Unauthorized Tenant...

Unauthorized Tenant...

Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2016 · 87 posts · 29 votes

So I have a tenant who just moved out, but left her sister and husband behind in the property. Apparently they have been staying there for a couple months now. I found out because a tenant below alerted me to the fact that they had a dog in the property which isn't allowed. 

I was already headed to the property to secure it since the original tenant was supposed to be leaving and I was going to do a walk through. I got there and the husband was there. He asked for some time to get out, and said they were moving into new place they already signed up for in two weeks but had no where to go. I told him that they all had to go immediately. Wasn't giving any wiggle room. And thought I was getting somewhere, but the wife came home she called the police. 

The police told them I had to file for eviction of course and I couldn't just put them out. I had a feeling it was heading that way, so to keep things cool, I agreed to let them stay for the two weeks, paying a set fee per week, as long as they agreed to sign a document waiving any rights to stay effective Sept. 4. 

I still plan to file an eviction immediately against the original tenant and all unauthorized tenants first thing tomorrow. But seeing as how that can take some time I was hoping this agreement might expedite them leaving. Would an agreement like this cause any problems with eviction? 

My main thing is trying to ensure they don't trash the place while I'm sorting this out. They seemed like relatively nice people considering the circumstances, but you never know. Any thoughts would be appreciated. 

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Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
10y

All police jurisdictions I am aware of consider landlord tenant issues to be a civil matter and will under no circumstances get involved. They will always tell the landlord to go through the process of eviction. They do not want to waste their time trying to figure out which side is telling the truth or be involved in tenant issues.

You must evict.

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  • Investor · Buffalo, NY · Member since 2016 · 668 posts · 209 votes
    10y

    Their names are not on the lease. Agree to nothing and take no money, otherwise they are your new tenants. They are trespassing and must leave ASAP. Two weeks will turn into two months. Get your lawyer on this now.

  • Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes
    10y

    I would have legally kicked their asses to the curb.  I don't negotiate with terrorists.  The nerve of that heffa to call the cops!  

    Why didn't the police cite them for trespassing?

  • Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2016 · 87 posts · 29 votes
    10y

    @Yvette M. Unfortunately the laws protect these people. Because she has started receiving mail there, he said that she had the right to be there until I filed the eviction. I had even changed the locks already, but he went as far as to tell her they could kick the door in if I didn't give them the key. It's ridiculous the way the law is set up. The cops don't get it either. 

  • Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2016 · 87 posts · 29 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Account Closed:

    Their names are not on the lease. Agree to nothing and take no money, otherwise they are your new tenants. They are trespassing and must leave ASAP. Two weeks will turn into two months. Get your lawyer on this now.

     Sounds about right. I'm just going to start the eviction process tomorrow. 

  • Nashville, TN · Member since 2016 · 82 posts · 137 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Dewain J.:

    @Yvette M. Unfortunately the laws protect these people. Because she has started receiving mail there, he said that she had the right to be there until I filed the eviction. I had even changed the locks already, but he went as far as to tell her they could kick the door in if I didn't give them the key. It's ridiculous the way the law is set up. The cops don't get it either. 

     Changing the locks is unauthorized in an eviction scenario.  It is considered landlord harassment.  See this link for more information:  Illegal Evictions Can Get You In Trouble for Landlord Harassment

    Have you served notice to quit?  I think three days is allowable in this situation.

    If the unauthorized tenants remained after doing so, you can get a real estate attorney to write a legal but threatening letter for a three-day notice to quit.  This letter can be served by a process server for a fee, or by you if you feel it is safe.  This will likely cost one billable hour, plus retainer, plus process server fees.  The letter escalates situation, and the unauthorized tenants may move out to avoid being charged in court.

    A real estate attorney can also guide you in filing for eviction.  They can file the same day as the letter if you don't feel the letter will change the situation.  This will likely cost significantly more.  But they will keep you legal, and have the experience to know exactly what to do in this situation.  The attorney will help you recover their costs in addition to any rent costs.  (Whether or not the people can pay is a different story, but a court ordered judgment in your favor significantly helps the matter.)

    A consultation with a real estate attorney is free of charge.  You can call as many as you like until you find one that you feel comfortable with, and feel is most experienced in evicting unauthorized tenants in your state.

    Please go back and give the unauthorized tenants the key to the new lock, or restore the old lock which they have the key to.  You are in violation of the law until you do so.

  • San Jose, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    10y

    If you have a rental agreement to let them stay, then you can't file for eviction.  So, don't agree to let them stay if they sign something.  

    What worked for me to avoid problems and court, was to tell them if they vacate, remove all their stuff from the property, leave it undamaged and clean it up, that I'll hand them their full deposit when they give me the keys.  And that this way there's no eviction or judgment on their credit report.

    They will normally (every time for me) find somewhere to go, once they realize you aren't going to let them stay.  And the promise of their security deposit means cash they need.  They'll try and get you to extend their time frame, but don't let them.

    I had to evict some inherited tenants, and I used the above technique.  They didn't leave the place really clean normally, but at least they removed all their junk, even if a lot of it ended up piled around the garbage bins LOL.  I still gave them their security deposit money. They were out and there was no major damage.  We felt like that was a "win" for us.

  • Oak View, CA · Member since 2016 · 32 posts · 21 votes
    10y

    Responding officer was wrong. If they're not on the lease they are trespassing squatters- to be kicked out at will.

    I would have asked for their shift commander. However, since you signed an agreement with the new people, only thing to do now is to wait 2 weeks, evict, or bribe them to get out. Given my experience, I'd file eviction papers in the morning.

  • Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    10y

    All police jurisdictions I am aware of consider landlord tenant issues to be a civil matter and will under no circumstances get involved. They will always tell the landlord to go through the process of eviction. They do not want to waste their time trying to figure out which side is telling the truth or be involved in tenant issues.

    You must evict.

  • Greg H.Pro Member
    Moderator
    Broker/Flipper · Austin, TX · Member since 2013 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    10y

    @Marc W.

    As Greg indicated, the police would treat this as a civil matter with an eviction as the remedy unless as in this case an agreement is reached. There are scores of cases in the legal community where people have broken into properties and set up residence and the only option was to evict. 

    @Dewain J.

    I am not sure at this point you have the right to evict anyone. The original tenant has vacated and with the agreement signed you created a new agreement(lease) and since they have paid and it is not September 4th.  On what grounds would you file an eviction ?

  • Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2016 · 87 posts · 29 votes
    10y

    @Greg H. I haven't signed any agreement, (I thought better of it), and the original tenants lease is not expired until the end of the month anyway. I also did not take any payment.  So going to evict the original tenant, (and all unauthorized tenants). The person currently there is the tenants sister and her husband. 

  • Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2016 · 87 posts · 29 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Marc W.:

    Responding officer was wrong. If they're not on the lease they are trespassing squatters- to be kicked out at will.

    I would have asked for their shift commander. However, since you signed an agreement with the new people, only thing to do now is to wait 2 weeks, evict, or bribe them to get out. Given my experience, I'd file eviction papers in the morning.

     Because the sister allowed her to stay there, and was actually charging her, I have to evict. She was receiving mail there as well. 

  • Reno, NV · Member since 2016 · 328 posts · 97 votes
    10y

    How long had the (squatter) sister been staying there before you realized it?

  • Nashville, TN · Member since 2016 · 82 posts · 137 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Dewain J.:
    Originally posted by @Marc W.:

    Responding officer was wrong. If they're not on the lease they are trespassing squatters- to be kicked out at will.

    I would have asked for their shift commander. However, since you signed an agreement with the new people, only thing to do now is to wait 2 weeks, evict, or bribe them to get out. Given my experience, I'd file eviction papers in the morning.

     Because the sister allowed her to stay there, and was actually charging her, I have to evict. She was receiving mail there as well. 

     I can say my address is the Pizza Hut down the street, but it doesn't mean I have the right to live there unauthorized.  "Receiving mail" is an invalid argument.

    I agree with others, that your agreement with them to stay until September 4th, verbal or otherwise, has temporarily invalidated your ability to file for eviction NOW.  But September 5th, it's fair game.

    The pain for eviction is high for tenants.  Nobody wants that on their credit report.  But the pain is also high for you - the relationship is so sour now that they're likely to never pay rent again.  So now you have a property with a loan and no cashflow to pay it.

    "Cash for keys" will give them some motivation to move out.  Agree that once they move out and turn over the keys, you'll give them the security deposit.  Or maybe a $500 payoff.  That's going to be cheaper than hiring an attorney and filing for eviction.

    If they don't agree with that, file for eviction with a real estate attorney on September 5th.  You can call for consultations and explain the situation in the meantime.  The more preparation you put in now, the easier the process will be later.

    In the mean time, DO NOT SELF-EVICT.  You're exposing yourself to breaking landlord laws.  You have more time and patience and opportunity for future tenants than your squatters ever do.  Use that to your advantage.

  • Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    10y

    Do not offer cash for keys now, You will be throwing money away since they have already said they will leave without attempting to extort. Just tell them you intend to evict if they stay one minute past midnight on the 31st. Unlike you I would not allow them to stay beyond the tenants lease for any reason without serving the eviction notice. Give them a 24 hour notice to inspect prior to the 31st and tell them they will be responsible for any damage.

  • Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2016 · 87 posts · 29 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Yvette M.:

    How long had the (squatter) sister been staying there before you realized it?

     According to a tenant beneath them a couple months. She basically admitted that she would clear out whenever a visit (maintenance or a case worker was coming) to avoid being detected. 

  • Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2016 · 87 posts · 29 votes
    10y

    @Keith Goodwine @Thomas S.

    I never did an agreement, I was only considering it. I filed for Notice to Quit today, got a court date and notified them. Told them I wouldn't take any cash or anything like that. So hopefully they still leave on the 4th and I don't have to go to court and deal with all that nonsense. 

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