Toledo, OH

[Shane Miller]

We are new to real estate investing and are considering the Toledo, OH market. Does anyone know about how long it takes to rent in this market? We are looking at properties in the 43612 zip.

[Engelo Rumora]

Originally posted by @Adam A.:

UPDATE - The Toledo city council will vote on current version of the lead paint legislation  next Tuesday 7/19.  Council Sandy Spang and Rob Ludeman would like to introduce an alternative piece of legislation.  The legislation would get into effect in 12 months and would be much simpler which includes:

• 1-4 units and daycare centers
• Require a VISUAL inspection on the interior, the exterior and the drip line only. If the owner fails the visual inspection, they are required to provide a lead safe certificate by an independent lead inspector.
•   All visual inspections will be conducted by the Health Department.
• Enhanced lead educational material will created and widely distributed at daycare centers, pediatrician offices, natal units in hospitals, etc.
• The "Disclosures of Information on Lead-Based Paint and/or Lead-Based Paint Hazards"  must be signed and filed with the Health Department.

Had a meeting today with Megan from the the Toledo Board and the new proposal looks great.

After our meeting I had an urge to get into politics when I get older haha

I think it would be fun cursing folks out at these meetings for their ridiculous hidden agendas.

Crazy stuff how it's all structured hehe

Thanks and have a great day.

[Andrew Fidler]

I hope to attend the meeting next week, there needs to be provisions to get this away from city government...if a house has passes LMHA Section 8 inspection (which includes the visual inspection) that should suffice as proof of inspection...the same should count for private inspectors hired directly by the owner provided they are licensed.

Personally I'd like the City to put their money where their mouth is and open this up to all single family homes, all apartment units, all places of business where children may enter (bars and strip clubs are exempt I guess)...If we're concerned about children's health lets broaden this to all sources not just those who are easy to pick on.

I'm thrilled to see an opportunity for this whole lead issue to become reasonable...I've just been quietly watching the panic and planning on doubling my portfolio as investors run away from the area, then opening a lead inspection, abatement and siding/window company as my buddy Engelo suggested. It's only good business. 

Final thought- if the worst happens the there is a full blown investor-witch-hunt, then we will have no choice but to methodically go through, upgrade our buildings to the hilt, and weather the storm. I think we are all in agreement that whatever happens The Poor will bear the brunt of the costs but honestly guys, don't they always?

[Engelo Rumora]

Originally posted by @Andrew Fidler:

I hope to attend the meeting next week, there needs to be provisions to get this away from city government...if a house has passes LMHA Section 8 inspection (which includes the visual inspection) that should suffice as proof of inspection...the same should count for private inspectors hired directly by the owner provided they are licensed.

Personally I'd like the City to put their money where their mouth is and open this up to all single family homes, all apartment units, all places of business where children may enter (bars and strip clubs are exempt I guess)...If we're concerned about children's health lets broaden this to all sources not just those who are easy to pick on.

I'm thrilled to see an opportunity for this whole lead issue to become reasonable...I've just been quietly watching the panic and planning on doubling my portfolio as investors run away from the area, then opening a lead inspection, abatement and siding/window company as my buddy Engelo suggested. It's only good business. 

Final thought- if the worst happens the there is a full blown investor-witch-hunt, then we will have no choice but to methodically go through, upgrade our buildings to the hilt, and weather the storm. I think we are all in agreement that whatever happens The Poor will bear the brunt of the costs but honestly guys, don't they always?

Fun times ahead Andrew,

We have a ton of cheese ready if the mice get hungry hehe

Looking forward to buying up a storm if S#*% hits the fan :)

The rich get richer mate agreed with you 100%

It's the smaller folks that will get hit and not the big boys with hundreds of units.

Much success.

[Adam A.]

UPDATE - The Toledo city council announced in their last meeting on Tuesday 8/2 that they will vote on the new lead base proposal on 8/16/2016. There will be a town hall meeting on 8/8 on Jefferson street I'm not 100% sure of the address and time yet.

[Engelo Rumora]

Originally posted by @Adam A.:

UPDATE - The Toledo city council announced in their last meeting on Tuesday 8/2 that they will vote on the new lead base proposal on 8/16/2016. There will be a town hall meeting on 8/8 on Jefferson street I'm not 100% sure of the address and time yet.

Keeps getting extended.

I'm eager to learn when we will all officially be out of business haha

Thanks mate

[Jim Moody]

This is serious and anyone who suggests otherwise is not being genuine . I caution any investor who wants to buy in Toledo, which is a really good market to invest in, that they should insist that every house be certified leadfree before they purchase it. At the very least they should make a seller guarantee that the house will pass the lead certification process via an escrow funds or other acceptable method. Depending on the house you buy, new windows, exterior siding and more could be required. Legislation IS going to pass

[Ryan Pyle]

I agree with Jim.

[Adam A.]

UPDATE: If you have concerns and want to share your opinion, here is your chance:

Councilman Tyrone Riley

Toledo City Council District 1 Hosts Public Meeting on Proposed

Lead Safe Residential Rental Units Legislation

Monday, August 15, 2016, 6-8pm

Gesu Sullivan Center

2049 Parkside, Toledo, Ohio

Representatives available from Toledo-Lucas County Health Department, Advocates for Basic Legal Equality, Toledo Lead Poisoning Prevention Coalition, and Real Estate Investor’s Association

[Engelo Rumora]

This is very serious, same as anything else government related.

[Adam A.]

Town hall meeting today regarding lead base new city of Toledo law before voting:

1415 Jefferson    6-8 PM

[Fawaz Alkhaleefah]

@Adam A. i appreciate it if you keep us update Adam :)

[Adam A.]

@Fawaz Alkhaleefah - The Toledo meeting was very passionate and heated as councilman Sykes did NOT agree to amended councilman Ludeman proposal as I listed below. Sykes wants to keep the ordinance the way it is which is if the property passes VISUAL inspection, then a dust inspection (12 samples) will be performed. Of course, landlords are responsible for the expense which is $150-$300. This will include SFH, units 1-4 and children daycare.

Section 8 is excluded from all the above as it's already subjected to inspection. 

I spoke to several councilmen and they all advised to contact all other councilmen to support the Ludeman proposal. The more emails, phone calls and noise is made to support Ludeman proposal the better chance they'll accept it.  A new ordinance WILL PASS definitely and it's up to our community on how it's written. However, Sykes proposal is a step in the wrong direction because it targets RENTAL PROPERTIES only and NOT other owner occupants.  If a property fails the dust swipe Sykes proposal, remedy has to be done with a specialty Hazcorp company to replace windows, doors, etc. which will cost an average house about $10,000+

Why excluding owner occupant properties is a problem?

If your neighbor's exterior paint is chipping, it will definitely becomes your problem as you mow the lawn (for example). A 3 ft. Dripline from your property is needed for lead dust inspection and it will test positive, now it's your responsibility. 

Here is Sykes proposal:

 1760.02 Obligations for Residential Rental Properties and Family Child Care Homes

(a) It is a violation of this Chapter to allow the following conditions to exist in a

“Residential Rental Propertyor a Family child Care Home”: (1) “Deteriorated Paint Hazard,” (2) a

“Dust-lead Hazard,” or a (3) “Soil Hazard,” as defined in section 1760.04. Every Owner of

Residential Rental Property shall maintain such property free from these Hazards. Once a presumed lead hazard has been identified, that condition is to be remedied in accordance with the requirements of this Chapter. Termination of occupancy of any such Residential Rental Property shall not constitute compliance with the requirements of this Section.

(b) No Owner, Agent, real estate agent or broker, company, or any person or persons shall

rent lease, sublease, let, mortgage with right of occupancy, or otherwise allow the occupancy of any

Residential Rental Property, or provide child care services in a Family Child CareHome, as defined

in this Chapter, constructed prior to 1978 and which is subject to this Chapter, whether such use, or

occupancy is temporary or permanent, unless a “Lead-Safe Certificate” has been issued for such

Property.

(c) If a Residential Rental Property or a Family child Care Home has been issued a

“Residential Rental Property or Family Child Care HomeMaintenance Hazards Report,” a

“Residential Rental Property or Family Child Care HomeOwner’s Verification of Annual Residential

Rental Property or family Child Care HomeInspection” shall be filed with the Toledo Lucas County

Health Department annually, commencing one year from the date of issuance of “Lead-Safe

Certificate” for the next four (3) years.

(d) All provisions of this Chapter shall apply to Family Child Care Homes, as defined in this chapter.

Please feel free to contact me directly to email all Toledo city council emails as I can't list me here.

Ludeman Proposal:

• 1-4 units and daycare centers
• Require a VISUAL inspection on the interior, the exterior and the drip line only. If the owner fails the visual inspection, they are required to provide a lead safe certificate by an independent lead inspector.
• All visual inspections will be conducted by the Health Department.
• Enhanced lead educational material will created and widely distributed at daycare centers, pediatrician offices, natal units in hospitals, etc.
• The "Disclosures of Information on Lead-Based Paint and/or Lead-Based Paint Hazards" must be signed and filed with the Health Department.

[Adam A.]

Toledo city councilmen meeting TODAY at 4:00 PM.

Agenda: Lead Paint New Ordinance

Where: One Government Center,  Toledo, Ohio 43604 

Make sure you register your name at the podium to speak out.

------------------------

Why this new ordinance is extremely serious?

If your property fails the swipe dust test, it will labled "Lead House" and you have to disclose it when you sell it.

The city council does NOT care about the financial burden of property owners they have to bare or any other suggestions at this point. The only strategy NOW is to have them adapt councilman Ludeman proposal listed above.

[Adam A.]

To all of those who think that they'll cash in if the new Toledo lead paint ordinance passes, I regret to tell you that you're wrong. Here is another reason why:

(b) No Owner, Agent, real estate agent or broker, company, or any person or persons shall

rent lease, sublease, let, mortgage with right of occupancy, or otherwise allow the occupancy of any Residential Rental Property, or provide child care services in a Family Child Care Home, as defined in this Chapter, constructed prior to 1978 and which is subject to this Chapter, whether such use, or occupancy is temporary or permanent, unless a “Lead-Safe Certificate” has been issued for such Property.

This means that deals such as "Rent to Own", "Lease to Own", "Land Contracts", etc. are included in the Sykes proposal. Again, that's why it's important to email all city council and support the Ludeman proposal.  

[Luke King]

Thanks so much for these updates.  I'll be sure to write the council members.

[Engelo Rumora]

So it looks like we are all screwed...

:)

[Adam A.]

@Engelo Rumora - You knew the ordinance would pass. But I never thought these words would come out of the Dingo :) ...

[Engelo Rumora]

Originally posted by @Adam A.:

@Engelo Rumora - You knew the ordinance would pass. But I never thought these words would come out of the Dingo :) ...

And I'm so excited it did.

In times like these, there are so many opportunities that arise.

Check Craigslist when you get a moment.

Everyone is selling like hot cakes lol

It sucks that the criteria is not the same for other homes and that is a huge indiscrepancy

You want to join in on fighting the legislation?

My good mate owns this company and I already told him about this BS - https://www.fastadvocate.com/

hehe

Thanks

[Santosh Bhor]

@Jim Moody, @Fawaz Alkhaleefah, @Adam A.

Hi guys I was wondering if I should consider properties that are rented in 43607 as a prospective purchase also my properties are built before 1978 so if i buy them will my rentals will get abated...

I am not local to Toledo and landed on this post while searching here on BP and need honest opinion, also have been hunting for good property management that doesn't burn out of state investors.. 

[Adam A.]

@Santosh Bhor The Toledo lead ordinance doesn't call for abatement. I serve as a volunteer on the board of Lucas County Health Department Lead Task Force. Also, I'm a certified Toledo lead inspector and will be Ohio certified very soon. For more information about lead, you can contact me directly.

@Engelo Rumora & @Jim Moody  both have good reputation as being top property management owners in the Toledo area. 

[Santosh Bhor]

Thanks @Adam A. I will definitely connect with Jim and Engelo.... Does 43607 seem to be a good rental investment, the numbers look great to me and the properties have tenants in them with 2 yr leases but wanted a local investor advise ... 

[Adam A.]

@Santosh Bhor 43607 is a spotty zip code, however, I have a house there.  You can always try Trulia.com for saftey, if that's your concern.

[Engelo Rumora]

East of UT is good in the 43607 and a few pockets off of Hill Ave.

The rest is rough IMO

Thanks

[Santosh Bhor]

@Engelo Rumora Thanks for the info also i just PM'ed you... 

[Engelo Rumora]

Originally posted by @Santosh Bhor:

@Engelo Rumora Thanks for the info also i just PM'ed you... 

Thanks mate,

I'll reply asap

Busy days...