Odd Fellow Agent or Valuable Team Member: How Do You Decide?

Odd Fellow Agent or Valuable Team Member: How Do You Decide?

Katy, TX · Member since 2020 · 86 posts · 45 votes

Ok, so as the day approaches where I take all my research and finally start making offers, I have been putting together my team for my BRRRR goals. Everyone is at the starting line except my investment-friendly agent. I know a guy (lol) and he's been great when we've looked for our own rental houses. He was great with answering questions when I had them almost 2 years ago when I decided I would become an investor. The more I talked to him about investing the more I realised he knew about it and did a little himself. Not to mention he's a marketing genius. We look forward to his Christmas photo on Santa's lap that he sends out every year reminding us it's always a good time to buy.

Now, with that being said, there were some incidents with him that at the time I thought were unprofessional. For example, I received a text message during the middle of a weekday saying he had a hot deal and needed someone to invest with him 10K each. I called him no more than 30 minutes later and he said don't worry about it he already found someone for the deal and thanks anyway. At the time I knew absolutely nothing about investing and I thought it was brash and unprofessional to just text someone for 10k randomly. Two years and thousands of research hours later, I know a heck of a lot more and realize that he probably just sent out a mass text to investors he knew which is how you play the game, right? I haven't really spoken to him since that and we used a family friend to purchase our house recently instead of him because it put a bad taste in my husband's mouth.

I say all this because I am in the process of getting my own real estate license but I really feel like I need someone a hell of a lot more seasoned than I am on these first couple of deals to learn the ropes. I really enjoyed this specific agent's tenacity and he was able to always tell me what I needed to hear and give me a very rough estimate of the things that might need to be replaced on all of the walk-throughs we ever did. How do you know if you have a good real estate investment friendly agent or just some douchebag that's trying to grab deals out from under you for his buddies?

To be candid, I feel really silly based on the things I discussed with him regarding investing as if I knew what the heck I was talking about back then. The numbers that I was giving him on properties to find for me were nowhere close to what would be positive cash flow and I know that now. So I kind of wonder now if he thought I was just one of the umpteen million people who must tell him they're investors but couldn't even tell you the definition of ROI or cash flow.

As always thank you in advance for your insight, BP friends!

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Real Estate Broker · Portland, OR · Member since 2019 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
6y

OK, so you've taken 2 years of this guy's time.  He's sent you some stuff to look at and zero bites from you.

Basically, you've done nothing to allow him to make a commission for 2+ years.

Why would you think you should be higher on his priority list?

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  • Brenden MitchumBusiness Member
    Rental Property Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 872 votes
    6y

    Hey @Kristyn Grimes

    Not sure I have the answer here but would love to work through this issue with you because it sounds incredibly interesting. 

    But just to make sure I am understanding correctly from the start: The only reason you dropped this agent was because of that text he sent? Or was there something else? I do agree that he probably sent out a mass text to "investors" but I also think that he should have had two separate investor buckets and you should not have been in the bucket that text got sent to. I also believe there should have been a bit more info than "Give me $10k. I have a great deal." As a new investor who is weary of being taken advantage of, this would scare me too.

    My other question is in regards to you not closing any deals with him. If you were not properly analyzing deals at the time and would not have cash-flowed if you had purchased one, there were likely plenty of opportunities for him to sell you a crap deal, right? As an agent, I do not analyze deals for my clients so if they are interested in a property I do everything I can to get them into that property. I do give them my opinion on the condition and necessary repairs but I stay away from the numbers for liability reasons. So, why did you not close any deals with him prior to him sending that text?

    I apologize for all the questioning but hopefully we can sort of get at the root of the problem and that might help you find your answer. Maybe?

  • Rental Property Investor · Boston, Massachusetts (MA) · Member since 2016 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    There is an in-between to those two categories you know: "useful person to keep in touch with"

  • Real Estate Broker · Portland, OR · Member since 2019 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    OK, so you've taken 2 years of this guy's time.  He's sent you some stuff to look at and zero bites from you.

    Basically, you've done nothing to allow him to make a commission for 2+ years.

    Why would you think you should be higher on his priority list?

  • Katy, TX · Member since 2020 · 86 posts · 45 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Brenden Mitchum:

    Hey @Kristyn Grimes

    Not sure I have the answer here but would love to work through this issue with you because it sounds incredibly interesting. 

    But just to make sure I am understanding correctly from the start: The only reason you dropped this agent was because of that text he sent? Or was there something else? I do agree that he probably sent out a mass text to "investors" but I also think that he should have had two separate investor buckets and you should not have been in the bucket that text got sent to. I also believe there should have been a bit more info than "Give me $10k. I have a great deal." As a new investor who is weary of being taken advantage of, this would scare me too.

    My other question is in regards to you not closing any deals with him. If you were not properly analyzing deals at the time and would not have cash-flowed if you had purchased one, there were likely plenty of opportunities for him to sell you a crap deal, right? As an agent, I do not analyze deals for my clients so if they are interested in a property I do everything I can to get them into that property. I do give them my opinion on the condition and necessary repairs but I stay away from the numbers for liability reasons. So, why did you not close any deals with him prior to him sending that text?

    I apologize for all the questioning but hopefully we can sort of get at the root of the problem and that might help you find your answer. Maybe?

    Good morning, Brenden!

    Thank you for your in depth response. So prior to this text he and I had briefly chatted about investment rental properties because it was something he brought up and the conversation more or less was "this is what I'm doing as an agent because I have access to the MLS to see what's coming up before the general public and have you guys ever considered real estate investing?"

    Subsequently, my husband and I decided that investing may be something that we would start to investigate and had told him so, but also that we are due diligence people and don't just jump out and make decisions with tens of thousands of dollars on the line. 3 days later we got that text. The more I reflect back on it and knowing that he's a type A go-getter, I think when I said we were interested in investing he went ahead and just threw us in that bucket.

    As far as not closing any deals with him, we had only secured him as our agent because we were looking for a rental property for ourselves. Meaning we were combining households before we got married and he is an expert in the area we were moving to. Essentially we hadn't begun the process of putting together our spreadsheet that runs the numbers, knew what kind of properties we were looking for, or even how to be a proper and ethical landlord. Perhaps it was my fault for the lack of clarity that I didn't tell him that we needed to secure all those things before going ahead. I guess the moral of that story is do not give anyone the green light until you're actually ready to hit the gas?

    And full disclosure after reading what I posted yesterday I gave him a call. We made some small talk and I slowly worked my way into asking him about his latest investments and mentioned that I was pretty much ready to go. He launched right into mentioning the neighborhood he was sending me automatic lists for and if we were still interested in that area. 5 minutes after that he says that he wouldn't invest in that area because it's been such a hot neighborhood to flip homes that the majority of the residents are renters and so property values are starting to decline...? To be honest, he confuses me and just gives me a weird feeling because why would he encourage me to invest in an area that he knows is already oversold? But on the other hand he knows absolutely everyone and even mentioned that once I got my license he could mentor me or find someone who would. 

    I thought finding a general contractor was going to be harder than finding a good agent. I'd also like to say that I wish I hadn't said scumbag realtor. He's definitely not a scumbag and that was super unprofessional of me. Moderators, if you're reading, I'd totally be okay with you editing my title from scumbag to odd fellow LOL.

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    6y

    not sure your point but this is what burns out agents on buyers..  buyers are liars  sellers are liars.. you used him for information he sends you one text you found weird and then you buy through another agent.. if i was that agent I would just erase you from my contacts your totally reading way to much into things and assumptions etc.

    But like my dad said when we owned our brokerages and some agents are just flat jerks and some are sweet as can by and everything in the middle.. my dad said just put a $ sign on them.. if they bring you dollars who cares dont take it personal.

    I just close a deal yesterday with a wholesale company that I totally flamed here on BP because of rotten deals in Texas but i used them in another market since they brought me the highest price..  the guy wanted to know what i was doing even talking to him.. to me its just $ sign.

  • Katy, TX · Member since 2020 · 86 posts · 45 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Steve Morris:

    OK, so you've taken 2 years of this guy's time.  He's sent you some stuff to look at and zero bites from you.

    Basically, you've done nothing to allow him to make a commission for 2+ years.

    Why would you think you should be higher on his priority list?

     Morning Steve,

    Always nice to see your name come up in a thread. :) I think you may have misunderstood my situation. This all happened in a couple of weeks two years ago. I haven't spoken to him in almost that long because we were settled and had a new baby. He's gotten plenty of money from us from securing a lease for us on behalf of our old landlord and the 3 referrals from us he's closed on with median home prices of $375k. I just posted my response to another BP member that might clear things up. 

    -K

  • Real Estate Broker · Portland, OR · Member since 2019 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    OK, I'm just saying if you want a broker on your team (I"m not entirely convinced you do) that there is a cost.

    If he's a good broker with an inside deal, he has his list prioritized by who gets to see stuff first.

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Steve Morris:

    OK, I'm just saying if you want a broker on your team (I"m not entirely convinced you do) that there is a cost.

    If he's a good broker with an inside deal, he has his list prioritized by who gets to see stuff first.

    LIke Paul Harvey now the rest of the story  LOL..  

  • Real Estate Broker · Portland, OR · Member since 2019 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    You have no idea how much it pains me to defend brokers as a homogenous class. 

    But ya gotta make money you wanna survive.

  • Tony AngelosPro Member
    Real Estate Agent · Member since 2019 · 192 posts · 131 votes
    6y

    @Kristyn Grimes I noticed you said "how do you find someone not trying to grab deals out from under you?" The reality is, if your agent is an investor, like an actual investor that routinely does deals, they are also your competition. And like @Brenden Mitchum said, he doesn't run numbers or anything because at the end of the day, you are the investor. Buying investment property isn't different than buying an owner occupied house in terms of the steps so ultimately you just need someone competent, responsive, who you connect with and who does what they say they will do. You are the investor, and it is up to you to determine if the property shown to you hits the numbers you want to hit.

  • Real Estate Broker · Portland, OR · Member since 2019 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y
  • Katy, TX · Member since 2020 · 86 posts · 45 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

    not sure your point but this is what burns out agents on buyers..  buyers are liars  sellers are liars.. you used him for information he sends you one text you found weird and then you buy through another agent.. if i was that agent I would just erase you from my contacts your totally reading way to much into things and assumptions etc.

    But like my dad said when we owned our brokerages and some agents are just flat jerks and some are sweet as can by and everything in the middle.. my dad said just put a $ sign on them.. if they bring you dollars who cares dont take it personal.

    I just close a deal yesterday with a wholesale company that I totally flamed here on BP because of rotten deals in Texas but i used them in another market since they brought me the highest price..  the guy wanted to know what i was doing even talking to him.. to me its just $ sign.

    Overanalyzing = me in a nutshell

    Thank you for your honesty. Like Steve said, I'm not totally convinced I want him on my side or any agent. I'll soon have access to MLS myself and/or I can drive for dollars on my own. On the other hand, if I did choose to bring him on, I don't want him to feel like I'm using him if we have to dig through 40 deals before the numbers make sense to me because he's not running them (not his job). It must be maddening to have a client who just needs you to come open the door so they can do a quick walk through to decide if it's a good investment anyway. I don't want to burn anybody out, up to and including myself. Perhaps I should just wait on bringing an agent on board until I have my hands so full with managing my properties that I don't have time to look for the deals.

  • Katy, TX · Member since 2020 · 86 posts · 45 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Tony Angelos:

    @Kristyn Grimes I noticed you said "how do you find someone not trying to grab deals out from under you?" The reality is, if your agent is an investor, like an actual investor that routinely does deals, they are also your competition. And like @Brenden Mitchum said, he doesn't run numbers or anything because at the end of the day, you are the investor. Buying investment property isn't different than buying an owner occupied house in terms of the steps so ultimately you just need someone competent, responsive, who you connect with and who does what they say they will do. You are the investor, and it is up to you to determine if the property shown to you hits the numbers you want to hit.

    That's a great point about him being competition, Tony. Thank you for your insight.

  • Real Estate Broker · Northwest AUSTIN TX · Member since 2019 · 56 posts · 27 votes
    6y

    @Kristyn Grimes. Look, I’m an agent and investor myself. I have literally come across very short notice deals which are pretty good and I need a quick answer. While I can’t defend him being short with you,I think you should take it easy about the text thing

  • Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes
    6y

    This thread illustrated why investor agents should be charging buyers an upfront fee for working with them. Day I started doing it was the best day of my career.

  • Investor · USA · Member since 2015 · 325 posts · 447 votes
    6y

    @James Wise

    Can you talk more about your fee structure? I am constantly asked about “picking my brain”, taking me out to lunch, or some other way to get free info. There have been a few really rewarding experiences with some folks I have helped along the way but 99% of folks want me to entertain them.

  • Brenden MitchumBusiness Member
    Rental Property Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 872 votes
    6y

    @Kristyn Grimes

    Oh man this thread has kind of ran away from us a bit haha

    Well, it sounds like you have found your answer. I can't say I agree with what most people are saying here, but then again I am a new agent so am not "burnt out" yet. All I can say is find someone who's in it not just for the money but also to help people. If they are only motivated by the money they will be a go-getter, but what you want is a go-giver. 

    That being said, the moral of the story here is that you can be that agent you're looking for. This is why I got my license. I am always happy to help out new buyers or really anyone that others might feel are "wasting their time." Yes, this takes some unpaid work on the front end but I enjoy the process of helping a new investor narrow down their criteria and hone in on what they really want. This seems to work much better than just getting frustrated with their constant questions and concerns. But then again, I have the time for this. 

    Please, feel free to shoot me a message anytime if you want to chat more on the subject or if you have any questions!

  • Investor · Marietta, GA · Member since 2017 · 5 posts · 3 votes
    6y

    Kristyn,

    After 30+ years as a licensed broker, I've found the best deals aren't found by another agent.  Depending on your situation- you might want to look for sellers on your own.  The license isn't the answer. All of the agents on this forum will tell you- it's hard work and connecting with people that gets you leads.

  • Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Kai Van Leuven:

    @James Wise

    Can you talk more about your fee structure? I am constantly asked about “picking my brain”, taking me out to lunch, or some other way to get free info. There have been a few really rewarding experiences with some folks I have helped along the way but 99% of folks want me to entertain them.

    I make analysis videos.....Folks can pick how many properties they'd like me to analyze and buy the appropriate package. 1 property, 3 pack, 4 pack, 10 packs etc...Price varies based upon how large of a package they buy but generally speaking we are around the price of a general home inspection. 

    When making the videos and working with them I get their goals, wants, needs, budget and then find a property(s) based upon what they've told me as well as answer any general questions they've got. If they don't buy a package I do not work with them in a buyer's agent capacity or provide them any insight other than the free content that I put out on sites like this and my other media outlets. 

    Many agents get scared to do this because they think they won't get clients. If you've got a good product and are properly marketing yourself the clients are endless. I've sold over $200M to investors with an average price below $100k per transaction. Best business decision of my life.

  • Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Kai Van Leuven:

    @James Wise

    Can you talk more about your fee structure? I am constantly asked about “picking my brain”, taking me out to lunch, or some other way to get free info. There have been a few really rewarding experiences with some folks I have helped along the way but 99% of folks want me to entertain them.

     By the way the "pick my brain" line is hilarious ....I've got over 100k followers on social media so I'd get schmo's offering to buy me a coffee about 25x a day. Every. Single. Day. All for the right to "pick my brain." LOL bruh you think that I am going to take hours out of my day to lay out my life's work to you for a $3.00 coffee and the hope that you'll buy a property from me sometime in my life? GTFO. If I was that cheap why the hell would you even want my advice? You don't ask the kid flipping burgers resume writing tips do you?

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @James Wise:
    Originally posted by @Kai Van Leuven:

    @James Wise

    Can you talk more about your fee structure? I am constantly asked about “picking my brain”, taking me out to lunch, or some other way to get free info. There have been a few really rewarding experiences with some folks I have helped along the way but 99% of folks want me to entertain them.

     By the way the "pick my brain" line is hilarious ....I've got over 100k followers on social media so I'd get schmo's offering to buy me a coffee about 25x a day. Every. Single. Day. All for the right to "pick my brain." LOL bruh you think that I am going to take hours out of my day to lay out my life's work to you for a $3.00 coffee and the hope that you'll buy a property from me sometime in my life? GTFO. If I was that cheap why the hell would you even want my advice? You don't ask the kid flipping burgers resume writing tips do you?

    Jim as you know I was and am pretty clueless on social media and u tube stuff etc.. which is my big miss.. had no clue it was so profitable ( u tube channel)  should have started one years ago.. But back to my point when i first got on BP which was only my second time on social media my first of all things was the Australian version of BP..   since they were buying US property like mad.  Point is I fell for the let me buy you lunch line.. I did it probably half a dozen times in the first 2 or 3 months on BP.. and as lunch would wrap up the folks inviting me would give me the puppy dog eyes or not really ask for the check in a authoritative manner and well I just ended up buying lunch.. Only time i made the person pay who invited ME was an attorney who wanted to talk about redemption rights in Oregon.. :)  And well i just dont drink coffee other than early morning.. I had another guy who wanted to have drinks but of course told me it would be dutch.. he was on BP had a property trying to sell but had to meet and have drinks and wanted to be friends before he would divulge the information.. I just told him i have plenty of friends not interested..

    I have gotten good response though when I will let folks pick my brain for the Chairty we set up  aheroshome  dot org  for the charity I will jump on the line and help folks and let them ask anything they want.. I just helped one investor in Nashville for instance on how to research hidden lots.. and she found one straight away in the right venues there is HUGE money in finding build able lots that are hidden on OLD plats and not easily found.

  • Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 30k+ posts · 20k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
    Originally posted by @James Wise:
    Originally posted by @Kai Van Leuven:

    @James Wise

    Can you talk more about your fee structure? I am constantly asked about “picking my brain”, taking me out to lunch, or some other way to get free info. There have been a few really rewarding experiences with some folks I have helped along the way but 99% of folks want me to entertain them.

     By the way the "pick my brain" line is hilarious ....I've got over 100k followers on social media so I'd get schmo's offering to buy me a coffee about 25x a day. Every. Single. Day. All for the right to "pick my brain." LOL bruh you think that I am going to take hours out of my day to lay out my life's work to you for a $3.00 coffee and the hope that you'll buy a property from me sometime in my life? GTFO. If I was that cheap why the hell would you even want my advice? You don't ask the kid flipping burgers resume writing tips do you?

    Jim as you know I was and am pretty clueless on social media and u tube stuff etc.. which is my big miss.. had no clue it was so profitable ( u tube channel)  should have started one years ago.. But back to my point when i first got on BP which was only my second time on social media my first of all things was the Australian version of BP..   since they were buying US property like mad.  Point is I fell for the let me buy you lunch line.. I did it probably half a dozen times in the first 2 or 3 months on BP.. and as lunch would wrap up the folks inviting me would give me the puppy dog eyes or not really ask for the check in a authoritative manner and well I just ended up buying lunch.. Only time i made the person pay who invited ME was an attorney who wanted to talk about redemption rights in Oregon.. :)  And well i just dont drink coffee other than early morning.. I had another guy who wanted to have drinks but of course told me it would be dutch.. he was on BP had a property trying to sell but had to meet and have drinks and wanted to be friends before he would divulge the information.. I just told him i have plenty of friends not interested..

    I have gotten good response though when I will let folks pick my brain for the Chairty we set up  aheroshome  dot org  for the charity I will jump on the line and help folks and let them ask anything they want.. I just helped one investor in Nashville for instance on how to research hidden lots.. and she found one straight away in the right venues there is HUGE money in finding build able lots that are hidden on OLD plats and not easily found.

    lol can't stand the folks that are out here thinking they need to be friends to do business. Dude I am here to feed my family, not meet buddies. You don't try to be friends with the guy who made your iPhone or the guy who is selling you a car. Same thing in real estate really. Most people who overcomplicate it are never going to result in a paycheck for the operator so I eliminated all of those distractions once I took a large slice of my market.

    What I do with all people who reach out is simple. This is the product and service I offer. This is the price. Buy it or don't. End of story. I am not your buddy. I don't want to go to dinner with you and your wife. I don't want you to buy my kid a baseball card etc... I offer a product and service that I have confidence in. It's the folks who don't have confidence in their product and or service that think they need to jump through hoops or play buddy buddy with everyone.

  • Investor · USA · Member since 2015 · 325 posts · 447 votes
    6y

    @James Wise

    You and I are cut from the same cloth. I am not looking for buddies. I don’t even have time for the friends I have.

    I shy away from telling people I invest so much that it’s not on my social or any other form of advertising. I get tired of the constant tire kickers. Put a price on what I am worth is a good idea. It would probably cut down the amount of folks who want “advice”.

    I have watched your channel. I have been messing with the idea for a while. Thanks for the feedback.

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