Anyone else having problems with LMHA Section 8 in Toledo???

[Andrew Fidler]

Toledo's Lucas County Metropolitan Housing Authority...LMHA which administers the Section 8 program seems to have had a difficult 2016 and 2017 doesn't seem much better.

I've been renting to Section 8 for seven years now, I still have my original tenant in fact, and normally I find great satisfaction in renting to good tenants and working with the bureaucracy that comes with a government program...I had 10 properties rented section 8 at one point and have slowly prioritized standard rentals over the program and now am seeing blatant issues with their operations causing me to move away from considering their tenants.

Delays in the program: We used to have 5 business day's delay for new-tenant vouchers to be reviewed and processed for inspection but have been going weeks before we hear anything. I signed a voucher for a home on November 7th and it was turned in on November 8th. I ended the offer to rent to the tenant on December 1st and didn't receive any communication from LMHA until December 15th when they tried to schedule the inspection...that's 45 days to process a voucher.

We had another home pass inspection on November 5th and we hadn't "stopped and waited" for LMHA because it had never been a major issue before so we let the tenant move in...LMHA announced on November 15th that the tenant voucher needed to be re-evaluated by LMHA and that the rent rate needed to be adjusted (The story was the "Administrator A" reviewed and approved it but since they had resigned, now we had to wait for "Administrator B" to do it. They completed the review of the voucher on December 3rd AND REFUSED TO COVER THE TENANT'S RENT FOR NOVEMBER because they didn't have LMHA permission to move in.

We had a home pass inspection on December 20th and still haven't received permission for the tenant to move in (January 3rd)...the tenant just had to pay for an additional month's rent at their old home and we are out another month without our rental occupied, incurring carrying costs, and risking vandalism. This place has been reviewed, passed inspection, and is just waiting for permission to move in so the lease can be signed and is sitting in purgatory.

Each time we have inquired about why there are massive delays we are told that yet another administrator has left the department. This Spring the inspection scheduler "Beverly" retired and the whole program moved to a 3rd party contractor out of California who now handles scheduling (with the expected miscommunication and inability to make quick decisions resulting).

I have been a supporter of LMHA and the Section 8 housing choice voucher program here in Toledo, Lucas County, Maumee, Perrysburg, and surrounding areas but the program really is now costing far more than we get out of it. I am very perturbed by the authoritarian way the program is managed currently, it feels like landlords are being purposefully ignored because we are profiting from the relationship (lets face it, everyone is...it's called business. LMHA gets a staff of a couple dozen people and a big budget to be bureaucratic, the tenant gets cost effective safe housing, and we get steady rent checks)

Does anyone else have these issues??? If you have a back door, please by all means let me know how to use it! (BTW I was told there was a Landlord training session in early 2016, did anyone know about it and did anyone attend?)

[Ben Clinger]

I can't comment on the bureaucracy, but thanks for the cautionary tales!

I was thinking of putting my property into the section 8 program to get around the new lead law, at least until my current tenant leaves. Have you ever had any issues passing the inspection?

[Andrew Fidler]

@Ben Clinger

Hi Ben, I just noticed your post.

Toledo just clarified their inspection criteria for section 8 houses and decided they wanted their cake and to eat it too...we don't have to have an interior inspection (since LMHA inspects that during their inspection), but we DO have to pay for a Lead Inspector contractor to visually inspect the exterior of the house and of course we DO have to pay the $45 fee (which is of course what this is all about).

LMHA of course inspects the outside of houses along with the inside so the whole lead inspection is redundant.

[Andrew Fidler]

We received this letter from Toledo LMHA Lucas County's Section 8 administrator.

I don't know if they had a data breach and a bunch of landlord and client personal information was stolen or if they lost their server and backups.

Definitely doesn't bode well for the organization having a smoother 2017.

Does anyone know who Tamela Shanks-Royston (Interim VP of HCV Program) vs Tonya Baird the Assistant VP of the HVC Program? Did we lose Tonya too?

I am down to five LMHA Section 8 houses and don't anticipate expanding that until they get their organization operating efficiently.

[Adam A.]

@Andrew Fidler I know a guy that's on the advisory board of LMHA. I will check and see what's going. 

Here is Section 8 new exterior lead inspection.

[Rebecca G.]

Andrew Fidler I decided to start allowing section 8 and it has been a nightmare. I wait well over a month before I hear any responses and then every single time they ask me to drop the rent. I have a large 3 bedroom property in west toledo with appliances and they will only approve $616 on rent even though there are 2 bedrooms here going for more. I know a girl who gets section 8 in south toledo on a two bed and they cover $750. So far, my experience with LMHA has not been pleasant.

[Andrew Fidler]

My section 8 rent rates are all over the map. Most of my 3/1 are a bit above $700 a month. 

Since LMHA started inspecting my properties every 9 months instead of 12 as was the norm before ~2013 I request a rent increase each year and so far have been pretty good about getting a 2-5% increase. 

I'm hoping they get a good director in place who wants to serve their customers (tenants who need safe houszing) and their vendors supplying that need (landlords) and operate an efficient and successful program serving our community. 

Feels like someone with political clout needs to realize the situation and start investigating delays and failures. If I am losing money on LMHA as a landlord then there should be 10x that number of good people losing their vouchers because they cannot stay in good standing with the excess failures the system has at present. 

[Andrew Fidler]

It's been 8 months, figured I'd provide an update the the Toledo / Lucas County Metropolitan Housing Authority, LMHA section 8 voucher program. (Housing Choice Voucher Program, HCVP)

Guys it's 180 degrees...I had TWO properties go from voucher to inspection to HAP contract/rental to direct deposit setup within 10 business days each. That's very acceptable and reasonable. 

I haven't been expanding my business with LMHA since the end of 2016 per my posts above so I don't know exactly what changed, but I expect the outsourcing of inspections to private industry + some executive level leadership + replacement of staff with new faces excited to serve the needs of HUD/Landlords/Those In Need has resulted in an agency I will develop more business with.

The HCVP will always be a double edged sword for landlords (See Section 8 Bible discussion) but for now I have discovered it is finally worth the effort to participate in the program.

I specialize in Toledo's transition neighborhoods, discounted houses on the edge of nicer areas but also on the edge of trash...the Section 8 program allows me to get long-term tenants who are a good business model provided they are consistently managed and visited/inspected for additional "visitors" (relatives and random dogs/cats) and damage/housekeeping which can destroy a home if left unchecked.

You need to know the rules, repair and renovate for long-term durability, prepare for inspections thoroughly and keep a team of contractors who will hold those standards...after 8 years we have been through a hundred inspections. I'm happy to discuss further with anyone who has an interest in Section 8 in Toledo.

[Tammy Timmons]

LMHA Mail issues: I get mail that's not within 3 days of postmark mail, dated top of form October 23 received November 6th that I had till the 15th to turn in my annual renewal forms. I did not move in my home till April why is the packet coming in October. They are not much help when it comes to making sure your home or landlord get as much as they can get for FMV. You think they would be more helpful but they just don't really care to do any extra. I had put in for extenuating circumstances form several time and never received a response. I need approval for 2 bedroom due to medical reasons. But I never heard a word.

[Andrew Fidler]

Hello Tammy, welcome to BP!

I am pretty experienced with S8 procedures, all of that experience is with our Toledo LMH team.

Are you leasing with a property manager in town? They should know the process super well and have their own contacts with leaders and managers to be able to ensure things run smoothly.

There is a weekly open-office time for residents to be able to sit down with their case manager (I think it's Weds, but I haven't seen the time printed out recently so it may have changed. Every voicemail in LMH seems to detail when this time is however!).

The experience of the housing provider is going to be the real challenge to getting you a set of keys to move in with...they have to qualify, pass inspection, sign a bunch of paperwork, and finally lease up and send everything into LMH. 

Reach out to us here if you need more assistance!