"Must have" due dilligence manual?

Question

So I took the plunge and went ahead and got the MHP home study course (the big expensive one with all the cd's and razamataz0 but i'm a little hesitant on spending another 200 dollars for a due dilligence manual , firstly I purchased on ebay and they (frank and daves ebay company) seem to be offering a book called "The Commercial Real Estate Due Diligence Manual" that they wrote, vs on the MHP University site where its specifically tailored to MHP's (same price)

I've been eating up everything on both this forum and the mhp U one as well as the park street partners podcast , is this really something I should invest another 200 bucks in or can I glean the essentials from blog posts and such? - My strategy does not preclude owning normal multifamily units such as quads / small apartments so I think I could get more out of a general "commercial" vs "MHP" even though my first purchase will be an MHP , has anyone read these that could chime in?

Chris Reeves · Answer

Hi OP - Frank Rolfe's due diligence manual is worth $2,000 not $200. No, it isn't just a list of things you can find in a 2 page blog post - real estate is a lot more complicated than that. And yes, MHP's are a unique asset class. There is zero fluff in his book - absolutely none. It is 200 pages of extreme detail with a logically oriented 30 day plan of due diligence.

I know there's a lot of BS in the real estate guru industry - this is not part of that world of BS.

MHP's a unique niche and there is no other source of solid due diligence info. It isn't the same as apartments at ALL - and I am someone who comes from multifamily and is transitioning into MHP's - I know.

You don't need to buy it but you are being extraordinarily penny wise and pound foolish if you really have a MHP under contract and you don't want to spend $200 to make sure you don't buy something and make a huge mistake.

Sam Priddy · Answer

I have not read either. However, due diligence in a nutshell is probably the most important part of the entire process of real estate investing.  So if you believe there is some information that you have to find before getting in over your head on a project or deal then the real question is, is it worth $200 to find that information? I'm not trying to sell you the book, (but you can tell whoever you bought it from that I convinced you and they owe me 20% ;) )  but the power of knowledge is immeasurable and knowing exactly what due diligence is and what YOUR due diligence is going to be in any given scenario is HIGHLY useful. On the other hand, if you cannot forego $200 for information then are you ready for this deal that you are considering?  I'm not trying to be rude or anything negative but in my experience if I can't even come off a few hundred bucks for information that will last me a lifetime then I was certainly not in a position to buy and sale any type of real estate. So the real question is how much do you value the information and knowledge? Let me ask you this if you have an hourly based job what is your hourly rate? (please don't actually respond with the answer just ask yourself that).  Figure out how much time you have to work for $200. Is spending that amount of time and energy scrolling through blogs and thinking up questions to type into google going to provide the same amount of info that is in this book?  I don't know if it will or not because I don't know the book. But I could imagine there may just be some information in there that will be helpful and much easier to find since you would have a book about it. Also, do you know how much of the information you are going to dig up on your own will actually be helpful? I've always advocated for education even if you don't go to school for it. Buying a book is usually a good way to educate yourself. I actually still have old text books from college and believe it or not I have been known to scheme through them from time to time .... so I'm kind of partial to the idea of buying the book. And again, I know that if $200 is going to break me then I am in no position to invest, but that's just me.

Ken Rishel · Answer

I actually think you have figured it out by now and understand that $200 is cheap for what they are supplying.

With that said, I would always consider the source of the information and their reputation long before I would worry about the price. In Frank and Dave's case, they are well known and well thought off, so if they had something I thought I needed I would not blink at spending $2,000 with them. They are the type of people who are going to price their materials fairly in their mind, and often far below the true value to the purchaser.

There are some individuals who offer seminars, courses, and materials here and elsewhere I am pretty skeptical of and might not spend $20 with. In a forum environment like this, it doesn't take long to separate the quality of offerings.

Part of the problem here is there are so many people that discover the forum and think they can learn everything they need to know just by asking questions and they are inclined to do so because they are vastly undercapitalized which is what I think Sam was referring to. When they discover they are going to have to invest in their learning and in legal documents that are actually correct, they often get mad because the realization rains on their pipe dreams of investing a few thousand dollars and becoming a multi-millionaire with very little work.

Like many others here, I am a very big believer in due diligence, and the more detailed and multi- faceted the better. While I have not seen Frank and Dave's work on this, I know if I put together such a manual it would take considerable time and effort to do so and selling it for $200 would seem a cheap selling price to me. Part of the problem is the whole manufactured housing industry is a niche industry, and the volume of prospective buyers for anything is far lower than what one would expect in the mass market, so the need to charge more per customer is greater.

If I were qualified to write a book on buying and owning apartment complexes - which I am not - I might expect to sell 50,000 copies. If I were to put together some of the materials that Frank and Dave have, I would think I was doing well to sell 5,000 copies. ( I have absolutely no interest in doing so)  Thus, I would need to charge ten times as much for a MH manual as I would for an apartment manual to realize the same profit. Our firm does buy books written by such organizations as the Practicing Law Institute that are quasi specific to MH chattel finance and the average price runs around $1,400.00 partly because of the limited market for such books.

None of that changes the value of learning what you don't know, or worse, what you are sure you know that is wrong. I am a very big believer in getting and paying for help when I need it, and do so regularly.

My suggestion is to get the book, and get it from the authors, rather than second hand. A relationship with them has value in and of itself.

Jeffrey H. · Answer

I have both the MHU Due Diligence Manual and the Home Study Course.  As others have alluded the DD Manual ($200) is more pre-purchase activities, and the Home Study Course ($500) is very much about post purchase.  Granted, there is like 20 pages of overlap but they are both very lengthy books.  Buying the DD Manual before buying a park is a $200 insurance policy that will save you much more than - guaranteed.

After reading both and keeping both as a reference I am happy with them and would not hesitate recommending someone buy both.

I bought mine directly from the MHU website so I wouldn't know about tangent commercial offerings they may have on eBay.  I know these guys dabble in RV Parks too so there could be other stuff out there.  If you're bot buying this directly from the website or sure it's directly from them you might be getting an older version.  They do update their materials periodically.

Account Closed · Answer

You don't know what you don't know.

Account Closed · Answer

@Kevin Schulte  I would just check with Brandon Reynolds @ MHU and get clarification on any of the differences between the manuals .

MHP info is fairly unique and specific and you run into things you may not with other asset classes. This is a specialized invest class and should be treated as such.  Good luck!

Kevin Schulte · Answer

@Jeffrey H.

@Chris Reeves

Just had to here it from someone who has read it! thanks!

Anna Catron · Answer

@Kevin Schulte, yes, me too!!  Did you buy the book?  Did you buy a park?  Please fill us in!

Noel R. · Answer

@Kevin Schulte Did you go ahead with the purchase of the DD manual? How is the adventure into MHP going? Love to hear an update.

Matt Boettinger · Answer

due diligence starts once you are under contract. Make a promise to yourself that you will purchase it once you get a park under contract.

"Must have" due dilligence manual?

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