Liar Kris Thomas Land Flipping 101 is a Fraud!!!
Real Estate Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 14 votes
Liar Kris Thomas Land Flipping 101 is a Fraud!!!
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Investor · VA · Member since 2015 · 21k+ posts · 19k+ votes
2y@Kate Brown
Sorry to hear this. No clue who they are. For others reading this some things to consider
1. Always always always research who the guru is and how much experience they are in advance
2. Get referrals and have them put in writing their experience
3. No training is worth $30k in any real estate course.
4. Use BiggerPockets to learn more about the guru
Hopefully others can learn about this and all training courses. Even those that have a cult following, most do nothing and get referrals
7e investments53 Reviews
40 Replies
- Investor · VA · Member since 2015 · 21k+ posts · 19k+ votes2y
@Kate Brown
Sorry to hear this. No clue who they are. For others reading this some things to consider
1. Always always always research who the guru is and how much experience they are in advance
2. Get referrals and have them put in writing their experience
3. No training is worth $30k in any real estate course.
4. Use BiggerPockets to learn more about the guru
Hopefully others can learn about this and all training courses. Even those that have a cult following, most do nothing and get referrals
7e investments53 Reviews - Real Estate Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 14 votes2y
Excellent advice and wholeheartedly agree! I was definitely a little too trusting but recorded calls where I was lied to because I did have an uneasy feeling.
- Flipper · Valparaiso, IN · Member since 2011 · 46 posts · 17 votes2y
Kate Brown, I started in land investing in 2017 after hearing an interview with a land investor on the Bigger Pockets podcast. Back then there were 3 or 4 people with education programs. Between then and 2020, a few more popped up with copycat courses of the original 2 programs. Since 2020, dozens of programs have popped up. Some have improved on the original 2 programs by using new technologies and services. However, the core remains the same. (Please note that there have been A LOT of new programs from people who have only been doing this for a few years.) I sat through the webinar that Kris Thomas has for the program you are talking about. I even asked why so much. (Correct me if I am wrong but the program costs $30K to start PLUS 50/50 split of your deals until the total reaches a minimum of $60K) Apparently they offer you their trained team in order to learn and do those deals. But it still does NOT justify the price. The original 2 players are Jack Bosch and Land Academy. Both of them have different levels of education from beginner to advanced. Nearly every education program is a copy of one of those 2. But to give you a little tip, look up a guy named Pete Reese. His podcast is called "Turning Profit". Also, he offers the entire education for free. It is a beginner's education. He makes his money by offering his own versions of technology and services that will help you streamline and grow your business. I am not suggesting you use his products or services as I think he has them overpriced. But his education will get you started so that you can see if you even like the land business.
- Real Estate Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 14 votes2y
Thank you. Very useful information! What was her response when you asked why so much? If it was truly plug and play and minimum hours like she states I wouldn’t mind but it’s totally not the case. No, it’s not until $60k minimum. It’s $30k + 50/50 first 3 deals OR $100k
- 2yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Quote from @Chris Seveney:
@Kate Brown
Sorry to hear this. No clue who they are. For others reading this some things to consider
1. Always always always research who the guru is and how much experience they are in advance
2. Get referrals and have them put in writing their experience
3. No training is worth $30k in any real estate course.
4. Use BiggerPockets to learn more about the guru
Hopefully others can learn about this and all training courses. Even those that have a cult following, most do nothing and get referrals
I grew up in the land business my Dad did the land business for 25 years starting in mid 60s. nothing has changed.
Concepts are dead simple. buy low sell high sell for cash for carry contracts.
U find land at Tax sales a lot of the time.
or you use whatever direct marketing concept you can afford direct mail telemarket etc.
you need great phone and closing skills .. anyone can get leads but without closing skills your success rate will be limited greatly. I still fund land flipper across the US.. But in a nut shell this is how all my clients get their props and then they have me for financing them. - 2yJoe S.Pro MemberInvestor · San Antonio · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
Exactly what part of their promises have they been unwilling to keep their word on?
I don’t know the folks, so no dog in the fight here. What I do know is that most educational programs have a disclaimer that says “these are not usual results” or something to that effect after they give glowing examples. Most people do not actually do deals whether they pay $10 or $50,000 on a training. - Real Estate Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 14 votes2y
Quote from @Joe S.:
Exactly what part of their promises have they been unwilling to keep their word on?
I don’t know the folks, so no dog in the fight here. What I do know is that most educational programs have a disclaimer that says “these are not usual results” or something to that effect after they give glowing examples. Most people do not actually do deals whether they pay $10 or $50,000 on a training.They breached material aspects of their contract. No there wasn’t a disclaimer like that.
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 734 votes2y
Quote from @Joe S.:
Exactly what part of their promises have they been unwilling to keep their word on?
I don’t know the folks, so no dog in the fight here. What I do know is that most educational programs have a disclaimer that says “these are not usual results” or something to that effect after they give glowing examples. Most people do not actually do deals whether they pay $10 or $50,000 on a training.Just looking at the various hotel conference room flip seminars there I have seen 30-50 people attending them go to the back of the room and fork over $1,500-2,500.00. They usually offer 8-10 of these when they come to Denver. So do the math. One seminar company using A&E celebrities did over $500 million in revenue. Paid the celebs about 40% of that.
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 734 votes2y
Quote from @Kate Brown:
Quote from @Joe S.:
Exactly what part of their promises have they been unwilling to keep their word on?
I don’t know the folks, so no dog in the fight here. What I do know is that most educational programs have a disclaimer that says “these are not usual results” or something to that effect after they give glowing examples. Most people do not actually do deals whether they pay $10 or $50,000 on a training.They breached material aspects of their contract. No there wasn’t a disclaimer like that.
The FTC might like to know this.
- Lender · Washington DC · Member since 2015 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes2y
Gurus with photos of them standing next to someone else's Ferrari. They charge huge $ for information that is free at the library. I have no affiliation with them, the concept is 'kinda' 'dumb. Land takes a LONG time to sell. There is no fast flipping for newbies without skills.
Look up the Harris brothers in Texas: Trey and John in Colony Ridge. Experienced developers shortcutting details/ expect bad consequences.
- 2yV.G JasonPro MemberInvestor · Member since 2022 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
Quote from @Caroline Gerardo:
Gurus with photos of them standing next to someone else's Ferrari. They charge huge $ for information that is free at the library. I have no affiliation with them, the concept is 'kinda' 'dumb. Land takes a LONG time to sell. There is no fast flipping for newbies without skills.
Look up the Harris brothers in Texas: Trey and John in Colony Ridge. Experienced developers shortcutting details/ expect bad consequences.
Fast solutions have slow problems.
This instant gratification era will learn.
- Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes2y
Quote from @Caroline Gerardo:
Gurus with photos of them standing next to someone else's Ferrari. They charge huge $ for information that is free at the library. I have no affiliation with them, the concept is 'kinda' 'dumb. Land takes a LONG time to sell. There is no fast flipping for newbies without skills.
Look up the Harris brothers in Texas: Trey and John in Colony Ridge. Experienced developers shortcutting details/ expect bad consequences.
I checked local sold listing, the IRR is about 7-8%....sometimes there's jackpot of 20% IRR, but very rare.
Just invest in QQQ was better lol - Flipper · Valparaiso, IN · Member since 2011 · 46 posts · 17 votes2y
Quote from @Caroline Gerardo:
Gurus with photos of them standing next to someone else's Ferrari. They charge huge $ for information that is free at the library. I have no affiliation with them, the concept is 'kinda' 'dumb. Land takes a LONG time to sell. There is no fast flipping for newbies without skills.
Look up the Harris brothers in Texas: Trey and John in Colony Ridge. Experienced developers shortcutting details/ expect bad consequences.
- Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2016 · 35 posts · 21 votes2y
Quote from @Kate Brown:
Excellent advice and wholeheartedly agree! I was definitely a little too trusting but recorded calls where I was lied to because I did have an uneasy feeling.
Careful with this. Massachusetts is a two-party consent state for audio recordings.
- Real Estate Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 14 votes2y
@John Gillick thank you. I’m actually in NH and they’re in TN, FL, AZ. Regardless of state, they recorded the calls first and I have the recording of the beginning of the zoom saying “call recording started” so it’s evident we were both aware.
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 734 votes2y
Quote from @Kate Brown:
@John Gillick thank you. I’m actually in NH and they’re in TN, FL, AZ. Regardless of state, they recorded the calls first and I have the recording of the beginning of the zoom saying “call recording started” so it’s evident we were both aware.
Yeah no one is worth charging $30,000.00 to begin with. That said I support you and joined your FB group. There are alternative ways to deal with these types.
- Real Estate Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 14 votes2y
@Nate Marshall Thank you so much!
- 2yJoe S.Pro MemberInvestor · San Antonio · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
Quote from @Caroline Gerardo:
Gurus with photos of them standing next to someone else's Ferrari. They charge huge $ for information that is free at the library. I have no affiliation with them, the concept is 'kinda' 'dumb. Land takes a LONG time to sell. There is no fast flipping for newbies without skills.
Look up the Harris brothers in Texas: Trey and John in Colony Ridge. Experienced developers shortcutting details/ expect bad consequences.
Why is it that many posers like to stand next to a Ferrari when people that have real wealth many times try to hide the fact?
- Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2016 · 35 posts · 21 votes2yBecause they're selling. It's no different than the advice to sales people that they need to drive a nicer car. (Depending on what they're selling, probably not six figure nice, but newer and well cared for). I don't do sales because my talent is not in social interactions, but the advice seems to be gospel among those that do sales successfully.
Quote from @Joe S.:
Quote from @Caroline Gerardo:
Gurus with photos of them standing next to someone else's Ferrari. They charge huge $ for information that is free at the library. I have no affiliation with them, the concept is 'kinda' 'dumb. Land takes a LONG time to sell. There is no fast flipping for newbies without skills.
Look up the Harris brothers in Texas: Trey and John in Colony Ridge. Experienced developers shortcutting details/ expect bad consequences.
Why is it that many posers like to stand next to a Ferrari when people that have real wealth many times try to hide the fact?
- Rental Property Investor · East Wenatchee, WA · Member since 2014 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes2y
Quote from @Joe S.:
Quote from @Caroline Gerardo:
Gurus with photos of them standing next to someone else's Ferrari. They charge huge $ for information that is free at the library.
Why is it that many posers like to stand next to a Ferrari when people that have real wealth many times try to hide the fact?
Meanwhile, the actual wealthy be like...
- Real Estate Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 14 votes2y
@Steve Vaughan 😂 facts!
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 734 votes2y
Quote from @Steve Vaughan:
Quote from @Joe S.:
Quote from @Caroline Gerardo:
Gurus with photos of them standing next to someone else's Ferrari. They charge huge $ for information that is free at the library.
Why is it that many posers like to stand next to a Ferrari when people that have real wealth many times try to hide the fact?
Meanwhile, the actual wealthy be like...
Steve Lukather the guitarist and legend from Toto tells stories about George Harrison driving a beater VW bug around Hollywood because people wouldn't hassle him.
- Member since 2024 · 6 posts · 0 votes2y
Ms. Brown also fails to disclose here that she had twelve (12) deals under contract during the Agreement totaling over $600K in potential profit and the smear campaign began when her coaching agreement was due to expire. Now she is trying to get me to pay her to take down the posts.
It should also be noted that on the Facebook page, she is apparently still flipping properties under "USA Land." She’s made all these accusations, which I don’t deem meritorious and I filed a response which anyone can access here or read below:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1JLyaqsu_mgRB87Dxr7AX...
I don’t know what else to say. Here are all the things in the contract and here are all the things we did for her:
What Six Figure Land Flipper Agreed To Perform Under The Agreement, And
Six Figure Land Flipper Performance Of Its Obligations Under That Contract.
- Coaching Services. The Coach agrees to perform and provide the following services in accordance with the terms and conditions set forth in this agreement:
• Membership Portal with Everything You Need From Start to Finish
• Unlimited Transactional Funding Available
• First 8,000 Mailers Paid (Print & Postage)
• Daily Live Office Hours
• Unlimited Deal Reviews
• Weekly Live Deal Reviews
• Recruited & Fully Trained Sales Team (First 90 Days Free)
• Discounted Sales Team After 90 Days
• Recruited & Fully Trained Operations Team Ready to Go
• Discounted Operations Team
• Professional Buying & Selling Websites + Monthly Hosting
• Professional Buying & Selling Logos Created
• Trello Advanced Templates & Training
• DataTree Research Subscription
• Access to Private Facebook Group
Six Figure Land Flipper performed each and everyone of the required services. Specifically:
I. Ms. Brown was supplied with the membership portal with access to the full suite of
products and services the agreement provides for. Thus, the first obligation was met
under the Agreement. Ms., Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that the portal was not provided. Nor can she.
2. The Coach did provide access to unlimited transactional funding for any deal. Thus,
the second obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms. Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that funding was unavailable. Nor can she.
3. The Coach provided the first 8,000 mailers. Thus, the third obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms., Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that the first 8,000 mailers was not provided. Nor can she.
4. The Coach provided daily live office hours. The Coach has office hours between 1-2pm ET every day. Thus, the fourth obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms. Brown in her complaint complains of weekend issues and holiday issues. This is an unreasonable complaint regarding businesses. Ms. Brown did not give more than 24 hours to respond to a communication that was sent on the Sunday evening of the Thanksgiving holiday before she started her smear campaign the next morning. Other than the discreet weekend and holiday issues, she acknowledges that daily office hours were kept.
5. The Coach did provide unlimited deal reviews. Thus, the fifth obligation was met under the Agreement. In fact. Ms. Brown submitted over 20 reviews. In addition, Ms. Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that the Coach limited deal reviews. Nor can she.
6. The Coach provided weekly live deal reviews. Thus, the sixth obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms. Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that the Coach limited deal reviews. In fact, she specifically acknowledges it.
7. Recruited and fully trained Sales Team (First 90 days) was provided. Thus, the sixth
obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms. Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that this was provided to her. What it states is she was unhappy with the sales team, not that it did not exist.
8. Discounted Sales Team after 90 days. The Coach had and still has the sales team available at a discounted rate after the first 90 days. Except for a two-week period, Ms. Brown failed to avail herself of the service electing, instead to forego payment for the services provided.
Therefore, the role and labor of any sales team became a commitment of Ms. Brown and not an "outsourced" service. Ms. Brown's assumption of this role is one of the root causes of her statement that it "could not be done in a few hours per week". Had she availed herself of these services, the time demands for the program would have greatly diminished for her.
The sole monetary issue in this is a charge for skip traces. It is a small issue in context that certainly does not rise to the program being a "scam".
9. Recruited And Fully Trained Operations Team Ready To Go. The Coach had and still
has the Fully Trained Operations Team Ready to Go. This service is an additional cost as referenced in the following Service "Discounted Operations Team". Ms. Brown failed to avail herself of the service electing, instead, to forego payment for the services provided. Therefore, the role and labor of any Operations Team became a commitment of Ms. Brown and not an "outsourced" service. Ms. Brown's assumption of this role is one of the root causes of her statement that it "could not be done in a few hours per week".
1O. Discounted Operations Team. The Coach had and still has the Fully Trained Operations Team Ready to Go. This service is an additional cost as referenced in the following Service "Discounted Operations Team". Ms. Brown failed to avail herself of the service electing, instead, to forego payment for the services provided. Therefore, the role and labor of any Operations Team became a commitment of Ms. Brown and not an "outsourced" service. Ms. Brown's assumption of this role is one of the root causes of her statement that it "could not be done in a few hours per week".
11. Professional Buying & Selling Web sites + Monthly Hosting was provided under the
Agreement and Ms. Brown had edit power over the site at the time of its creation. Thus, the eleventh obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms. Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that this was provided to her. Nor can she. What her issue was, is that she was not happy with the website. This is different from not providing the website.
12. Professional Buying & SeIling Logos Created was provided under the Agreement. Thus, the twelfth obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms. Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that this was provided to her. Nor can she.
13. Trello Advanced Templates & Training was provided under the Agreement. Thus, the thirteenth obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms. Brown in her allegations, did not like the product, but actually admits that it exists and was provided.
14. DataTree Research Subscription was provided under the Agreement. Thus, the
fourteenth obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms. Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that this was provided to her. Nor can she.
15. Access to Private Facebook Group was provided under the Agreement. Thus, the
fourteenth obligation was met under the Agreement. Ms. Brown in her complaint does not identify any allegation that refutes that this was provided to her. Nor can she. Access for Ms. Brown was terminated upon her initiation of the smear campaign and lodging her accusations that the system and its participants are a "scam". Based upon her actions she will not be granted any additional access to the group.
Thus, under the Agreement, the Coach has fully performed each and every one of the services provided.
- Real Estate Investor · Boston, MA · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 14 votes2y
@Kris Thomas how do you sleep at night with all the people you screw over?
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