the owners may be dead and the property could be going through probate. You would need to find the names on the last recorded deed for the property, take those names and see if you can search the probate files. Luckily for me in Massachusetts I can do this online.  Sometimes the deed is so old the names on the deed will not show up in the probate files and it will actually be in someone else's estate that may or may not be in probate. None of this is easy to figure out sometimes. 

    If the last recorded deed holders are dead and the property has gone through probate usually there is an affidavit from the personal rep of the estate recorded at the registry confirming their ability to sell the real estate, or a new deed drafted transferring title to the appropriate person according to will or laws of intestacy. 

    In my case, the property in discussion must go through probate before the daughter can legally convey title. She has not even started this process and she will probably take the property to the grave with her. 

    I enjoy hunting for the owners of these properties and trying to get them to sell. However it is not easy, and takes a lot of time. 

    If the property is in probate usually I try to get the personal rep of the estate to contract with me prior to them being able to sell.

  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Matt K.:
    Originally posted by @Rich Hupper:
    Originally posted by @Matt K.:
    Originally posted by @Rich Hupper:

    @Arcinio Arauz Adverse Possession will not work. Its 20 years here in MA. 

    @Matt K. No one is cutting the lawn unfortunately. Good idea though thinking outside the box.

     Apply some moxie and "confirm" that you have the right address to send proposal to the registered owner to fix the citations that are being sent out (from the city). Not sure where that office would be, might be multiple...  but if you got free time, why not. With a little bit of luck maybe you get something other than the PO Box.

    ""Apply some moxie and "confirm" that you have the right address to send proposal to the registered owner to fix the citations that are being sent out (from the city)"""

    I am confused by this. What proposal?  Are you saying I approach the appropriate town office as if I were a contractor hired to remedy any code violations the property may have?

     Technically, you are trying to buy the house, you buying the house would correct the issues that are likely in violation of city ordinances.  Your proposal to buy the house would be therefore fixing the citations. I'm guessing the city would be more inclined to get the violations fixed vs acting as realtor to sell a house.

    Absolutely. If I could buy the house I would drastically improve its value and this would help the neighbors current situation as well. 

    Its worth a shot.

  • Tuttle, OK · Member since 2017 · 4 posts · 0 votes
    9y

    @Rich Hupper Thanks so much for info!  Good luck with yours! 

  • Rental Property Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    Try googling the name, if you have not already.

    Hire a PI.

    Post a sign in the yard with your reasons for contact and your contact info.

    There is also a book called the investigators little black book. They are usually $20 but they have thousands of numbers for all kinds of investigative stuff just like this. I have a copy and I will peruse this weekend and see if I can find anything that might help you.

  • Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    9y

    Leave note(s) on the car(s) saying you want to buy the car.... then work in the house?

  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y

    @Jack B.

    @Matt K.

    Thanks guys. I am going to add these to my to do list for this prospect. I am also hoping my conversations has turned her into an ally.

  • Rental Property Investor · Mesa, AZ · Member since 2015 · 143 posts · 187 votes
    9y

    Can't you just knock on the door and ask the tenants who they pay rent to? Also, Facebook is a great way to find people. 

  • Investor · Jasper GA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    9y

    @Rich Hupper  I would look up the obituary on both of them.  Sometimes the family members will be listed and  the funeral home will have an online page where some of the family or friends will post their condolences.

    Other than that, I have a PI that charges $50 to run a skip trace and he bats around 500.

  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y

    @Nolan M. The first floor looks like an episode of hoarders buried alive.  second floor is vacant and hasn't been touched in 2 years since her aunt's cadaver was removed. 

  • Broker / Investor · Tewksbury, MA · Member since 2008 · 1k+ posts · 351 votes
    9y

    @Account Closed I use TLOXP via Transunion for skip tracing. What Skip tracing software does experian have?

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